Immigrants costing taxpayers $16 to $23 Billion annually.

[rubecube]

But hey at least Rerun didn't go with an ethnic stereotype to prove he's not racist.

Congrats on representing those older, privately-bigoted, voluntarily misinformed white guys, who young white guys desperately hope they don't become.

[Shawnski]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I guess we should forget that reliance on the gold standard was a major factor in the Great Depression, or that it flies straight in the face of Keynesian economics.

The easy credit promoted of the "Roaring 20s" flew in the face of the gold standard.

Not that I like to quote Wikipedia as a source, this does summarize the situation:

In 1920–1921 there was an acute recession, followed by the sustained recovery throughout the 1920s. The Federal Reserve expanded credit, by setting below market interest rates and low reserve requirements that favored big banks, and the money supply actually increased by about 60% during the time following the recession. By the latter part of the decade "buying on margin" entered the American vocabulary as more and more Americans over-extended themselves to speculate on the soaring stock market and expanding credit. Very few expected the crash that began in 1929, and none suspected it would be so drastic or so prolonged.

Sound familiar? If you think that depression was big, you ain't seen nothing yet.... We are living through the exact same thing right now.

Thanks to Keynesian economics, ever increasing bubbles have and will develop. The Nasdaq bubble/crash, the recent housing bubble/crash and the soon to come US dollar crash from its current bubble.

Just because Keynesian economics has been the recent flavour of academics and has been pushed onto students for decades, does NOT mean it is correct.

When one looks at the whole picture, our current welfare/warfare culture is driven by that type of monetary policy, and it is propelling us to the edge of a financial cliff rapidly.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by Rerun

What? Because I disagree with Canada's currrent imigration policy because I don't feel that its working... now I'm a racist?

Where does racism come into this? I'm all for immigration...this country needs immigrants... but we need immigrants who are qualified to do the the jobs that we have a labour shortage in and in places/areas that are desparately crying for help. What we don't need is another cab driver in Toronto.

Are you saying our service and menial labour job market is saturated?

Maybe I am living in an alternate universe, but I don't see that, in Calgary at least.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

When I talk to or just listen to boomers, they always argue that they pay taxes for these services, the new immigrant that comes here at their 60s does not.

"If you want your parents to come to Canada, you pay for it!" Stuff like that.

Well they ran up the debt to record levels when they demanded those services, so obviously they didn't pay enough taxes.

If they would have paid enough taxes, we wouldn't have the debt we have now.

[Shawnski]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

People who support returning to the gold standard would consider that a beneficial feature!

OT: has anyone else noticed how so many pro-Ron Paul posts all sound the same? I'm not singling out Shawnski here (he's just the most recent example I've noticed), but I started reading his post and by paragraph two I thought, "Heh, this sounds like a Ron Paul post," and then BAM, look who shows up at the end! Is there a Ron Paul website where his supporters copy/paste form letters from? I find it eerie how they're all so similar, right down to referring to him as "Dr. Paul" consistently.

Oddly enough, I was exploring all this BEFORE I discovered Ron Paul. As a son of a baby boomer, I also lived through all of the decades since we came off the gold standard. It helps put things in perspective.

Heck you know from our past discussions that I would be right wing on my perspectives. That has changed. I am no longer looking at the right/left perspective as much as the statist/libertarian discussion. And I am definitely NOT a statist!

[Azure]

We shouldn't need to return to the gold standard to fix our problems.

Being accountable and fiscally responsible is possible without it.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Azure

Well they ran up the debt to record levels when they demanded those services, so obviously they didn't pay enough taxes.

If they would have paid enough taxes, we wouldn't have the debt we have now.

The amount of taxes was/is fine. How much more can a person pay?
It's the implementation of those tax dollars. Waste waste waste.

[Shawnski]

Originally Posted by Azure

We shouldn't need to return to the gold standard to fix our problems.

Being accountable and fiscally responsible is possible without it.

I haven't stated we need to return to a gold standard. Only what has occurred since it was abandonned.

And the likelihood of politicians being "accountable and fiscally responsible" is about -273 Celsius...

[MarchHare]

I'm no economics expert, but if the US did return to the gold standard, wouldn't that cause massive inflation of the value of gold (or deflation of the value of the US dollar)? How does that solve any of the problems of using a fiat currency?

Besides, it's not like the US government is just printing more bills to service their debts (the Zimbabwe model). The gold standard would do nothing to prevent the government from financing present spending by issuing bonds or T-bills to be paid in the future, which is exactly what they're doing now.

[Edit]
I typed this post before Shawnski replied that he's not advocating for a return to the gold standard. Many of Ron Paul's supporters (and IIRC Paul himself) have argued for this action.

[mikey_the_redneck]

Originally Posted by Azure

We shouldn't need to return to the gold standard to fix our problems.

Being accountable and fiscally responsible is possible without it.

I agree. Banks have always hoarded gold, and they can manipulate it the same as fiat money.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Shawnski

The easy credit promoted of the "Roaring 20s" flew in the face of the gold standard.

Not that I like to quote Wikipedia as a source, this does summarize the situation:



Sound familiar? If you think that depression was big, you ain't seen nothing yet.... We are living through the exact same thing right now.

Thanks to Keynesian economics, ever increasing bubbles have and will develop. The Nasdaq bubble/crash, the recent housing bubble/crash and the soon to come US dollar crash from its current bubble.

Just because Keynesian economics has been the recent flavour of academics and has been pushed onto students for decades, does NOT mean it is correct.

When one looks at the whole picture, our current welfare/warfare culture is driven by that type of monetary policy, and it is propelling us to the edge of a financial cliff rapidly.

Again, this is ignoring the fact that those countries who dropped the gold standard generally recovered faster from depressions/recessions. Do Ron Paul supporters seriously think that you can achieve stability in a capitalist by eliminating the federal reserve? Has it not become blatantly obvious to everyone that instability is inherent in the free market?

EDIT: Written before I saw Shawnski's reply

[mikey_the_redneck]

Originally Posted by valo403

NSFW!

Over the top...

Being critical of immigration policy is not racist....I thought an educated chap like you could see that.

[Shawnski]

Good discussion folks. Perhaps we should move this to another thread as to not sidetrack this one much further.

Have to head out for a while, but would certainly entertain this discussion further when I get back.

[mikey_the_redneck]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

I typed this post before Shawnski replied that he's not advocating for a return to the gold standard. Many of Ron Paul's supporters (and IIRC Paul himself) have argued for this action.

I have not read Ron Pauls book End the Fed, but I don't think he advocates a gold standard in the traditional sense. He always talks about "competing" currencies using silver and gold, and putting the Fed under the control of the government, which it currently is not, ....aside from appointing a few bankers to head the FOMC, and the chairman.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Actually, yes we do.

http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/l...shColumbiaHome

Ah... but thats Vancouver.... I said "another cab driver in Toronto"

Vancouver has one taxi per 1067 people (approx 4200 taxis)... where as Toronto has twice as many taxis as there is one for every 521 people (approx 10,700 taxis).

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Ah... but thats Vancouver.... I said "another cab driver in Toronto"

Vancouver has one taxi per 1067 people (approx 4200 taxis)... where as Toronto has twice as many taxis as there is one for every 521 people (approx 10,700 taxis).

The Vancovuer taxi market is a horrile and corrupt oligopoly system. There are a very limited number of licenses and people with licenses in suburb cities are not allowed to pick people out outside of their zone.

An individual license is now worth 1 million dollars. Drivers are forced to work for the license owners and pay them a rental fee. Meanwhile everytime they try to introduce new licesnses the existing license holders lobby the government not to. Picking up a cab at closing time in Vancouver is a nightmare, and much of the transit stops running before midnight.

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck

Over the top...

Being critical of immigration policy is not racist....I thought an educated chap like you could see that.

Of course it is... or at least it is to most of the phobic people on here.

No one dares criticize the immigration policy for fear they will be labeled "RACIST!!"... or at least you will be if you're "white".

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by rubecube

or that it flies straight in the face of Keynesian economics.

Communist!

[Rerun]

Originally Posted by rubecube

But hey at least Rerun didn't go with an ethnic stereotype to prove he's not racist.

Congrats on representing those older, privately-bigoted, voluntarily misinformed white guys, who young white guys desperately hope they don't become.

Oh?... did I misrepresent the facts?

One of the most publicized traits of New York cabbies is their ethnic diversity. Cab drivers form a virtual United Nations of countries and languages. Nine in 10 new drivers in the 1991 survey were immigrants from a total of 84 countries. Over 4 in 10 were born on the Indian subcontinent (Pakistan, Bangladesh and India). Africa, the Caribbean, the Middle East and republics of the former USSR were other common birthplaces.

http://www.schallerconsult.com/taxi/taxi1.htm

[tjinaz]

you are a racist and hate hispanics. If you are against illegal immigration in Canada you are a racist and hate asians?

Just want to make sure I have this right....