Mayweather Vs. Ortiz

[blankall]

Originally Posted by valo403

I wouldn't go so far as to say just as much as boxing, there's decade worth of corruption in boxing. It's in every corner of the sport. MMA will likely get there, fight sports attract that element, but boxing has it beat based solely on the amount of time it's had to turn itself filthy.

MMA is big business now. You're being naive if you think the owners of these companies aren't doing what's in the best interest of their own companies. I think MMA has even more potential for corruption in that each company is owned and directly controlled by a few individuals. In boxing there is some flexibility over who you get to manage you, where you fight, etc.. In MMA you join one of the major companies. You only fight who the major companies want you to fight. They decide when they want you to fight, where, etc...

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by Realtor 1

I have to dis agree.
1st, I havent started paying to watch him lose because he hasn't
2nd I think that when/if he does lose, he will be done in the sport and no longer fight so no body has to watch him lose on the regular.

I want the Floyd Manni fight more than anyone. Floyd brought up some great points he has not brought up before at his post fight conference.

//Off the floyd/manni talk some interesting things to note:

- Floyd makes at least 70 mill for every fight and quietly went on to say "who knows it might be 90". We all know floyd gives 50 cent a large chunk of money to bet for him.
- Floyd keeps 100% revenue as he is his own boss and Floyd can wake up and say I want to fight and the fight happens.
- Other fighters lose at least 30% to their promoters/boss and if they want to fight they are told when they have to fight.
- Floyd is not who so many of you really think he is. In one of his last 24/7s he handed out food to the homeless. People complained that it was boring so he amps it up and does the "TV" floyd for ratings. He claimed he has the largest sports deal in history right now and it is because he does things right.

Whether you like it or not, I bet Floyd is totally different off Camera. He knows the cocky floyd sells so runs with it while the red light is on.
Floyds up bringing was not pretty. Victor tried to win fans off of playing the "came from nothing". Floyd could have done the same but chose a different route.


Lastly, for those who follow Manni closely, (this isnt said as a debate but I dont follow him and want to know)
Is 100% of the pressure from media and questions on Floyd or has Manni said he will fight him at anytime. And when he said it as he been persistant on the fact or was it just a statement during 1 of 100 interviews.
I do not understand why we do not hear more of Manni challenging Floyd in the media. The way the media portrays that superfight is as if Manni is challenging every month. (He might be and I don't know hence me asking).

If you truly believe that i have a bridge to sell you. hehehe

I have been following Floyd since the 2001 fight against Corrales. The one and only time i have ever paid full price for his fights. He totally isn't that cocky or arrogant in real life, but he realizes that in order to sell his boring style to the public he has to play the biggest jerk in the sport so people will order his fights.

Manny has NEVER called out an opponent EVER. He will not start with Mayweather.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by blankall

MMA is big business now. You're being naive if you think the owners of these companies aren't doing what's in the best interest of their own companies. I think MMA has even more potential for corruption in that each company is owned and directly controlled by a few individuals. In boxing there is some flexibility over who you get to manage you, where you fight, etc.. In MMA you join one of the major companies. You only fight who the major companies want you to fight. They decide when they want you to fight, where, etc...

I'm not seeing a single element there that indicates corruption. By your logic the NHL is corrupt, all of those characteristics are present there.

[Travis Munroe]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

If you truly believe that i have a bridge to sell you. hehehe

I have been following Floyd since the 2001 fight against Corrales. The one and only time i have ever paid full price for his fights. He totally isn't that cocky or arrogant in real life, but he realizes that in order to sell his boring style to the public he has to play the biggest jerk in the sport so people will order his fights.

Manny has NEVER called out an opponent EVER. He will not start with Mayweather.

Im talking about in and out of the ring for each fight.
You still don't think its possible? What do you think he takes home after a fight including any deals leading up to it?

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by Realtor 1

Im talking about in and out of the ring for each fight.
You still don't think its possible? What do you think he takes home after a fight including any deals leading up to it?

Well you said he takes him at least $70million for each fight.....

He made $25mill for this one. So you really he believes he sells $35million in cds and tshirts?? hehehe

Pacquaio makes more than him.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Realtor 1

Im talking about in and out of the ring for each fight.
You still don't think its possible? What do you think he takes home after a fight including any deals leading up to it?

There are a lot of different ways to come up with a figure there. Are we subtracting all of the millions that are coming off of that off the top to a variety of other people and entities or are we just looking at the lump sum? What someone gets paid and what actually winds up in their pockets are very different things.

[united]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

Pacquaio makes more than him.

No he doesn't and here's why. It's not 70 mil, but it's more than Manny.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/17/sp...ted=all?src=tp

[Bertuzzied]

Boxing analysts have said that if Manny fought Floyd they would get approx $35mill/each.

[united]

People who find Floyd boring are the same people who think low-scoring hockey is boring, yell "shoot" when a team is on the powerplay, and think submission fighting is two gay dudes rolling around on the ground. It's fine - nothing wrong with it, it's their opinion.

His style isn't for everyone, and people who can't appreciate outstanding technical defence and fighting will find him boring, but he isn't going to change that.

[Travis Munroe]

Originally Posted by united

People who find Floyd boring are the same people who think low-scoring hockey is boring, yell "shoot" when a team is on the powerplay, and think submission fighting is two gay dudes rolling around on the ground. It's fine - nothing wrong with it, it's their opinion.

His style isn't for everyone, and people who can't appreciate outstanding technical defence and fighting will find him boring, but he isn't going to change that.

agreed, I personally find him entertaining to watch when he fights.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by united

No he doesn't and here's why. It's not 70 mil, but it's more than Manny.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/17/sp...ted=all?src=tp

Only if he fights more than Manny, which he hasn't.

Floyd has fought only 3 times since 2007. Pacman has fought 8 times. Pacquiao makes more money than Floyd.

[The Yen Man]

I think Mayweather makes more money per fight than Pacquiao, it's just the guy fights like once every year or so. So I'm sure Pacquiao makes more.

I'll have to admit, Mayweather is a pretty smart guy. He knows a lot of people pay money, wanting to see him knocked out. The more he hypes up his own record, the more people want to see it. He plays up the villian even more to fuel people's hatred of him. That's all just money in his pocket. People want to see him lose. And that's why he's not going to risk a fight with Pacquiao. I honestly think it's 50/50 on who wins, but why would Floyd risk it? The gravy train pretty much stops if he loses.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by united

People who find Floyd boring are the same people who think low-scoring hockey is boring, yell "shoot" when a team is on the powerplay, and think submission fighting is two gay dudes rolling around on the ground. It's fine - nothing wrong with it, it's their opinion.

His style isn't for everyone, and people who can't appreciate outstanding technical defence and fighting will find him boring, but he isn't going to change that.

Name 5 other technical defensive fighters in boxing right now that you would pay money to watch?

Pretty hard eh? why? because it's boring. The last true technical specialist was Pernell Whitaker. Boring as hell to watch too. Ask 1000 boxing experts if they would watch Pernell Whitaker or Julio Cesar Chavez? i bet 999 of them say Chavez.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by troutman

We don't have to "get over" anything. We don't like it. No one is saying you can't like it.

Jim Lampley will be on Jim Rome this morning.

You need to get over the fact its popular. Someone took a shot at boxing earlier inn the thread, and the first person to mention MMA in this thread was you, getting defensive. I'm not saying you have to like it, don't care if you do, but get over that its a popular mainstream sport.

Captain- Yah, the beauty of a sport is subjective of course.. But one of the reasons I love MMA is the continued evolution of a young sport. When you watch a sport grow before your eyes its very cool. New elements are always being incorporation, new ways to fight etc. Watching Anthony Pettis do a flying kick off the cage wall was nothing short of jaw dropping.

Bertuzzied - you're right, I was thinking of Jim Shaw. Abrum is an old crazy moron, but can't speak to his coruption. Shaw is all of those.

[troutman]

Mike Wallace: Pardon me for saying this, but you seem defensive.

Nathan Thurm: I'm not being defensive! You're the one who's being defensive! Why is always the other person who's being defensive? Have you ever asked yourself that? Why don't you ask yourself that?

http://snltranscripts.jt.org/84/84f60minutes.phtml

[blankall]

Originally Posted by valo403

I'm not seeing a single element there that indicates corruption. By your logic the NHL is corrupt, all of those characteristics are present there.

In the NHL, all teams play eachother in a set schedule. In MMA the promotion company owners decide who fights who, when they fight, etc.... Each fight can be carefully chosen to maximize revenues as opposed to just allowing several atheletes to compete in a sport.

This creates another level of opportunity for corruption. Rankings can be bought.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/blog/cag...urn=mma-244942

In additoin, you have the added element of international fighting organizations, which bring in a whole other level of corruptoin. This is within the context of a sport that naturally attracts elements of organized crime. Throw in the opportunity to make million and what do you have?

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/11/3...g-mma-in-japan

That is nothing like the NHL.

[Bertuzzied]

From that article United linked..

So Manny doesn't have to do anything but fight and show up to the press conferences and will make $30million, while Floyd for $40mil has to sell tshirts and hotdogs and pay for all the expenses up front including his opponents salary and avoid natural disasters.... hehehe


But, under this model, the expenses are Mayweather expenses, too, including advertising (radio spots, print ads, TV commercials), publicity (press tours, news conferences), sanctioning fees, legal contracts and insurance. For a fight of this magnitude, Schaefer said the expenses would run about $10 million.
First, Mayweather will write himself a check this week in the neighborhood of $25 million. This is similar, in concept, to the guaranteed money that other fighters receive from their promoters, but the check is much larger. Besides Mayweather, only Manny Pacquiao would command that much. What Mayweather earns in addition depends on the success of the event.
If 1.4 million or 1.5 million fans buy the fight — which is expected — Mayweather will make about $40 million, Schaefer said.
For comparison, consider Pacquiao. For his coming November fight, Top Rank has guaranteed $22 million and a percentage of other revenue for a total of $30 million, said Bob Arum, chairman of Top Rank. If the fight is canceled because of a natural disaster, for example, Pacquiao will still make $22 million, whereas Mayweather would stand to lose much of his total earnings.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

From that article United linked..

So Manny doesn't have to do anything but fight and show up to the press conferences and will make $30million, while Floyd for $40mil has to sell tshirts and hotdogs and pay for all the expenses up front including his opponents salary and avoid natural disasters.... hehehe

It's not like he's out there selling the hot dogs himself. He signs checks to people, and in return those people make him an extra 10 million dollars.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by blankall

In the NHL, all teams play eachother in a set schedule. In MMA the promotion company owners decide who fights who, when they fight, etc.... Each fight can be carefully chosen to maximize revenues as opposed to just allowing several atheletes to compete in a sport.

This creates another level of opportunity for corruption. Rankings can be bought.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/blog/cag...urn=mma-244942

In additoin, you have the added element of international fighting organizations, which bring in a whole other level of corruptoin. This is within the context of a sport that naturally attracts elements of organized crime. Throw in the opportunity to make million and what do you have?

http://www.bloodyelbow.com/2010/11/3...g-mma-in-japan

That is nothing like the NHL.

Fair enough, but you didn't say any of that before, you described conditions that mirror pretty much any professional sport.

Btw, the conditions you presented right there are about the same as boxing so I'm not really seeing your point.

[The Yen Man]

Realistically, it's like Mayweather is promoting himself. It sounds like rather than sign a fixed contract with a promotion company, he hires them as an outside party to do all the promotional activities, and then he pays them like a company would to external consultants.