2011 NCAA football thread

[valo403]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Why would you think Mack Brown is any different at all than any other college coach?

This is not a shot at him...not at all....it just is so obvious to me that this is systematic at each and every big time football school and no one is impervious IMO. The only team i believe that may not have much of this stuff going on is Notre Dame....and look at what they have become.

Why? Floyd has had three alcohol related arrests in the last 2 years, something that would get a regular student booted out of there without question, and instead his discipline has been handed over to the coaching staff.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Why would you think Mack Brown is any different at all than any other college coach?

This is not a shot at him...not at all....it just is so obvious to me that this is systematic at each and every big time football school and no one is impervious IMO. The only team i believe that may not have much of this stuff going on is Notre Dame....and look at what they have become.

Exactly

Every big time football school is doing this and Ohio State are just the scapegoats this time around. Auburn was in the middle of it last year, and USC was caught in the past.

Of course these players are receiving benefits and really I don't see why they should have to say no if a booster is willing to give them some perks. As long as it is not the school offering added benefits to the players, the boosters should be able to offer whatever they want.

McCoys wife makes a great point in that you have these 18 year old kids approached by boosters with all these perks and promises they could never even dream of and they are expected to turn down these adults who we are trained to trust and respect.

These guys go out there and kill themselves in front of thousands of fans each week, and the NCAA and the university are getting rich off of their pain and punishment. While they say the player gets the scholarship that in all honestly doesn't cost the University nearly as much as they make off the player.

These players suffer concussions, injuries, etc and may never be the same again. While some of them go on to the NFL and make millions, most of them just go back home to work regular jobs. Let them enjoy the perks of being a superstar while they can.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Exactly

Every big time football school is doing this and Ohio State are just the scapegoats this time around. Auburn was in the middle of it last year, and USC was caught in the past.

Of course these players are receiving benefits and really I don't see why they should have to say no if a booster is willing to give them some perks. As long as it is not the school offering added benefits to the players, the boosters should be able to offer whatever they want.

McCoys wife makes a great point in that you have these 18 year old kids approached by boosters with all these perks and promises they could never even dream of and they are expected to turn down these adults who we are trained to trust and respect.

These guys go out there and kill themselves in front of thousands of fans each week, and the NCAA and the university are getting rich off of their pain and punishment. While they say the player gets the scholarship that in all honestly doesn't cost the University nearly as much as they make off the player.

These players suffer concussions, injuries, etc and may never be the same again. While some of them go on to the NFL and make millions, most of them just go back home to work regular jobs.

I agree with your general point, but the bolded part really doesn't make sense. Athletic departments and boosters are almost always tied together, and if you opened the door to boosters doing whatever they wanted that relationship would become even more pronounced.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by valo403

I agree with your general point, but the bolded part really doesn't make sense. Athletic departments and boosters are almost always tied together, and if you opened the door to boosters doing whatever they wanted that relationship would become even more pronounced.

Yeah the more I think of that part the less it makes sense.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Exactly

Every big time football school is doing this and Ohio State are just the scapegoats this time around. Auburn was in the middle of it last year, and USC was caught in the past.

Of course these players are receiving benefits and really I don't see why they should have to say no if a booster is willing to give them some perks. As long as it is not the school offering added benefits to the players, the boosters should be able to offer whatever they want.

McCoys wife makes a great point in that you have these 18 year old kids approached by boosters with all these perks and promises they could never even dream of and they are expected to turn down these adults who we are trained to trust and respect.

These guys go out there and kill themselves in front of thousands of fans each week, and the NCAA and the university are getting rich off of their pain and punishment. While they say the player gets the scholarship that in all honestly doesn't cost the University nearly as much as they make off the player.

These players suffer concussions, injuries, etc and may never be the same again. While some of them go on to the NFL and make millions, most of them just go back home to work regular jobs. Let them enjoy the perks of being a superstar while they can.

The universities make millions off of them and then provide a free education. only the top 3% maybe make it to the NFL so they should use what little sense they have to use that 100k education they're getting for free. Besides the 100k education they get free room and board, tutors, books, clothes (from school) and food stipends. Then to add to all of that most qualify for pell grants that they don't have to pay back. (I got $2,775 per semester last year). Yet they want more? The school provides all of that and they want more? Some seem to forget that these schools also pay for all the other sports like Women's basketball, hockey, baseball, softball, rowing, gymnastics, field hockey, ect.... there is about 5 schools in all the divisions of the NCAA that actually make a profit on their athletic department. Yes the schools make millions but it pays for all the other college sports that no one cares about and lose millions.

These players pull the "poor me card" but they get a lot as it is. They never bitched about being paid in High school but I guess it's okay to do it in College?

All these coaches and players are playing the "Cam Newton Card" where they act like they don't know anything so they cant be held accountable. The NCAA is actively looking into Auburn and Cam Newton and stated that they believe he took money but had no evidence yet.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by PIMking

The universities make millions off of them and then provide a free education. only the top 3% maybe make it to the NFL so they should use what little sense they have to use that 100k education they're getting for free. Besides the 100k education they get free room and board, tutors, books, clothes (from school) and food stipends. Then to add to all of that most qualify for pell grants that they don't have to pay back. (I got $2,775 per semester last year). Yet they want more? The school provides all of that and they want more? Some seem to forget that these schools also pay for all the other sports like Women's basketball, hockey, baseball, softball, rowing, gymnastics, field hockey, ect.... there is about 5 schools in all the divisions of the NCAA that actually make a profit on their athletic department. Yes the schools make millions but it pays for all the other college sports that no one cares about and lose millions.

These players pull the "poor me card" but they get a lot as it is. They never bitched about being paid in High school but I guess it's okay to do it in College?

All these coaches and players are playing the "Cam Newton Card" where they act like they don't know anything so they cant be held accountable. The NCAA is actively looking into Auburn and Cam Newton and stated that they believe he took money but had no evidence yet.

I will say that I agree that schools should not be allowed to provide the player with payments to play there (like is being rumored in the Cam Newton case).

But if the owner of a car dealership wants to provide me with a free car to drive around campus for four years why the hell should I say no. It's the NCAA not allowing these kids to take the perks that are provided to them from outside the educational institution that I do not think is right.

Some guys wants to give me a car and I am supposed to say no because the NCAA says so, screw that. Players should not get paid from the institution but they should be allowed to benefit from all the free perks of a pro athlete outside of that.

If a star college athlete can be used by the team to generate money for the school, he should be allowed to use his star status to generate money for himself. It makes no sense for the NCAA to say he is not allowed to sign endorsement deals or get paid to promote a product on campus.

The football team makes tens of millions of dollars for the school, and the AD and Head Coaches get paid millions of dollars in salary per year, yet I can't sign this endorsement deal to drive a nice new car around campus for four years and get paid for it even though I am the one risking my health on the field.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I will say that I agree that schools should not be allowed to provide the player with payments to play there (like is being rumored in the Cam Newton case).

But if the owner of a car dealership wants to provide me with a free car to drive around campus for four years why the hell should I say no. It's the NCAA not allowing these kids to take the perks that are provided to them from outside the educational institution that I do not think is right.

Some guys wants to give me a car and I am supposed to say no because the NCAA says so, screw that. Players should not get paid from the institution but they should be allowed to benefit from all the free perks of a pro athlete outside of that.

If a star college athlete can be used by the team to generate money for the school, he should be allowed to use his star status to generate money for himself. It makes no sense for the NCAA to say he is not allowed to sign endorsement deals or get paid to promote a product on campus.

The football team makes tens of millions of dollars for the school, and the AD and Head Coaches get paid millions of dollars in salary per year, yet I can't sign this endorsement deal to drive a nice new car around campus for four years and get paid for it even though I am the one risking my health on the field.

Lets not act like these kids don't want too play football and the excuse of "my body on the line" is a joke. They are amateur athletes and they know that going in. They signed a contract saying that they will put their health on the line to play football for that school in exchange for a free education, room and board, tutors, food stipends ect. No one is putting a gun to their head to do it, they're the ones that can't get the dollar signs out of their heads and screw off with something that is more important than football and that's their education. Some of these kids don't realize what is being offered to them, they have a chance to get a first rate education for free PLUS the chance to go on as a pro athlete and make millions. Yet they screw off and become a Jamarcus Russell and lose 60 million within 5 years of signing a contract. If he were more intellectual he may still be in the league and have money left. But he didn't care about his education, school, nor anyone but himself. This is the same thing that all these others are like too.


Let me ask you this, If your son played for Ohio state but was a 3rd string wr would you be pissed if it were okay for a dealer to give him a car for free but since he isn't the "star" no one cares and he doesn't get one? I would be pissed and there is a reason why the rules are like they are.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by PIMking

Let me ask you this, If your son played for Ohio state but was a 3rd string wr would you be pissed if it were okay for a dealer to give him a car for free but since he isn't the "star" no one cares and he doesn't get one? I would be pissed and there is a reason why the rules are like they are.

No, I wouldn't be mad at all. Why would I be mad that somebody else was able to sign an endorsement deal, because they are a better player and more influential figure than my son.

Hell I wouldn't be mad if I was the 3rd stringer who didn't get offered the car, I'd tell the starting QB or WR to give me a ride in his new car while we try and go pick up chicks.

Sounds to me like you are already just jealous of the athletes at the school you go to and don't want to see them get any more perks than they already do.

Everybody is not equal in this world and some people get perks because they are better at something.

Am I mad that I play soccer on a rec league team here in Calgary and have to pay for my own equipment, while Ronaldo gets paid to use Nike equipment because he is a better soccer player.

I agree that these athletes should not have taken the perks because they knew the rules when they signed up but to me the rule in itself is stupid because why can't college athletes sign up to endorse products to make themselves some money.

Plus lets not make Cam Newton, and Terrelle Pryor out to be such terrible human beings, they were placed in a tough situation as young men by older figures who they trusted.

Plus this is going on at every big football school in the NCAA, whether it be Auburn, Ohio State, Michigan, LSU, Florida, etc. It just happens to be that Auburn and Ohio State are in the spotlight now, much like USC, Miami, etc have been in the past.

[Flames in 07]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

No, I wouldn't be mad at all. Why would I be mad that somebody else was able to sign an endorsement deal, because they are a better player and more influential figure than my son.

Hell I wouldn't be mad if I was the 3rd stringer who didn't get offered the car, I'd tell the starting QB or WR to give me a ride in his new car while we try and go pick up chicks.

Sounds to me like you are already just jealous of the athletes at the school you go to and don't want to see them get any more perks than they already do.

Everybody is not equal in this world and some people get perks because they are better at something.

Am I mad that I play soccer on a rec league team here in Calgary and have to pay for my own equipment, while Ronaldo gets paid to use Nike equipment because he is a better soccer player.

I agree that these athletes should not have taken the perks because they knew the rules when they signed up but to me the rule in itself is stupid because why can't college athletes sign up to endorse products to make themselves some money.

Plus lets not make Cam Newton, and Terrelle Pryor out to be such terrible human beings, they were placed in a tough situation as young men by older figures who they trusted.

Plus this is going on at every big football school in the NCAA, whether it be Auburn, Ohio State, Michigan, LSU, Florida, etc. It just happens to be that Auburn and Ohio State are in the spotlight now, much like USC, Miami, etc have been in the past.

I don't like the fact that the speed limit on Deerfoot is 100km/h. I think it's stupid and it should be 120.

So does that mean i can now go 120?

Nobody said Cam and Terrelle, or Reggie for that matter is a terrible human being. They are made out to be cheaters. which they are. They broke rules they fully knew existing.

At some point you actually have to be accountable for your own decisions. In our society, basically, it's 18 years old and everyone is warned that this is the case. People are just simply holding them accountable for their bad and selfish decisions.

[wpgflamesfan]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I will say that I agree that schools should not be allowed to provide the player with payments to play there (like is being rumored in the Cam Newton case).

But if the owner of a car dealership wants to provide me with a free car to drive around campus for four years why the hell should I say no. It's the NCAA not allowing these kids to take the perks that are provided to them from outside the educational institution that I do not think is right.

Some guys wants to give me a car and I am supposed to say no because the NCAA says so, screw that. Players should not get paid from the institution but they should be allowed to benefit from all the free perks of a pro athlete outside of that.

If a star college athlete can be used by the team to generate money for the school, he should be allowed to use his star status to generate money for himself. It makes no sense for the NCAA to say he is not allowed to sign endorsement deals or get paid to promote a product on campus.

The football team makes tens of millions of dollars for the school, and the AD and Head Coaches get paid millions of dollars in salary per year, yet I can't sign this endorsement deal to drive a nice new car around campus for four years and get paid for it even though I am the one risking my health on the field.

Where do you draw the line though?

If you can give players cars, etc, what's stopping someone like Phil Knight from giving every top prospect a huge endorsement deal with Nike to come to Oregon?

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

No, I wouldn't be mad at all. Why would I be mad that somebody else was able to sign an endorsement deal, because they are a better player and more influential figure than my son.

Hell I wouldn't be mad if I was the 3rd stringer who didn't get offered the car, I'd tell the starting QB or WR to give me a ride in his new car while we try and go pick up chicks.

Sounds to me like you are already just jealous of the athletes at the school you go to and don't want to see them get any more perks than they already do.

Everybody is not equal in this world and some people get perks because they are better at something.

Am I mad that I play soccer on a rec league team here in Calgary and have to pay for my own equipment, while Ronaldo gets paid to use Nike equipment because he is a better soccer player.

I agree that these athletes should not have taken the perks because they knew the rules when they signed up but to me the rule in itself is stupid because why can't college athletes sign up to endorse products to make themselves some money.

Plus lets not make Cam Newton, and Terrelle Pryor out to be such terrible human beings, they were placed in a tough situation as young men by older figures who they trusted.

Plus this is going on at every big football school in the NCAA, whether it be Auburn, Ohio State, Michigan, LSU, Florida, etc. It just happens to be that Auburn and Ohio State are in the spotlight now, much like USC, Miami, etc have been in the past.

Cam Newton:

1. Stole a lap top then threw it out of window of his dorm when the police came while at Florida.

2. Got caught cheating, not once, not twice, But three times. He was about to go in front of the school before he bailed out like a b*tch and went to JuCo.

3. He and his 'preacher' daddy shopped him around and lied about it and they're suppose to be god loving people....

The dude is SCUM and he and Pryor aren't in the same boat. The reason why Pryor is a big deal is that they got caught cheating and lied, then lied about that and got caught numerous times. Then the guy had the balls to go to the meeting where his coach steps down in another car bought by boosters.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Why would you think Mack Brown is any different at all than any other college coach?

This is not a shot at him...not at all....it just is so obvious to me that this is systematic at each and every big time football school and no one is impervious IMO. The only team i believe that may not have much of this stuff going on is Notre Dame....and look at what they have become.

Because I think he is a good person. Just because you are at a major program doesn't mean you have to cheat. I know some of the players from UT and whenever we go out they won't even let me buy them a drink (well a couple graduated this spring and are NFL bound so I can now). They say Mack hits everyone hard on this crap all the time. Can Mack control what everyone does? No. But, I don't think he pushes it under the rug. I can give you a school who didn't push it under the carpet. OU.. Stoops did the right thing and booted Bomar off the team and disclosed everything. Bob Stoops has my utmost respect because he did the right thing.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Sowa

Because I think he is a good person. Just because you are at a major program doesn't mean you have to cheat. I know some of the players from UT and whenever we go out they won't even let me buy them a drink (well a couple graduated this spring and are NFL bound so I can now). They say Mack hits everyone hard on this crap all the time. Can Mack control what everyone does? No. But, I don't think he pushes it under the rug. I can give you a school who didn't push it under the carpet. OU.. Stoops did the right thing and booted Bomar off the team and disclosed everything. Bob Stoops has my utmost respect because he did the right thing.

I can't say whether you're right or wrong about things at UT, but what I can say, with absolute certainty, is that people at OSU were saying the exact same thing last year.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by valo403

I can't say whether you're right or wrong about things at UT, but what I can say, with absolute certainty, is that people at OSU were saying the exact same thing last year.

Well Tressel had some discretions in his past at his other head coaching jobs. After I found out about those I wasn't surprised at all about all this.

[PIMking]

Originally Posted by valo403

I can't say whether you're right or wrong about things at UT, but what I can say, with absolute certainty, is that people at OSU were saying the exact same thing last year.

The problem with OSU and their fans is that they fail to realize that Tressel was dirty when he left Youngstown state and refused to believe it. Plus they thought that they were bullet proof since they're one of the invincible or golden gooses in the NCAA.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Sowa

Well Tressel had some discretions in his past at his other head coaching jobs. After I found out about those I wasn't surprised at all about all this.

Fair enough, but the point is that everyone thinks their coach is a great guy, and their players do the right thing, and their program is clean etc. The reality is that these issues aren't isolated cases. I think you have to be pretty naive to say with any degree of certainty that x program is clean based simply on guys involved being 'good people'.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by wpgflamesfan

Where do you draw the line though?

If you can give players cars, etc, what's stopping someone like Phil Knight from giving every top prospect a huge endorsement deal with Nike to come to Oregon?

I tend to think that the system would have its natural checks and balances.

I doubt all the other teams that Nike has sponsorship contracts with (USC, Boise,Texas, Oklahoma, etc) would be very happy with Nike giving endorsement deals for a bunch of kids at Oregon. Would Nike really be willing to piss off all their other partners? I wouldn't think so.

As much as Nike would love Oregon to win the National Championship, I think the legitimacy of their business and them making money will be a little more important to them.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I tend to think that the system would have its natural checks and balances.

I doubt all the other teams that Nike has sponsorship contracts with (USC, Boise,Texas, Oklahoma, etc) would be very happy with Nike giving endorsement deals for a bunch of kids at Oregon. Would Nike really be willing to piss off all their other partners? I wouldn't think so.

As much as Nike would love Oregon to win the National Championship, I think the legitimacy of their business and them making money will be a little more important to them.

Nike already spends waaaaaaaaaaaaay more money on Oregon football than any of the other programs it has equipment contracts with, how do you think that new complex was paid for?

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by valo403

Nike already spends waaaaaaaaaaaaay more money on Oregon football than any of the other programs it has equipment contracts with, how do you think that new complex was paid for?

Paying for a sporting complex is one thing but building a college all-star team is a different story altogether.

I tend to think that the other schools will be a lot more aggressive with Nike if Nike was actually poaching players for Oregon.

While I am sure they were not happy about the new complex, it doesn't really change the team Oregon is putting on the field.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Paying for a sporting complex is one thing but building a college all-star team is a different story altogether.

I tend to think that the other schools will be a lot more aggressive with Nike if Nike was actually poaching players for Oregon.

Paying for a complex goes a long way to building an All-Star team. Nike's presence, and money, has been a driving force behind Oregon becoming an elite program.

And it definitely changes the team being put on the field. Facilities are one of the major things that recruits look at, a state of the art complex like the one they have draws in 5 star recruits that would have gone other places.