Israel declares war on Hamas

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Are you just rambling at anything that will allow your sick genocidal mind to justify the slaughter of tens of thousands of innocents?

You've done this before. Arguing the legality of barbaric acts to somehow justify it.



All your sick mind is doing is twisting and arguing the definition of collective punishment to try and justify the genocide. Like the above. In your warped world it's perfectly fine to chemically burn civilians because Israel wasn't a signatory to a convention. Therefore it's justified.

Collective punishment and genocide are different things altogether. What you do is see a thing which you believe is wrong and then try to stick some article of international law on it. Without really understanding the law. It's actually ok if you say something like "what Israel is doing is wrong" without trying to spin it into war crimes or some random article of Geneva convention.

[Pointman]

How comes UN issues no order against Iran's head over Iranian missile attack on Israel? Launching 200 missiles at another country can't be legal. Do you believe that UN is in any way neutral?

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Bill Bumface

1000s rockets were fired from the area that peacekeepers were mandated to control. 60000 residents of Israel, large parts of them actually Arabs, have been relocated to temporary homes in center of Israel for a year now.

If UN were powerless to remove Hezbollah from the area, despite mandated to do so, they should at least get out of the way of Israel army that is doing their job now.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Pointman

1000s rockets were fired from the area that peacekeepers were mandated to control. 60000 residents of Israel, large parts of them actually Arabs, have been relocated to temporary homes in center of Israel for a year now.

If UN were powerless to remove Hezbollah from the area, despite mandated to do so, they should at least get out of the way of Israel army that is doing their job now.

I think you misunderstand the role of the peacekeeping force. Where do get they have a mandate to remove Hezbolah?

Do they currently have a mandate to remove the Israeli force as well?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Pointman

I'm still waiting for your apologies by the way.

I’m sorry I have to watch far right Russian propagandists like you flail around and justify killing innocent people. And I’m sorry that people feel they have to waste time correcting the same ignorance and lies again and again you continue to spout despite being corrected so many times. I’m sorry Palestinians have to read your posts and be reminded how much the far right in Israel hate them.

Now, which posts would you like me to quote?

The ones where you defend terrorism and say you’d support terrorism if you agreed with the cause?

The ones where you defend Russia’s anti-LGBTQ laws or say you don’t care about LGBTQ people?

The ones where you say you don’t care about democracy because Putin is a better leader than leaders that were democratically elected?

Lots of Putin bootlicking to showcase, if that’s the road you’d rather go down.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by GGG

I think you misunderstand the role of the peacekeeping force. Where do get they have a mandate to remove Hezbolah?

Do they currently have a mandate to remove the Israeli force as well?

UNIFIL's actual mandate:


https://unifil.unmissions.org/unifil-mandate

UNIFIL Mandate

According to Security Council resolutions 425 (1978) and 426 (1978) of 19 March 1978, UNIFIL was established to:

Confirm the withdrawal of Israeli forces from southern Lebanon.
Restore international peace and security.
Assist the Government of Lebanon in ensuring the return of its effective authority in the area.
According to Security Council resolution 1701 (2006) of 11 August 2006,

UNIFIL, in addition to carrying out its mandate under resolutions 425 and 426, shall:

Monitor the cessation of hostilities.

Accompany and support the Lebanese armed forces as they deploy throughout the South, including along the Blue Line, as Israel withdraws its armed forces from Lebanon.

Coordinate its activities referred to in the preceding paragraph (above) with the Government of Lebanon and the Government of Israel.

Extend its assistance to help ensure humanitarian access to civilian populations and the voluntary and safe return of displaced persons.

Assist the Lebanese Armed Forces (LAF) in taking steps towards the establishment between the Blue Line and the Litani river of an area free of any armed personnel, assets and weapons other than those of the Government of Lebanon and of UNIFIL deployed in this area.

Assist the Government of Lebanon, at its request, in securing its borders and other entry points to prevent the entry in Lebanon without its consent of arms or related materiel.

By this resolution, the Council also authorized UNIFIL to take all necessary action in areas of deployment of its forces and as it deems within its capabilities, to ensure that its area of operations is not utilized for hostile activities of any kind; to resist attempts by forceful means to prevent it from discharging its duties under the mandate of the Security Council; and to protect United Nations personnel, facilities, installations and equipment, ensure the security and freedom of movement of United Nations personnel, humanitarian workers and, without prejudice to the responsibility of the Government of Lebanon, to protect civilians under imminent threat of physical violence.

Seems pretty clear that their mandate following Israel's withdrawal, which was confirmed by the UN, was to stop groups like Hezbollah from setting up shop. They clearly failed.

[PepsiFree]

Well, one thing is for sure. Israeli propaganda has been very effective in shifting the narrative away from them firing on UNIFIL and toward the performance of UNIFIL.

Lots of people happy to carry their water.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

The collective punishment discussion is as thrilling and morally irrelevant as the 'what is an explosive device' discussion. Just helps to carry water for people who are happy to see human beings killed while others dither around.

'Dad, is it wrong to kill tens of thousands of people who you've cut off from the world?'

'Son, bring over Annals of Law History, Volume IX, 'Legal definition of Collective Punishment.' And while you're at it, also grab Volume XII, 'Rigging Grandma's Phone to Explode: Why the onus is on Grandma and why it's not really an 'explosion' per se' so that we can do a thought experiment together. It'll be really interesting.'

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by blankall

Seems pretty clear that their mandate following Israel's withdrawal, which was confirmed by the UN, was to stop groups like Hezbollah from setting up shop. They clearly failed.

So we should shoot at them. Makes sense.

[Pointman]

The article in Guardian says that Hamas is virtually destroyed. It was destroyed by Israel. UN failed to do anything about this terrorist organization (officially recognized as such by many countries including Canada). A lot of talk about how destruction of Hamas could have been achieved with less deaths in population. However, this is a very arbitrary argument made by organizations and countries, who could not do anything about Hamas for decades.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-damage-to-it

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Well, one thing is for sure. Israeli propaganda has been very effective in shifting the narrative away from them firing on UNIFIL and toward the performance of UNIFIL.

Lots of people happy to carry their water.

On this very particular matter I believe you genuinely missed the point. Israel believes that UN actually collaborates with Iran. They don't say it point blank, but they do talk about it inside yhe country and they do hint about it internationally. When they talk about performance of UNIFIL (or absence of thereof), combined with pointing out at UN not condemning, let alone taking legal action against, Iran strike, they hint at collaboration.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Pointman

The article in Guardian says that Hamas is virtually destroyed.

Perfect. Terrorism in the region is over. I can't wait for the decades of everlasting peace.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by Pointman

The article in Guardian says that Hamas is virtually destroyed. It was destroyed by Israel. UN failed to do anything about this terrorist organization (officially recognized as such by many countries including Canada). A lot of takk about how destruction of Hamas could have been achieved with less deaths in population. However, this us a very arbitrary argument made by organizations and countries, who could not do anything about Hamas for decades.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-damage-to-it

This is hard for the UN to do anything when two of the permanent members of the SC, China and Russia, don't view them as a terrorist organization.

I think every poster in this thread is happy to hear that Hamas is virtually destroyed, it should pave the way for peace and the cessation of civilian deaths, which is all that the "anti-Israel" gang wants.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I’m sorry I have to watch far right Russian propagandists like you flail around and justify killing innocent people. And I’m sorry that people feel they have to waste time correcting the same ignorance and lies again and again you continue to spout despite being corrected so many times. I’m sorry Palestinians have to read your posts and be reminded how much the far right in Israel hate them.

Now, which posts would you like me to quote?

The ones where you defend terrorism and say you’d support terrorism if you agreed with the cause?

The ones where you defend Russia’s anti-LGBTQ laws or say you don’t care about LGBTQ people?

The ones where you say you don’t care about democracy because Putin is a better leader than leaders that were democratically elected?

Lots of Putin bootlicking to showcase, if that’s the road you’d rather go down.

Thank you.

There are two things I would like to add to this

First, discussions on CP obviously can't impact anything. Hence, the only value it has is in sharing different perspectives, views and opinions. As such, I definitely contributed to it. My opinion of Putin, for example, was fairly similar to that of an average Russian. As such, the value of my posts were in that you could read the opinion of Russian on the matter. Whether those were correct or not, is beyond the point.

Second. I actually never had issue with you calling me Putin's bootlicker. "Bootlicker" may be over the line, but I let it slide. Tge issue was with your factually incorrect claim, that it was a danger of being drafted that made me change my mind. In reality, and it is well documented, I declared that Putin lost his marbles 11 minutes after the start of the war and posted that I applied to immigrate to Israel half a year before draft was even on horizon.

And last, but arguably most important. As you know, I definitely have no problem stating my views, regardless if they would be well-received or not. With that in mind, I can tell you one thing:

I don't hate Palestinians at all. If I were, I would have no problem stating it. But I don't.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by belsarius

This is hard for the UN to do anything when two of the permanent members of the SC, China and Russia, don't view them as a terrorist organization.

I think every poster in this thread is happy to hear that Hamas is virtually destroyed, it should pave the way for peace and the cessation of civilian deaths, which is all that the "anti-Israel" gang wants.

I dunno, at the end of the article..

Instead of a Hamas 2.0, this could end with multiple factions of Hamas operating more or less independently. This process is already under way in Gaza, where previously well-organised “battalions” have disintegrated into small, chaotic and largely ineffective squads of often inexperienced militants. Observers close to the organisation say it has “ceased to exist” in anything resembling its previous form and so will need decades to rebuild.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-damage-to-it


Remember when Al Quida was "defeated" and then ISIS popped up?



To me the only solution to prevent that form occurring again in Gaza would be for them to actually have a country, have it's borders not controlled by Israel, and somehow have the worlds largest rebuilding project so they have a safe secure home with opportunities, and there is no need to continue fighting. This, of course, will never happen. Gaza will go the next few decades in shambles, sucking up aid that maintains a status quo of refugees living in squalor, and these fractured Hamas member swill continue small incursions and attacks for ever.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I dunno, at the end of the article..



https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...s-damage-to-it


Remember when Al Quida was "defeated" and then ISIS popped up?



To me the only solution to prevent that form occurring again in Gaza would be for them to actually have a country, have it's borders not controlled by Israel, and somehow have the worlds largest rebuilding project so they have a safe secure home with opportunities, and there is no need to continue fighting. This, of course, will never happen. Gaza will go the next few decades in shambles, sucking up aid that maintains a status quo of refugees living in squalor, and these fractured Hamas member swill continue small incursions and attacks for ever.

You know that in 70s Israelis and Gazans lived in peace. There were public buses running from Tel Aviv to Gaza. Israelis used to go to Gaza beaches. It's perfectly achievable to build it again. Just stop Iran from brainwashing them to destroy Israel. And hopefully ut would be good again.

[activeStick]

While looking up Hezbollah a few minutes ago, TIL that they are an actual political party? I always thought they were like ISIS.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by activeStick

While looking up Hezbollah a few minutes ago, TIL that they are an actual political party? I always thought they were like ISIS.

They are the de facto government of southern lebanon, the lebanese government has no actual means to control them.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Pointman

Thank you.

There are two things I would like to add to this

First, discussions on CP obviously can't impact anything. Hence, the only value it has is in sharing different perspectives, views and opinions. As such, I definitely contributed to it. My opinion of Putin, for example, was fairly similar to that of an average Russian. As such, the value of my posts were in that you could read the opinion of Russian on the matter. Whether those were correct or not, is beyond the point.

Second. I actually never had issue with you calling me Putin's bootlicker. "Bootlicker" may be over the line, but I let it slide. Tge issue was with your factually incorrect claim, that it was a danger of being drafted that made me change my mind. In reality, and it is well documented, I declared that Putin lost his marbles 11 minutes after the start of the war and posted that I applied to immigrate to Israel half a year before draft was even on horizon.

And last, but arguably most important. As you know, I definitely have no problem stating my views, regardless if they would be well-received or not. With that in mind, I can tell you one thing:

I don't hate Palestinians at all. If I were, I would have no problem stating it. But I don't.

And your view on LGBTQ people?

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Pointman

Collective punishment and genocide are different things altogether. What you do is see a thing which you believe is wrong and then try to stick some article of international law on it. Without really understanding the law. It's actually ok if you say something like "what Israel is doing is wrong" without trying to spin it into war crimes or some random article of Geneva convention.

Quite the hypocritical post there from someone that tried to justify chemically burning Palestinians by spinning that Israel hadn't agreed not to