2019/2020 Trade Speculation and Rumors 2.0

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Gaudreau, Hanifin, Bennett

for

7th, 18th, Palmieri

Wtf is this garbage

[Niemo]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Gaudreau, Hanifin, Bennett

for

7th, 18th, Palmieri

That is not good for us. Seems like Gaudreau and Hanifin are both being greatly underrated. I won’t even speculate that Sam will be playoff Sam.

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by David Struch

Gaudreau, Hanifin, Bennett

for

7th, 18th, Palmieri

This might be the worst proposal I've seen so far, if not at least top 3.

[AC]

Hell, NJ could include Hischier in that proposal and I'd still say no from the Flames perspective.

Edit: Ok maybe not, but that's what it would likely take to balance things IMO.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Makes sense. Do we know if the Flames ever had a chance to discuss at all?

I think that is partly why the deal fell through and they pushed forward with the Arizona deal. The agent/Devils wouldn’t let anyone talk to Hall

https://flamesnation.ca/2019/12/20/f...or-hall-trade/

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by AC

Hell, NJ could include Hischier in that proposal and I'd still say no from the Flames perspective.

That’s crazy proposal as is does not work for me at all but add Hischier and I am all in

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

There is a precedent.

Marian Hossa signed a 1 year deal with the Red Wings to chase a cup. Then signed a massive deal with Chicago.

edit: The Oilers were reportedly offering him stupid money too IIRC.
https://www.si.com/hockey/news/top-f...%20Wings%20for

IIRC, Hossa wanted to sign with Chicago but they couldn’t fit him I’m until Havlat’s contract was up. So he took the one year deal with Detroit, so he could sign with the Hawks the next year.


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[Saqe]

I'd trade Gaudreau for the 7th overall pick in this draft.

[serratedmuffin]

I'd trade Gaudreau for 8th, 2nd round pick and some other spare parts only if Rossi is available. We're not getting the top 3 and Rossi is the only one outside of that I see with superstar potential. I'm bullish on him and can see him playing center in the NHL.

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

That’s crazy proposal as is does not work for me at all but add Hischier and I am all in

Gaudreau, Hanifin,Bennett for 7th, 18th, Palmieri, and Hischier? Not bad at all...

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by serratedmuffin

I'd trade Gaudreau for 8th, 2nd round pick and some other spare parts only if Rossi is available. We're not getting the top 3 and Rossi is the only one outside of that I see with superstar potential. I'm bullish on him and can see him playing center in the NHL.

Cole Perfetti might go before Rossi, and he might end up being the better player.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The key for me is that this season is the last good opportunity to get assets for Gaudreau, and he is very likely not to re-sign.

I don't necessarily agree with either of those assumptions, but even if true, I am ok with that. I am ok with that if it means the Flames win a cup, or even come close.


You ship out Gaudreau for futures, you are essentially pushing out talent from THIS Flames team onto the NEXT Flames' team, so to speak. You will essentially be trading for part of the next core. Outside the lottery picks, you don't see many first round picks being ready in their draft +1 or draft +2 years, and often when they do, they are peripheral players at first.


That's my whole rationale. I am fine with trading Gaudreau for futures if they want to rebuild - I would support that. I am fine with trading Gaudreau for NHL-ready prospects or young players, or established players to fill holes. I just think you are either setting yourself back for today's team in trading Gaudreau for futures only (and not using those futures in a subsequent trade to help the team now). That's my point of argument.


I really do understand the value that Gaudreau has, and if he ends up leaving as a UFA for nothing, that will suck. However, are you really closer to the Stanley Cup by trading Gaudreau out and signing Hall, all things being equal? Or are your chances better with both of them in the lineup?



I understand the risk, but I would take that risk myself, and I understand that others are more concerned with maintaining or increasing assets.



Once again, for people who think that you can't win with Gaudreau, then that's a totally different argument, and they should definitely be happy with a Gaudreau for futures deal, as they get assets back for removing an impediment to winning. I personally don't see that. I see last year's lineup + Hall and hopefully an upgraded goalie, plus no Hamonic (and tinkering where necessary to make the cap work) as a big step forward to a core that I think CAN win. 2 seasons' worth.


Then this team will be at a crossroads with their expiring contracts (or near-expiring contracts), and it will be tougher to assemble a team to win then. Might as well go for it now, and if Treliving doesn't feel he is close, then you might as well start selling now IMO. I think they are relatively close, and I am ok with the entire team leaving for nothing if it means a Cup - and assume most people would feel the same way. For those that don't think this core can win with the existing pieces (plus additional talent), then I guess selling for futures isn't a totally wrong direction - but I do still see it as 'spinning your tires' and not really improving much.

[UKflames]

Why are so many people including Kylington in trade proposals, when his preffered side is RD, which is a hole we need to fill. If it's because people think he's not very good, then you're not getting a lot back any way, then why not continue to develop him on the bottom pairing as a RD. Low cost, fills a hole that you don't need to waste assets to fill.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by UKflames

Why are so many people including Kylington in trade proposals, when his preffered side is RD, which is a hole we need to fill. If it's because people think he's not very good, then you're not getting a lot back any way, then why not continue to develop him on the bottom pairing as a RD. Low cost, fills a hole that you don't need to waste assets to fill.

Particularly if TJ doesn’t re-sign, Kylington is the best skater we have on D.

[Rick M.]

It’s odd that with all the criticism the first line receives, Lindholm is never mentioned. Yet, he didn’t accomplish much in the playoffs either.

[Eric Vail]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

You're one of these posters that seemingly only signs in to drive-by hall, so I am going to pick on you a bit (there was another just like you last page, and the page before that...)

WHY

Why do you believe this? Is there any statistic, relevant history, comparable player, or other demonstrable fact that you can point to that will elucidate the reasoning behind Hall=bad for the rest of us?

What i am about to say is 100% as valid as what you did because I will also offer no proof.

Hall >> Johnny Gaudreau, probably even moreso in 3 years time.

I am not sure where you get the authority to speak for "the rest of us". There have been several posts about the risky nature of signing Hall. I don't think I need to repeat all of those things. Most 7 year big money deals are boat anchors by the end. The Flames are carrying one of those in Lucic right now.

If your point comparing Hall and Gaudreau was the Flames shouldn't sign Gaudreau to a 7 year $9 million contract, I would agree with you - even though that will be a future decision.

[Poe969]

Keeping Gaudreau is probably as risky as signing Hall. Signing Hall and getting assets for Gaudreau gives us more than just keeping Gaudreau. Its not like Gaudreau has carried the team to win the cup or even come close, the team hasn't won anything important or Impressive with Gaudreau. If an elite level player actually wants to sign with the Flames, they need to do it. Other teams will likely give a lot of assets for Gaudreau right now. This team isn't good enough, keeping the team the same only ensures more disappointment. The time for change is now. And if they sign Hall and do horribly, he almost guarantees they get a high draft pick.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yep, exactly. If we can land Hall on the 9th then our "misfortune" in losing out on that trade worked out great for us in the end.

I think its a long shot, at best, that Hall signs in Calgary and if he does it will be because they offer him way more money than others. So an overpay.... which is neither BT's MO nor something the club can afford and still fill other holes.

IMO I think its pretty likely he signs in Nashville and gets reunited with Hynes who he had his Hart season playing under. The suggestion of buying out Turris and a couple other moves they have made seems to support the idea the Preds are doing something major this next week.

If not Nashville then to me Colorado makes all kinds of sense if he is chasing a cup which is a big probability.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by no one in particular

I'd trade Gaudreau for the 7th overall pick in this draft.

Originally Posted by no one in particular

I'd trade Gaudreau for 8th, 2nd round pick and some other spare parts only if Rossi is available. We're not getting the top 3 and Rossi is the only one outside of that I see with superstar potential. I'm bullish on him and can see him playing center in the NHL.

I used to love the draft, because it was all about the future and really digging into the young players to make a call on who would become a good NHLer and who would bust under the load unreasonable expectation. Now I absolutely hate the draft because it is a massive hype cycle built out of nothing. The amount of hype means that the larger percentage of these players are going to bust. I mean look at this post.

Originally Posted by no one in particular

Agreed, there very well may be that future #1 centre staring us in the face right now...

@7th Marco Rossi, Cole Perfetti, Anton Lundell, Seth Jarvis

@18th, 19th or 20th Connor Zary, Dawson Mercer, Dylan Holloway, Mavrick Bourque, Hendrix Lapierre, Brandan Brisson, Ridly Greig

11 number one centers "staring us in the face." The hype is insane. Now we're willing to trade franchise level talent for a lottery ticket to get a crack at drafting the hype surrounding these kids. It seems every second or third year is considered the "next 2003" and this is "the deepest draft in years" and every year they turn into big busts. Have we learned nothing from the year the Flames had three first round picks, or watching the Oilers draft four first overall picks? The draft is a crapshoot. The allure has really faded as the hype has built.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by New Era

I used to love the draft, because it was all about the future and really digging into the young players to make a call on who would become a good NHLer and who would bust under the load unreasonable expectation. Now I absolutely hate the draft because it is a massive hype cycle built out of nothing. The amount of hype means that the larger percentage of these players are going to bust. I mean look at this post.




11 number one centers "staring us in the face." The hype is insane. Now we're willing to trade franchise level talent for a lottery ticket to get a crack at drafting the hype surrounding these kids. It seems every second or third year is considered the "next 2003" and this is "the deepest draft in years" and every year they turn into big busts. Have we learned nothing from the year the Flames had three first round picks, or watching the Oilers draft four first overall picks? The draft is a crapshoot. The allure has really faded as the hype has built.

The hype machine is very true. There is an entire industry whose job it is to create content. Blogs, podcasts, broadcast journalists, radio jockeys all feeding the rumour mill at the moment. Often the amount of hype falls well short of the actual happenings. I thought Treliving poured some cold water on the ‘core must go’ commentary last week. It may happen, but don’t be shocked if it doesn’t.

On the other hand, the Flames including the 19OA pick in a trade is unfathomable for some here. I can distinctly recall the amount of consternation surrounding the 13OA pick we gave up as part of the Jokinen trade. There was an awful lot of people who thought Brandon Gromley was the second coming of Scott Niedermeyer. How on Earth could the Flames be so stupid??