[Signing] Flames sign James Neal (5 years, 5.75 AAV)

[Bingo]

Man people can get angry ...

Neal hasn't looked great, certainly hasn't looked productive, but he wasn't fast last year, or the year before and always figured it out.

So far there hasn't been a fit, but we've seen lots of new players take time to fit in when coming to a new team. No point in defending the production, but I don't have to be on the take to think being patient and seeing where it goes might be a little more fun than fretting and losing my mind over it when the team at this point has been just fine without him leading the way offensively.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Man people can get angry ...

Neal hasn't looked great, certainly hasn't looked productive, but he wasn't fast last year, or the year before and always figured it out.

So far there hasn't been a fit, but we've seen lots of new players take time to fit in when coming to a new team. No point in defending the production, but I don't have to be on the take to think being patient and seeing where it goes might be a little more fun than fretting and losing my mind over it when the team at this point has been just fine without him leading the way offensively.

Keep cashing those mortgage cheques, Bingo.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Are you jealous he makes as much as he does? He isn’t negatively impacting the team, in any way, so what’s the problem?

This was your argument, that I was jealous of Neal because he makes more money than I do. Do you stand by that argument, that I am jealous of how much money he makes or that other fans that are critical are jealous of how much money he makes. Ludicrous, with about as much connection to reality as an allegation that James Neal pays you to defend him.

But that is the level of discouse sometimes when someone is critical of a player on the Flames. The same way fans do not have to be on the take to defend Neal they can also be critical of him and not be jealous of how much money he makes or have him run over their dog.

I myself have seen enough to be pretty sure that Neal will not figure it out, that he will not score at a 20 goal a year pace over the 5 years with the Flames, that at the end of the day it is going to be somewhere between a bad and terrible contract. Not sure that makes me jelous of how much money he makes or any less of a Flames fan than anyone else on this board. I have even developed the ability to chat about this failing and be very pleased that they traded for an elite forward and a soon to be top 2 dman in the offseason.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Man people can get angry ...

Neal hasn't looked great, certainly hasn't looked productive, but he wasn't fast last year, or the year before and always figured it out.

So far there hasn't been a fit, but we've seen lots of new players take time to fit in when coming to a new team. No point in defending the production, but I don't have to be on the take to think being patient and seeing where it goes might be a little more fun than fretting and losing my mind over it when the team at this point has been just fine without him leading the way offensively.

Who is angry or losing their mind? I have not seen those posts.

I should have put my post in green if the dripping sarcasm was not apparent. Think of the logistical challenge of Neal paying everyone's mortgage payment who defends him on here to start with.

But similar to how after 30 games I can make a pretty confident prediction that BT signed Lindholm to a great contract and he is going to be a 65 point a year guy minimum for the duration of his contract and be happy about that, I can be pretty sure that Neal is overpaid and will almost certainly never score the 100 goals over the lifetime of that contract that is the minimum needed to justify a 5.75 million dollar signing for a guy who does not kill penalties and is average defensively and be disappointed about that. I mean it is not like the Flames signed a modern day Jere Lehtinen to a 5.75 million dollar contract. They signed a guy whose predominant role is to score goals.

[868904]

He is definitely snake bitten, he probably should have 5 more goals.

He isn’t great at tracking and winning puck battles which is a little disappointing given his size but I guess that was never really his game.

What was part of his game that we aren’t seeing much of is the chippiness. I’d like to see him agitate a lot more, and get under the other teams skin. I want to see how cheap the shots are at the Real Deal bar!

[Hackey]

Aaorangavey spent all of last year whining and complaining about Hamonic. Its what he does. Why talk about the 30 things going right for the team when you can focus on the one thing thats not. Seems like a fun guy.

[ThisYear]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Aaorangavey spent all of last year whining and complaining about Hamonic. Its what he does. Why talk about the 30 things going right for the team when you can focus on the one thing thats not. Seems like a fun guy.

So you aren't inviting him to your Christmas party?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Aaorangavey spent all of last year whining and complaining about Hamonic. Its what he does. Why talk about the 30 things going right for the team when you can focus on the one thing thats not. Seems like a fun guy.

My criticism was that a 1st and two 2nds was an overpayment for a 2nd pairing defenceman. I still think it was, I would be surprised if we got that much in return for him if he was on that market.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by ThisYear

So you aren't inviting him to your Christmas party?

The feeling is mutual, although I would like to know how Hackey thinks Girgensons could help us more than Jankowski which was his hockey opinion earlier this year. That would be an entertaining hockey discussion.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Who is angry or losing their mind? I have not seen those posts.

I should have put my post in green if the dripping sarcasm was not apparent. Think of the logistical challenge of Neal paying everyone's mortgage payment who defends him on here to start with.

But similar to how after 30 games I can make a pretty confident prediction that BT signed Lindholm to a great contract and he is going to be a 65 point a year guy minimum for the duration of his contract and be happy about that, I can be pretty sure that Neal is overpaid and will almost certainly never score the 100 goals over the lifetime of that contract that is the minimum needed to justify a 5.75 million dollar signing for a guy who does not kill penalties and is average defensively and be disappointed about that. I mean it is not like the Flames signed a modern day Jere Lehtinen to a 5.75 million dollar contract. They signed a guy whose predominant role is to score goals.

And you can be sure on those things if you wish.

I look at a guy that has a career 11.8% shooting percentage shooting 4% through almost a third of a season as a little unlikely to continue. If pucks were going in at his usual rate he's have 8 or 9 now and this wouldn't be a concern.

So over the summer he's lost what was once a consistent year to year ability to shoot the puck? I don't know if I'm ready to just assume that.

I looked at last season for forwards and shooting percentage ... 4% is replacement level or 13th forward shooting ability.

So yeah it hasn't looked good, but to assume this body of work is the season and that's it is a pretty bleak way of looking at averages, especially with a player that has had a pretty good run of consistency.

This happens every year both in the high and low variety.

Chiasson is shooting 27%, that won't last. Hell Troy Brouwer is shooting 20% this year.

Things will normalize and Neal will move back to the 8-9% mark by the end of the season. At his shot/game rate that should settle into about 16 goals. The start is making his 20 goal season run a bit of a stretch, but things won't stay as bleak as they are.

[Phagoof]

The "Real (Bad) Deal" James Neal.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CanadaMatt

You’re absolutely right.

“Did Neal run over your dog or something” great challenge

“people always find something to complain about” great challenge

“Why can’t you just enjoy being 1st in the division” great challenge

“Frolik was garbage in year 1 too” nonsense challenge as has just been poupointed out

“Hamilton was criticized too, and look how that turned out” god knows what that poster was on about?

Cherry pick much?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

My criticism was that a 1st and two 2nds was an overpayment for a 2nd pairing defenceman. I still think it was, I would be surprised if we got that much in return for him if he was on that market.

Your criticism was a lot more than that, and you know it.

[Phagoof]

The second, second was probably too much. Tre obviously really wanted Hams.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Phagoof

The second, second was probably too much. Tre obviously really wanted Hams.

The next couple games, you may see why. In fact, he has not only o,aged really well this year (the most consistent defence,an IMO), he can also take some credit for Hanifin's year. And Brodie's.

[Enoch Root]

Are people still arguing this?

Hamonic is well worth what we paid for him. #15, 45 and 52, which turned out to be Senyshen, Forsbacka-Karlsson, and Lauzon.

Yes, I know we wouldn't have picked the same players, and people will cherry pick and say it could have been this guy and that guy, but it just as easily could have been players even worse than these.

Hamonic is a stud and a warrior, and is badly needed on this team. When we hit the playoffs, people are going to be loving him.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Are people still arguing this?

Hamonic is well worth what we paid for him. #15, 45 and 52, which turned out to be Senyshen, Forsbacka-Karlsson, and Lauzon.

Yes, I know we wouldn't have picked the same players, and people will cherry pick and say it could have been this guy and that guy, but it just as easily could have been players even worse than these.

Hamonic is a stud and a warrior, and is badly needed on this team. When we hit the playoffs, people are going to be loving him.

Sometimes I think posters forget that draft picks just go in order regardless of round. The second half of the first round and the early second are not much different, and the late second to the the early third, etc.

Keep in mind also that Treliving expected his team to make the POs, and they should have given their lineup. That makes those picks even worse if he's right.

[Enoch Root]

Exactly. It should have been #20, 50 and 52

#thanksGulutzan

[GettinIggyWithIt]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Are people still arguing this?

Hamonic is well worth what we paid for him. #15, 45 and 52, which turned out to be Senyshen, Forsbacka-Karlsson, and Lauzon.

Yes, I know we wouldn't have picked the same players, and people will cherry pick and say it could have been this guy and that guy, but it just as easily could have been players even worse than these.

Hamonic is a stud and a warrior, and is badly needed on this team. When we hit the playoffs, people are going to be loving him.

Not to take away from your point which I agree with but those were the picks traded for Hamilton. Noah Dobson is the only confirmed pick from that deal with the isles.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GettinIggyWithIt

Not to take away from your point which I agree with but those were the picks traded for Hamilton. Noah Dobson is the only confirmed pick from that deal with the isles.

Doh!