[Rumour] go to the new thread

[Calgary4LIfe]

I would argue that Buffalo has also been a team much like Calgary where they have suffered under poor coaching. Granato seems to have them turned around at the moment (but they are probably just running on being loose with nothing to prove - no pressure and 'fun'). Kruger doesn't seem to be an NHL coach. Housley wasn't very good. Bylsma. Rolston/Nolan. They haven't had a strong coach IMO since Ruff in 2013 (and by then, Ruff was wearing out). Pay for poor coaching, expect poor results. That includes stars under-performing. So far, Skinner looks to be rebounding (though I don't think he will ever rebound enough to justify that contract).


I think after a period of time to adjust to Calgary, get his legs back into game-shape, get his neck 'tested' with enough games under his belt so he isn't thinking about it so much, and developing some chemistry with the existing players in Calgary (Gaudreau-Eichel would be magical), he would explode under Sutter.


He is obviously not McDavid. I don't think he will be MacKinnon either. I do, however, think he is right after MacKinnon - better than Mathews, better than basically everyone left (assuming Sid is regressing). I guess we won't know for sure until he shows it, but that's where I would rank him. Poor coaching is something that is very difficult to overcome.


I just hope he will be back to 'normal' after his surgery. This has been dragged-out so long because of the level or risk here. I am both terrified and excited at the same time that the Flames are still one of the favourites in this.

[Dude Where's Makar?]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Centres when they are fully healthy I would take over Jack Eichel. McDavid, Matthews, MacKinnon. That's it. Draisaitl doesn't count, he is a winger.

For me I would only take McDavid, MacKinnon, Barkov
I think a healthy Eichel is more dynamic and sets up his line mates better than Matthews.

Point and Aho are close, but I still think Eichel when healthy is better.

[DomeFoam]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Yeah, I know how good Eichel is. I also know how bad Eichel is. Eichel is a very talented player, but he has some weaknesses that are concerning that most people are overlooking. You are not getting a generational talent. Full stop. Eichel is a talented player, but he is not in the same class of the players you mentioned. Close. A very talented player. But he's not as good as those other guys and definitely NOT a generational talent (neither are the players you mentioned). You also have to take into consideration his injury, potential for recovery, and his salary to determine how much you are willing to cough up. Considering his salary, you can kiss one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk goodbye, which is why we need as many talented young players we can keep our hands on to support our top end players.

This could be a deal where we sell the farm, trade away two of the three prospects and our next two 1st rounders, only to find out that Eichel's surgery was not successful and he can't play any more, or at best a diminished capacity. What we have is a $10M a season albatross. We have then removed all hope of filling the gaps in the team with cheap high skilled talent and will be relying on the Trevor Lewis level players to fill out the roster. That is the risk that must be considered. The other side of that coin is Eichel's surgery is successful, but because of how many good young players we gave up we have nothing in the pipe to support Eichel and we become Buffalo west. Again, you have to weigh risk and have a plan for filling holes in the roster. Eichel is a talented player, but he isn't your go to guy. He needs bodies around him to make him better.

He absolutely is in the same class of players I mentioned. Matthews has world class players in Marner and Tavares, Nylander. MacKinnon has guys like Rantanen and Landeskog. Who the hell did Eichel have playing in that tire fire Buffalo? Jeff Skinner? Eichel elevated him to a 40 goal player and he got PAID. He's been Buffalo's go to guy for 5 years now, and they never, ever supported him. This is false.

[Bunk]

How many downs has it been on the 1 yard line?

[Jbo]

Is this like a Seattle in the SuperBowl at the 1 yard line or....

[Knightslayer]

Originally Posted by Bunk

How many downs has it been on the 1 yard line?

13th and 1.

[Toonage]

As a Seahawks fan I'd like to thank Emily Kaplan for using a football analogy and thus inviting all the gifs and comparisons to Seattle on the 1. Always nice to relive that moment. No one ever talks about the SB they won, just the one they literally gave away.

Back on topic. I'll be pleasantly stunned if Eichel is back after 3 months. Regardless of where he ends up.

[Flame On]

[Saqe]

Originally Posted by Bunk

How many downs has it been on the 1 yard line?

The defense (Buffalo) keeps taking penalties so it moves half the distance to the goal forward, meaning a couple of inches at a time. With diminishing returns. We may never cross the goal line.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Flame On

[Goriders]

Eichel traded in 2023?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by DomeFoam

He absolutely is in the same class of players I mentioned. Matthews has world class players in Marner and Tavares, Nylander. MacKinnon has guys like Rantanen and Landeskog. Who the hell did Eichel have playing in that tire fire Buffalo? Jeff Skinner? Eichel elevated him to a 40 goal player and he got PAID. He's been Buffalo's go to guy for 5 years now, and they never, ever supported him. This is false.

Sigh. I really get tired of this narrative that Eichel had no one to play with. Eichel got to play with Ryan O'Reilly, Evander Kane, Sam Reinhart, Kyle Okposo, Matt Moulson, Jeff Skinner, Connor Sheary, Victor Olofsson, and Taylor Hall to name a few. Not a murder's row of talent, but a number of high end talents there. If Eichel is the world beater and elite talent, then he should be elevating the talent around him, not reliant on other players to make him better. Eichel has never been able to do that, not even with Jeff Skinner who had similar numbers while playing for Carolina. The best comment I've seen in the Eichel discussion of late was from a journalist who stated Eichel is not the guy you build around because he doesn't have the mentality to carry the load. Eichel is best served being a guy on a team who just goes out and plays. As long as we recognize what we are getting and not having unreasonable expectations (too late for that IMO) we could make this work.

[Knightslayer]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Centres when they are fully healthy I would take over Jack Eichel. McDavid, Matthews, MacKinnon. That's it. Draisaitl doesn't count, he is a winger.

Eichel is technically a center but he is average to bad defensively so not sure how that makes a big difference when comparing him to Drasaitl. Draisatl is the better player in all 3 zones.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Sigh. I really get tired of this narrative that Eichel had no one to play with. Eichel got to play with Ryan O'Reilly, Evander Kane, Sam Reinhart, Kyle Okposo, Matt Moulson, Jeff Skinner, Connor Sheary, Victor Olofsson, and Taylor Hall to name a few. Not a murder's row of talent, but a number of high end talents there. If Eichel is the world beater and elite talent, then he should be elevating the talent around him, not reliant on other players to make him better. Eichel has never been able to do that, not even with Jeff Skinner who had similar numbers while playing for Carolina. The best comment I've seen in the Eichel discussion of late was from a journalist who stated Eichel is not the guy you build around because he doesn't have the mentality to carry the load. Eichel is best served being a guy on a team who just goes out and plays. As long as we recognize what we are getting and not having unreasonable expectations (too late for that IMO) we could make this work.

Okposo….Moulson…Sheary… Olofsson… Reinhart (at the time). Come on man.

Your other names presented are a good point though.

[colbym72]

Maybe its our own one yard line

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by jg13

we are seattle and vegas is NE. pretty much exactly whats going to happen

That was just mean.

I had Hawks $300 at 12-1, AND $100 on Lynch for MVP at 10-1.
Not running the ball cost me $4,600.
I'm still bitter.

[The Big Chill]

So it’s on the one yard line, we just don’t know which end of the field, and there are still three teams on the field.

Run the flea flicker.

[Knightslayer]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Sigh. I really get tired of this narrative that Eichel had no one to play with. Eichel got to play with Ryan O'Reilly, Evander Kane, Sam Reinhart, Kyle Okposo, Matt Moulson, Jeff Skinner, Connor Sheary, Victor Olofsson, and Taylor Hall to name a few. Not a murder's row of talent, but a number of high end talents there. If Eichel is the world beater and elite talent, then he should be elevating the talent around him, not reliant on other players to make him better. Eichel has never been able to do that, not even with Jeff Skinner who had similar numbers while playing for Carolina. The best comment I've seen in the Eichel discussion of late was from a journalist who stated Eichel is not the guy you build around because he doesn't have the mentality to carry the load. Eichel is best served being a guy on a team who just goes out and plays. As long as we recognize what we are getting and not having unreasonable expectations (too late for that IMO) we could make this work.

I agree. Some are pretending he's an elite Center. He isn't. Like I've said before, he is an elite player.

That is different than being an elite center. He has the possibility of being one forsure but a lot of people are going to be disappointed if they think they're getting some great 2 way center.

[ComixZone]

…you just listed Matt Moulson, Connor Sheary, Kyle Okposo, Jeff Skinner while arguing against the narrative that Eichel has gotten to play with nothing but garbage?

Oh and Ryan O’Reilly? The guy who was so down in the dumps in Buffalo that it made him hate the sport? Also, he’s a centre.

Taylor Hall? Sure…except Eichel got hurt, and that entire team was a tire fire and coached by a horrid hire.

Sam Reinhart? Yep, Eichel definitely did wonders for his career. Most of Reinhart’s success (especially early in his career) was because they moved him from centre to Eichel’s RW.

Evander Kane? Yeah, okay. Real prize there.

[mdubz]

Originally Posted by Knightslayer

Eichel is technically a center but he is average to bad defensively so not sure how that makes a big difference when comparing him to Drasaitl. Draisatl is the better player in all 3 zones.

Really?