Stabbing in Brentwood-5 Dead, 1 Arrested

[Ozy_Flame]

The fact that he selectively picked to kill five people while sleeping after others had left but believing they were "werwolves and medusas" beforehand (read: vulnerable), and the fact that he wanted "suicide by cop" is indicative to me of pre-meditated intent. His justifications for what he did afterwards are also clear that he know what he did but knew it was wrong - albeit indifferent on most of his victims.

It's only the first day, and he's what many of of thought he was (crazy), but not so crazy as to be completely removed from his reality. Psychotic? Probably. Sociopathic? definitely showing through. He appears to be a bit of both at the moment.

[afc wimbledon]

I have a deeply psychotic lad living with me right now, hears voices sees things, is utterly convinced that a kid he lived next door to is plotting to steal his soul, but he is at the same time normal, essentially he is a normal person reacting to what he believes are real deeply frightening supernatural events.

He's on enough drugs to knock out a rhino but they are doing sod all to help him and the fact that they don't feeds into his delusions, he tells me when I tell him the voices are a symptom of his illness 'if I was psychotic the drugs would work therefore the voices must be real and you are lying to me'

Beyond my ability to cope with, I haven't slept properly in weeks while they look for a better placement for him, at the same time he's a desperately sad kid, his friends are avoiding him because he scares the bejesus out of every one now, but a year ago he was pretty much a normal kid.

[peter12]

I can't even imagine.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I have a deeply psychotic lad living with me right now, hears voices sees things, is utterly convinced that a kid he lived next door to is plotting to steal his soul, but he is at the same time normal, essentially he is a normal person reacting to what he believes are real deeply frightening supernatural events.

He's on enough drugs to knock out a rhino but they are doing sod all to help him and the fact that they don't feeds into his delusions, he tells me when I tell him the voices are a symptom of his illness 'if I was psychotic the drugs would work therefore the voices must be real and you are lying to me'

Beyond my ability to cope with, I haven't slept properly in weeks while they look for a better placement for him, at the same time he's a desperately sad kid, his friends are avoiding him because he scares the bejesus out of every one now, but a year ago he was pretty much a normal kid.

Thanks for this insight, it is near impossible to say what was going through this kids mind at the time of the murders. Part of me thinks that throwing the book at him is in the best interests of everyone, but a more logical empathetic part of me thinks that there is an obvious mental disorder which contributes to an individual having such delusions and the subsequent actions. Having worked with a number of people with severe substance abuse issues in the past (including alcohol in this) I have the feeling that this young man's mind may be gone no matter what is done with future treatments.

[peter12]

I think that we can all rest assured that every effort will be made to investigate this young man's current, and past, state of mind.

He has a history of using mind-altering drugs, as well as a suspected history of mental illness going back to childhood. No word, obviously, on whether mental illness runs in his family.

On the other hand, he seemed to have an awful relationship with his parents. There are texts that show his behaviour was starting to scare his parents.

The hive-mind of the Internet should just stay away from diagnosing the boy. This will, and should be, left to the professionals, and the court.

Successful insanity pleas are remarkably rare. They aren't given out like a little justice escape hatch. So, if it is successful, then we can't allow the mob's groaning for retribution overrule the fact that this young man could be very, very ill.

However, if it does fail, and he does end up being guilty - and responsible - for the murders of 5 young people in the prime of their youth, then I cannot think of a more clear depiction of evil. The court will decide his punishment then.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

The fact that he selectively picked to kill five people while sleeping after others had left but believing they were "werwolves and medusas" beforehand (read: vulnerable), and the fact that he wanted "suicide by cop" is indicative to me of pre-meditated intent. His justifications for what he did afterwards are also clear that he know what he did but knew it was wrong - albeit indifferent on most of his victims.

It's only the first day, and he's what many of of thought he was (crazy), but not so crazy as to be completely removed from his reality. Psychotic? Probably. Sociopathic? definitely showing through. He appears to be a bit of both at the moment.

Well from what I've seen, one was sleeping and people had left to go get McDonald's.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

The fact that he selectively picked to kill five people while sleeping after others had left but believing they were "werwolves and medusas" beforehand (read: vulnerable), and the fact that he wanted "suicide by cop" is indicative to me of pre-meditated intent.

Not indicative at all.

Originally Posted by peter12

The hive-mind of the Internet should just stay away from diagnosing the boy. This will, and should be, left to the professionals, and the court.

Absolutely.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Not indicative at all.
.

I'm curious how you reach that conclusion. From reading today the testimony it sounds like it was definitely pre meditated. He showed up with garlic in his socks. That doesn't happen in the heat of the moment. He even gave one of the boys, a survivor?, a clove and told him he'd need it.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

I'm curious how you reach that conclusion. From reading today the testimony it sounds like it was definitely pre meditated. He showed up with garlic in his socks. That doesn't happen in the heat of the moment. He even gave one of the boys, a survivor?, a clove and told him he'd need it.

No, I was stating that a premeditated event with weird, precise planning ≠ sane mind.

[jayswin]

Oops, sorry Cecil, I realized after that's a quoting issue on my end that led to the confusion. Ozy was implying that the premeditation points towards him possibly not being insane, I cut that part out of the quote.

Violent schizophrenic episodes most certainly can involve premeditation and actually often do, Afc's story offered some insight into the scary world they live in. Most people assume that schizophrenic episodes are where someone just freaks out all of a sudden and commits violence towards whoever's near them (this can also happen). The episodes actually often start way before with voices telling them to do something or explaining that certain people are against them and need to be killed, then in a psychotic state they carry out acts beyond their control.

It's absolutely mind blowing what some of these people go through, it's nothing the average person could even begin to comprehend, yet we'll always attempt to break it down.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Oops, sorry Cecil, I realized after that's a quoting issue on my end that led to the confusion. Ozy was implying that the premeditation points towards him possibly not being insane, I cut that part out of the quote.

Violent schizophrenic episodes most certainly can involve premeditation and actually often do, Afc's story offered some insight into the scary world they live in. Most people assume that schizophrenic episodes are where someone just freaks out all of a sudden and commits violence towards whoever's near them (this can also happen). The episodes actually often start way before with voices telling them to do something or explaining that certain people are against them and need to be killed, then in a psychotic state they carry out acts beyond their control.

It's absolutely mind blowing what some of these people go through, it's nothing the average person could even begin to comprehend, yet we'll always attempt to break it down.

The scary part for me is not the kid, it's the system that's supposed to take care of him, a couple of days after the hospital released him into my care after telling me he was stablized I called them to say he was still hearing voices and evil spirits were still following him, they asked me if the voices were directing him to do anything, I replied not that he'd described it.

'oh that's ok then, call us if that changes'

My fear right now is I am doing just a good enough job of keeping the kid calm that they can ignore his needs and in the long run I am screwing the kid over.

[T@T]

So is this going to be another case of a brutal murderer getting out in 5-6 years because his "meds" make him better?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by T@T

So is this going to be another case of a brutal murderer getting out in 5-6 years because his "meds" make him better?

I don't know, why don't you time travel to 2025 and let us know how it all turned out. Take some of your quotation mark meds with you, I hear they're even better than regular medication.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I don't know, why don't you time travel to 2025 and let us know how it all turned out. Take some of your quotation mark meds with you, I hear they're even better than regular medication.

Please! by 2025 he'll be off the "meds" and considered a perfect citizen and all will be forgotten. I hear even family members of the victims will send him Christmas cards.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by T@T

Please! by 2025 he'll be off the "meds" and considered a perfect citizen and all will be forgotten. I hear even family members of the victims will send him Christmas cards.

Where are you hearing that?

[Flash Walken]

Nm

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I don't know, why don't you time travel to 2025 and let us know how it all turned out. Take some of your quotation mark meds with you, I hear they're even better than regular medication.

Take it easy white knight, its not like what he said is irrelevant.
The CDN justice system is a joke, we all know this, they are going to play the psycho card and the rest will be history. Very unfortunate for the families.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by T@T

Please! by 2025 he'll be off the "meds" and considered a perfect citizen and all will be forgotten. I hear even family members of the victims will send him Christmas cards.

Do you still get a shock of fear at the site of fire?

[icecube]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I have a deeply psychotic lad living with me right now, hears voices sees things, is utterly convinced that a kid he lived next door to is plotting to steal his soul, but he is at the same time normal, essentially he is a normal person reacting to what he believes are real deeply frightening supernatural events.

He's on enough drugs to knock out a rhino but they are doing sod all to help him and the fact that they don't feeds into his delusions, he tells me when I tell him the voices are a symptom of his illness 'if I was psychotic the drugs would work therefore the voices must be real and you are lying to me'

Beyond my ability to cope with, I haven't slept properly in weeks while they look for a better placement for him, at the same time he's a desperately sad kid, his friends are avoiding him because he scares the bejesus out of every one now, but a year ago he was pretty much a normal kid.

I know this doesn't do much to help now, but in time I'm sure they will find the right anti psychotic drugs and the right dose, so that he can tell what's a delusion and what isn't and that he can still function without being a drugged up zombie. It takes time unfortunately.

[icecube]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

The scary part for me is not the kid, it's the system that's supposed to take care of him, a couple of days after the hospital released him into my care after telling me he was stablized I called them to say he was still hearing voices and evil spirits were still following him, they asked me if the voices were directing him to do anything, I replied not that he'd described it.

'oh that's ok then, call us if that changes'

My fear right now is I am doing just a good enough job of keeping the kid calm that they can ignore his needs and in the long run I am screwing the kid over.

That's bogus. I'd insist he be hospitalized until he's doing better. They are likely passing the buck because they don't have a bed for the kid. I wish society did a much better job of caring for our sick people, including those with mental illness.