2018/2019 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

You say that now but what if Bennett and Rittich have massive playoffs. If the Rittich keeps this up for another 25 starts and he will have played north of 50 games with solid starter stats. If we go deep in the playoffs and he is a big reason I could easily see another team taking a long look.

Between the teams that dont need a stsrting G, those that dont have the picks to make a 6 million dollar offer sheet, and those that wont have the cap room.....i have ZERO worry David Rittich will get an offer sheet.....none...nadda.

Thank you to posting the compensation. Makes it even easier to come up with a scenario that would have the Flames backs against the wall. With the cap going up we can assume a slight change in the compensation $ as well.

Yep....those numbers will likely go up commensurate with the cap increase once its calculated.

For instance both Bennett and Rittich could sign short or long term deals that pay roughly $4.5M on the cap and the Flames get a 2nd in return. Bennett at $4.2-4.5 with some brutal bonus structure etc might not be a guarantee the Flames match.

Yeah I would hope the Flames wouldnt match such a stupid offer for Bennett. They are already carrying an anchor contract on that line at this point, no need to take on more water.

[TheIronMaiden]

With the cap going up the Flames are projected to have something like 17 million in space. Even if Tkachuk holds out for Eichel money ( 10M) the Flames will have 7M in cap space for two goalies and Bennett. So that is a tight budget but not impossible.

This to me is all the more reason to keep the first. The Flames will need a healthy stock of ELCs to keep the cost of the bottom six low moving forward.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

With the cap going up the Flames are projected to have something like 17 million in space. Even if Tkachuk holds out for Eichel money ( 10M) the Flames will have 7M in cap space for two goalies and Bennett. So that is a tight budget but not impossible.

This to me is all the more reason to keep the first. The Flames will need a healthy stock of ELCs to keep the cost of the bottom six low moving forward.

and a Hathaway or his replacement and Mangiapane or a replacement.

So even if Tkachuk costs 9..

8 million between Bennett, Rittich, eat bread and Hathaway.

Bennett at 3, Rittich at 3, the other 2 at a million a piece average.

Leaves 1 million in wiggle room....just dont see Tre doing such as you never know when a deal comes that you want to jump on, and to be prevented because you are at the cap?

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

With the cap going up the Flames are projected to have something like 17 million in space. Even if Tkachuk holds out for Eichel money ( 10M) the Flames will have 7M in cap space for two goalies and Bennett. So that is a tight budget but not impossible.

This to me is all the more reason to keep the first. The Flames will need a healthy stock of ELCs to keep the cost of the bottom six low moving forward.

They can also do that through signings, later picks, and college signings. They are not going to need top end talent coming in if they acquire a guy like Stone for at least a few years.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm
Tkachuk-Backlund-Stone
Bennett-Jankowski-Neal
???-Ryan-???

That is a young top-six with Backlund and Neal being the only two older guys. In 5 years when these players are hitting 30, the Flames should look at at a re-tool or re-build at that point.

Every year you have players that just want an opportunity to play and prove themselves. Those last two spots should be reserved for those type of players. Players who are feisty like Bouma and Hathaway who hit everything and bring energy but generally drop-off after a few years. Neither players were first round players but were solid bottom 6 players.

[CanadaMatt]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

With the cap going up the Flames are projected to have something like 17 million in space. Even if Tkachuk holds out for Eichel money ( 10M) the Flames will have 7M in cap space for two goalies and Bennett. So that is a tight budget but not impossible.

This to me is all the more reason to keep the first. The Flames will need a healthy stock of ELCs to keep the cost of the bottom six low moving forward.

The main concern that some folks are having is how to fit Stone intoo the cap. Unfortunately about half a dozen things need to go right for this to happen
- remove Frolik with no salary back
- remove Brodie with no salary back (I hate this)
- sign BSD for 2.5 million (a steal!)
- sign a back-up for 1 million (negligent in a window)
- sign a Chucky for <8 million (thanks Nylander you bastard)
- sign Bennett for 2.5 million (might get done, who knows)
- get Stone for ~8 million (he could likely command more and in better tax jurisdictions...hope he likes his brother enough)
- sign Hathaway for 1 million (surely he’s proven to be worth more than that)

Anything else I’m missing?

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by transplant99

and a Hathaway or his replacement and Mangiapane or a replacement.

So even if Tkachuk costs 9..

8 million between Bennett, Rittich, eat bread and Hathaway.

Bennett at 3, Rittich at 3, the other 2 at a million a piece average.

Leaves 1 million in wiggle room....just dont see Tre doing such as you never know when a deal comes that you want to jump on, and to be prevented because you are at the cap?

Not ideal of course, but it is the price of having a good team. Again, good teams don't stay good without lots of ELC players. It is the best way to get cap relief. It makes players like Bennett, Hathaway, and Mangiapane expendable.

This cap crunch is a big part of the reason I was so unsure about Neals contract. While it is not the ugliest in the world, it sure makes things tight from this year moving forward.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by CanadaMatt

The main concern that some folks are having is how to fit Stone intoo the cap. Unfortunately about half a dozen things need to go right for this to happen
- remove Frolik with no salary back
- remove Brodie with no salary back (I hate this)
- sign BSD for 2.5 million (a steal!)
- sign a back-up for 1 million (negligent in a window)
- sign a Chucky for <8 million (thanks Nylander you bastard)
- sign Bennett for 2.5 million (might get done, who knows)
- get Stone for ~8 million (he could likely command more and in better tax jurisdictions...hope he likes his brother enough)
- sign Hathaway for 1 million (surely he’s proven to be worth more than that)

Anything else I’m missing?

Frolik and Brodie both have value so those deals are makeable. BSD should be given 3.0 mil but the goalie market is weird because there are not a ton of spots for goalies and each year you see regular starters not even get a PTO. Unless you are a vezina level goalie, I just don't see a lot of them making too much money unless you play for the Oilers. Back-up at 1.0 mil is not wishful thinking as there is only 60 spots in the NHL but a lot more goalies then that.. maybe its time to give Gillies or Parsons a chance?

If Bennett wants anything more, he should be traded for picks. 30 point players who have played a bunch of time on the Top 6 shouldn't be making a lot of money on a contending team. Anything more than $2.5 mil is an over payment.

This is a next man up scenario. I guarantee you there are tons of players in the AHL who would love to become an agitator and hit everything to play on the main roster. Hathaway can go make money somewhere else, similar to guys like Nystrom and Bouma.

So, really it's the Tkachuk and Stone contracts that are the question marks as they should be. I guess we will wait and find out.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by keenan87

I would have 0 issues trading Dillon Dube if the return means Mark Stone.

To Ottawa:
1st 2019 (protected for Ottawa, if the Flames draft 20+ this year, they can defer to next season)
Dillon Dube
Michael Frolik
Austin Czarnik

To Calgary:
Mark Stone

I have enough faith in Treliving to make the cap situation work at the end. Frankly, in the off-season, you may even be able to dump Neal+Mangiapane/Pick somewhere.

Why would the Sens want Frolik and Czarnik?
A lot of these proposals seem to be based on the other team doing the Flames a big favor.
Keep in mind the 1st is tracking to be VERY late. Other interested teams will have a higher pick to offer. So the rest of the package has to bridge that gap. That package doesn't do it.
If I'm the Sens GM any offer that doesn't include one of Andersson, Kylington, or Juuso + 1st doesn't get my attention.

Of course I say this while then acknowledging that Ottawa has made some horrendous deals of late. So there's always that...

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Why would the Sens want Frolik and Czarnik?
A lot of these proposals seem to be based on the other team doing the Flames a big favor.
Keep in mind the 1st is tracking to be VERY late. Other interested teams will have a higher pick to offer. So the rest of the package has to bridge that gap. That package doesn't do it.
If I'm the Sens GM any offer that doesn't include one of Andersson, Kylington, or Juuso + 1st doesn't get my attention.

Of course I say this while then acknowledging that Ottawa has made some horrendous deals of late. So there's always that...

Czarnik is the type of player that gets added to big deals like this. Warm body that's signed for next year.

Frolik has value and the other team is not doing the Flames any favour at all. He might not have a lot of value but it's definitely not negative.

I would also happily trade Andersson or Kylington along with the 1st for Stone. The only one I am hesitant on is Valimaki and I can even be convinced on that.

[Toonage]

Ottawa won't want to take salary back, they'd be looking to offload more of it if anything.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Why would the Sens want Frolik and Czarnik?
A lot of these proposals seem to be based on the other team doing the Flames a big favor.
Keep in mind the 1st is tracking to be VERY late. Other interested teams will have a higher pick to offer. So the rest of the package has to bridge that gap. That package doesn't do it.
If I'm the Sens GM any offer that doesn't include one of Andersson, Kylington, or Juuso + 1st doesn't get my attention.

Of course I say this while then acknowledging that Ottawa has made some horrendous deals of late. So there's always that...

This is a good point. While the Flames do have a third round pick, It'll be closer to a 4th than anything. If the Flames trade their 1st, it'll be the second year in a row they don't draft until after the first 100 picks.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Ottawa won't want to take salary back, they'd be looking to offload more of it if anything.

At some point, Ottawa does need to reach the cap floor. Or is that no issue for them? (they do have that gross Ryan contract)

[CanadaMatt]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

This cap crunch is a big part of the reason I was so unsure about Neals contract. While it is not the ugliest in the world, it sure makes things tight from this year moving forward.

I thought this too, but I have subsequently been reliably (and repeatably) informed by some of the CP veterans that this in not the case. Just a heads up...

[868904]

I really don't think the Flames need a Mark Stone type player. They have 4 point per game forwards already and one of them is going to get paid next year.

Another poster suggested Toffoli and I think that is the type of player the Flames should be targeting for the top 6. He'll come a lot cheaper in trade and also cap hit and should be a perfect complement on the RW with Tkachuk and Backlund.

I was thinking:

Toffoli and Clifford for 1st Round Pick, Mangiapane and Czarnik

Kings get young assets and two speedy skilled guys to play now and clear out salary. Kings need to get a lot faster and these two should fit in.

Flames get Toffoli who is signed for a year after this plus they get the toughness in Clifford who can play a regular shift too.

Toffoli could be extended too after his contract ends as he is young enough.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

Not ideal of course, but it is the price of having a good team. Again, good teams don't stay good without lots of ELC players. It is the best way to get cap relief. It makes players like Bennett, Hathaway, and Mangiapane expendable.

This cap crunch is a big part of the reason I was so unsure about Neals contract. While it is not the ugliest in the world, it sure makes things tight from this year moving forward.

I don't necessarily think his contract is a major issue. I think it's the fact that he is under-performing that makes it suck and may become an anchor. Otherwise, the Flames are not in a lot of trouble because of that contract imo.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by goflamesgo18

So what you are really saying is that you would rather have Brodie over Stone because of a positional need and there are zero other options?

Cool. I wouldn't.

That is not at all what I said.

I will phrase my statement in terms I hope you can better follow:

Gio-Brodie-Hamonic is probably one of two or three of the best defense cores in the NHL along with Nashville and San Jose - which is part of why we are a top team in the NHl. These three also allow us to roll four (!) U23 defensemen and never worry. While it's possible cap constraints cause us to lose one eventually, their current combined cap hit effectively gives us a two year window to win a cup before we need to re-tool. It is no coincidence that Frolik and Stone's contracts also expire at the end of the same window.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm-Tkachuk is a very effective group of forwards, all but one who are under team control at high value cap hits. As a power play unit there's not a whole lot you could do to improve upon their fit together, other than maybe replace Monahan with Evgeni Malkin and Tkachuk with Sidney Crosby. Backlund and Bennett also round out our group very well with their play-driving capabilities. Our F core is imperfect but not full of holes.

Mark Stone is an excellent player. In many ways better than Lindholm. But he would be a luxury, not fill some glaring hole. And he probably marginalizes Lindholm on PP1, so you don't just go from four PPG players to five, it doesn't work like that. Someone will lose ice time for him and it may not have the overwhelming impact we want it to have.

Right now the Flames have no glaring hole.

Acquiring Stone, with the intention of moving Brodie to keep Stone is acquiring a luxury while creating a hole that is NOT easy to fix even for a team with cap space.

Top pairing defensemen do not grow in trees, regardless of how skewed peoples' opinion of Brodie is. There's a team that gave away an eventual Hart Trophy winner for a #2 defenseman. And while we have some talented young pieces, they are not presently top pairing defensemen nor should they be expected to be within this current window.

I am against creating a hole on the team to have a luxury.

I am not against acquiring Stone if they can make him fit without creating an unnecessary hole on the team. i love the player. But in a cap world having a team with a strong D core and a strong F core is better than having a team with a strong F core and a questionable D core.

Maybe we don't re-sign Hamonic or Brodie past 2020 and have to re-tool. Very possible. But our window right now is the next two years because of that. Re-tooling after 2020 looks encouraging with Valimaki/Kylington/Hanifin et al but it may take time and by then Gaudreau may be gone. Our real window is the next two years and we need our top 3 for it. Stone as a rental even makes more sense than Stone with some dubious plan to move Brodie for cap space because he makes some turnovers once in a while.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by keenan87

At some point, Ottawa does need to reach the cap floor. Or is that no issue for them? (they do have that gross Ryan contract)

Melnyk isn't getting any playoff revenue, and he's up to his hair plugs in debt. The less money put out for him the better I would think.

Cap compliancy can be achieved or settled in the off season for the Sens.

[Husky]

I'm a big believer in Bennett but if any deal for Stone includes an extension I would be okay with including Bennett in the deal.

Flames today and going forward is a better team with Stone (signed longer term) then without him and Bennett on the team.

[keenan87]

Originally Posted by Husky

I'm a big believer in Bennett but if any deal for Stone includes an extension I would be okay with including Bennett in the deal.

Flames today and going forward is a better team with Stone (signed longer term) then without him and Bennett on the team.

True, but he wouldn't have much value in a trade for Stone. He definitely won't be the centerpiece at least.

[killer_carlson]

I think Bennett gets offer sheeted by the Oilers in the off season