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Old 05-09-2013, 07:35 PM   #861
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Murray centering Adams and Kennedy on the PP.

"Murray has no idea where to go..."

What the hell I guess...
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Old 05-09-2013, 07:37 PM   #862
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God Pens fans annoy me. Just look at all those spoiled #######s.
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Old 05-09-2013, 07:56 PM   #863
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Vitale swung first. He deserved that cross check in the face.
Haha. Wut?
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Old 05-09-2013, 08:32 PM   #864
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Quality > Longevity. Crosby is better than Howe.
If you think Howe is just about longevity, you don't know Howe.

To combine a conversation from he Lindros thread last night, Howe is the greatest power forward of all time, and there is a large gap between him and the rest.

He was dominant for a couple of decades and it is a shame really that his career lasted as long as it did because over time, that has overshadowed how awesome he was at his peak.

Crosby will go down as one of the greats, but he still has a ways to go to pass Howe.

To the poster that said 100 goals and 250 pts if he played in the eighties... so, substantially better than Gretzky? Good luck with that.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:04 PM   #865
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Quiet thread, Pens must have won.

I have to say when it comes to pure skill, Crosby might very well be the best ever. His passing is on another level it's actually too good, his line mates can't keep up with it half the time. Crosby needs a winger that is near the same level, I can't think of anyone in the league that is though.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:10 PM   #866
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Quiet thread, Pens must have won.

I have to say when it comes to pure skill, Crosby might very well be the best ever. His passing is on another level it's actually too good, his line mates can't keep up with it half the time. Crosby needs a winger that is near the same level, I can't think of anyone in the league that is though.
Crosby is good but he's not even on the same planet of Lemieux and Gretzky and I've seen the entire career pro careers of all three players. I didn't see Orr in his prime but I expect a case can be made that he was also more dominating in his time than Crosby. Crosby is a great player but I have yet to see any player dominate the game like Lemieux or Gretzky. They were on another level and Crosby is close but not there and I doubt he will ever get there.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:23 PM   #867
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Vokoun will be starting the rest of the games for this round. I wonder if Fleury gets the start in the next round or if this is it?
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:29 PM   #868
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Vokoun probably starts until he plays bad and loses. Even if he play well in a loss, the Pens would be dumb to go back to Fleury. Barring an unlikely reversal of fortunes, Fleury might have played himself out of Pittsburgh with his horrible showings the last two playoffs.

Can't waste the primes of Crosby and Malkin on a goalie who can't stop a beach ball in the playoffs.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:31 PM   #869
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Crosby is good but he's not even on the same planet of Lemieux and Gretzky and I've seen the entire career pro careers of all three players. I didn't see Orr in his prime but I expect a case can be made that he was also more dominating in his time than Crosby. Crosby is a great player but I have yet to see any player dominate the game like Lemieux or Gretzky. They were on another level and Crosby is close but not there and I doubt he will ever get there.
The first year I remember Mario was 95' but I watched the Pens religiously since then. I realize I missed most of Mario's "best years," so I really can't make a comparison. I will say though that even if he's not as great offensively Sid definitely cares more about the 2-way game than either of those
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:37 PM   #870
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The first year I remember Mario was 95' but I watched the Pens religiously since then. I realize I missed most of Mario's "best years," so I really can't make a comparison. I will say though that even if he's not as great offensively Sid definitely cares more about the 2-way game than either of those
A 2-way game isn't nessasary when you always have the puck, like those two did in theiir prime.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:41 PM   #871
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Crosby is good but he's not even on the same planet of Lemieux and Gretzky and I've seen the entire career pro careers of all three players.
Same. I never said Crosby is on the same level overall as Mario or Wayne. But it is so hard to make comparisons because the game is much more structured now, defenses are so much better, teams and players are acutely scouted etc. What I am saying is for just pure skill, Crosby to me is right up there, maybe even the best. He has power and finesse behind his passes and shots that few players ever had. Crosby can take a pass and then saucer it perfectly to a scoring position better than anyone I've seen, the puck is on his stick for a microsecond then gone.

But to this day I lament the fact that Lemieux became ill and had his career cut short, the guy was unstoppable when healthy.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:49 PM   #872
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I don't think the all time greats would have the separation now that they did then. Just the goalie differences alone are astronomical, those 80's goalies were bad man. Plus the skill level on a a whole is just way better. Then you add on the structure like zamler said ... we'll never see that type of domination of peers again, even if a more talented player exists.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:57 PM   #873
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IMO if you took Crosby in a time machine and plunked him into the middle of the 1980's, he'd easily put up the numbers Gretz and Mario did. He'd skate circles around the plethora of slow, lumbering, pylon defensemen, and forwards who never heard of the term "back check", and destroy the stand up goalies with the rolled up news papers for pads.

It'd be a slaughter.
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Old 05-09-2013, 11:59 PM   #874
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Yeah, most of the elite players right now would eat the 80's alive. Crosby would have rules made to slow him down.
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Old 05-10-2013, 01:54 AM   #875
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The only thing that could hold Crosby back is imposing the technicality that he has to observe the off season routine including cigars and scotch that was Mario's prep for training camp
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Old 05-10-2013, 04:13 AM   #876
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This is going like 1993, the Islanders will rebound on Saturday and force a game 7.
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Old 05-10-2013, 04:44 AM   #877
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Where are you David Volek?
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Old 05-10-2013, 06:36 AM   #878
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You can't compare generations. They're so different. Put Kipper in those small pads, and goalie equipment, his style no longer works. Move Lemieux or Orr to today. Better conditioning for Mario, successful knee surgery for Orr, what could they have done? Give Mike Bossy a composite hockey stick, what could he do? Or Bobby Hull for that matter. He had a 100 + mph slap shot with a 2x4. It's apples to oranges.
Sure, you put Crosby back then, and he'd dominate, but give him the 80's training, and equipment, and the rules, he'd still be one of the best, but he wouldn't be head and shoulders above Mario.
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Old 05-10-2013, 07:31 AM   #879
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Crosby has a hard enough time staying healthy in these pansyfied days. He'd have been killed back in the 80's.
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Old 05-10-2013, 07:31 AM   #880
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IMO if you took Crosby in a time machine and plunked him into the middle of the 1980's, he'd easily put up the numbers Gretz and Mario did. He'd skate circles around the plethora of slow, lumbering, pylon defensemen, and forwards who never heard of the term "back check", and destroy the stand up goalies with the rolled up news papers for pads.

It'd be a slaughter.
If you think Crosby is injury prone now, put him in a time machine back to 1982, with what the standard operating procedures were for defence at the time and it would be a slaughter for someone as well.
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