Breaking: Biden will not seek re-election

[getbak]

Because everyone is a hypocrite, remember it wasn't that long ago when it was the Republicans (and Trump as one of the loudest voices) complaining about the EC when it looked like Obama could lose the popular vote while easily winning the EC.

• In 2008, Obama won the popular vote 52.9% - 45.7%, but won the EC 365 - 173.
• In 2012, Obama won the popular vote 51.1% - 47.2%, but won the EC 332 - 206.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Or the UK, where Labour just won 63 per cent of the seats in parliament with only a third of the popular vote.

Of course, proportional representation has its own problems. It gives more power to fringe parties, makes coalition governments the norm, and those coalitions reliant on back-room wheeling and dealing that can drag on for months and months.

The idea that coalition governments lead to more back-room wheeling and dealing is pretty ridiculous. Coalitions tend to lead to very public and widely covered wheeling and dealing, because it's much harder to hide that you're wheeling and dealing when you have multiple parties involved.

Also, "drag on for months and months..." The US senate has been going between barely functional and completely paralyzed as a decision making branch for two decades now.

It's honestly so bizarre that anyone would defend the US system of governance, it's just so obviously incredibly antiquated and disfunctional.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Itse

The idea that coalition governments lead to more back-room wheeling and dealing is pretty ridiculous. Coalitions tend to lead to very public and widely covered wheeling and dealing, because it's much harder to hide that you're wheeling and dealing when you have multiple parties involved.

Also, "drag on for months and months..." The US senate has been going between barely functional and completely paralyzed as a decision making branch for two decades now.

It's honestly so bizarre that anyone would defend the US system of governance, it's just so obviously incredibly antiquated and disfunctional.

We were discussing FPTP vs PR in general. Going back to the example of the UK, if the latest election used the Scottish system of PR, labour would have won 236 seats instead of 411, taking them well out of majority territory, the populist right-wing Reform UK would have 94 MPs instead of five, and the Green Party 42 seats instead of 4.

Whether you think that would be a better result or not, it would clearly benefit the parties on the extremes. And Labour would have had to enter into three-way negotiations with the Liberal Democrats and Greens to form a government. Those negotiations would likely involve Labour making concessions that Labour voters might not have had in mind and that they had no say over.

[photon]

Originally Posted by GGG

If you look at the interstate electoral compact it’s up to 209 electors approved and 50 pending.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nati...rstate_Compact

So this means that just 11 ECs need to pass the legislation before direct voting of the president will be law. Some republicans have vowed to challange the constitutionality of these bills so that is still potentially an obstacle.

But if you look at potential states that could ratify this. Places like Pennsylvania and Arizona which are fairly purple would be sufficient Wisconsin would put it one seat shy.

Will these current swing states in presidential elections vote to diminish their power? Possibly, it may be valuable for the representatives of these states not to be has heavily correlated with presidential outcomes.

This has always been something I found interesting, would be nice for it to one day just kick in.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by getbak

Because everyone is a hypocrite, remember it wasn't that long ago when it was the Republicans (and Trump as one of the loudest voices) complaining about the EC when it looked like Obama could lose the popular vote while easily winning the EC.

• In 2008, Obama won the popular vote 52.9% - 45.7%, but won the EC 365 - 173.
• In 2012, Obama won the popular vote 51.1% - 47.2%, but won the EC 332 - 206.

Those things are always self serving and partisan. Remember when Trudeau promised that 2015 would be the last FPP election in Canada? Maybe they never intended to, or maybe they realized this is at least somewhat typical

https://www.electoral-reform.org.uk/...he-most-seats/

[calgarygeologist]

Roy Cooper is out of the VP race. He is dropping out.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Itse

It's honestly so bizarre that anyone would defend the US system of governance, it's just so obviously incredibly antiquated and disfunctional.

They have the oldest/second oldest constitution for a democracy (depending on how you view San Marino) and it shows.

Other countries that did theirs more recently have learned from others' mistakes, but the US still treat theirs as if it's infallible, like their founding fathers were prophets.

[Paulie Walnuts]

This weird bit is catching on and I like it. Now apparently JP Mandell was on gay apps and sleeping with men and has a sock fetish.

From banging couches to socks what a weird group.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

This weird bit is catching on and I like it. Now apparently JP Mandell was on gay apps and sleeping with men and has a sock fetish.

From banging couches to socks what a weird group.

The odd thing about the couch stories is it's what the kids in the juvi used to do, boost a box of latex gloves from the nursing station and fill them with lotion or alternatively put two mattress side by side and 'know them biblically', they even had names for the acts, one was called a 'FiFi' and the other a FoFo

[Ozy_Flame]

Has JD denied he's had sex with a couch? John Oliver said he hasn't yet. Avoiding it isn't exactly a no

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Roy Cooper is out of the VP race. He is dropping out.

The more I hear Walz speak the more I like him.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1818097206177550581

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by SebC

They have the oldest/second oldest constitution for a democracy (depending on how you view San Marino) and it shows.

Other countries that did theirs more recently have learned from others' mistakes, but the US still treat theirs as if it's infallible, like their founding fathers were prophets.

And they still mythologize the 'great American experiment' as if they're on the bleeding edge of democracy. Actually they may be, but not leading edge.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Walz and Shapiro both look like strong candidates for VP.

JP is going to get his ass kicked in a debate. Hopefully he has a couch to go home to.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

We were discussing FPTP vs PR in general. Going back to the example of the UK, if the latest election used the Scottish system of PR, labour would have won 236 seats instead of 411, taking them well out of majority territory, the populist right-wing Reform UK would have 94 MPs instead of five, and the Green Party 42 seats instead of 4.

Whether you think that would be a better result or not, it would clearly benefit the parties on the extremes. And Labour would have had to enter into three-way negotiations with the Liberal Democrats and Greens to form a government. Those negotiations would likely involve Labour making concessions that Labour voters might not have had in mind and that they had no say over.

It's so weird that you consider the idea that "the results would reflect the voters better" as a bad thing.

Yeah, the government would have to consider the views of more voters, not just the voters of the biggest party. Oh the shock and horror.

The UK is also a s***show with an extremely antiquated political system.

As for "helping the extremes..." Have you seen the Tories and the GOP? The idea that smaller parties are somehow by default more extreme than larger ones is just not true.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

The more I hear Walz speak the more I like him.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1818097206177550581

same. I think you really can't go wrong between Shapiro, Kelly and Walz, but I'm starting to believe Walz might be the guy.

And while he's apparently not in the race anymore, another shoutout to Pete Buttigieg. Absolute masterclass on Fox News the other day ... he's just incredibly good at this stuff. He'll make a fine president one day.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1817552850995871795