Raptors 2009 offseason thread - Page 4 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moon

Yes meaningless stats like showing that he was such a tremendous rebounder that he was the 9th most used guy off the bench?

I don't care if they had good guys in front of him if he was a difference maker he would have played more minutes. It wasn't like Philly were the class of the East last season.

I realize that the Raps are softer than butter inside and have mentioned it plenty of times on this site but that doesn't change because they bring in a 6'6 PF who is mediocre at best when it comes to rebounding and defense and is completely inept at the offensive end.

There are plenty of guys that offer what Evans does available all the time, hence why he was traded for a guy you said was "the most useless piece of crap possible."

But keep countering people's arguments with the ever strong "you don't watch games" comebacks. It really is a very strong position and clearly shows that you know what you are talking about.

Evans is a mediocre defender and rebouder--I'll let that stupid statement stand as evidence.

Gozer · 06-09-2009, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Spare me that you are anything but a casual fan of the Raps if you don't know what they need.

Can the condescension mate.

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gozer

Whoop, I got here late.

I am THRILLED with this move. Evans is a badly needed upgrade in a lot of areas, and Kapono is addition by subtraction - in my opinion.

Sets up a lot as well. No need to keep PMB now. If they are going to grab Nesto back as well they can dump the Hump. Even with the draft Blair/Hill is out as a pick. They don't need to address that now. Not that they would have grabbed him anyway if Tyreke or Derozan are sitting there as they need the perimeter help more.. I'm hoping for Evans and then we can have the Evans and Evans duo.

flamingreen · 06-09-2009, 03:49 PM

What's really bizarre is that Philadelphia let Kyle Korver walk because they didn't want to pay him the 4+ he was asking. But they then go and trade for Kapono and have to pay him 6.5 million these next two years.

I wanna be like Miikka · 06-09-2009, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gozer

Whoop, I got here late.

I am THRILLED with this move. Evans is a badly needed upgrade in a lot of areas, and Kapono is addition by subtraction - in my opinion.

Exactly, with more minutes Evans will bring in some nice rebounds and brings some more D.

Gozer · 06-09-2009, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

No need to keep PMB now.

Don't know if I agree with that, he earned himself some kinda role last year.

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gozer

Can the condescension mate.

It's a little annoying reading some dufus comment on a deal when you know full well how much this helps the Raps. Heck they even save money on the deal. Such a key weak spot for the Raptors and the first step taken to address it.

Plus they are hard after bringing in GP which will also help on the toughness side. If they could add an athletic guy then in the draft they could change the whole look of the bench. BC with a good start to the offseason.

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gozer

Don't know if I agree with that, he earned himself some kinda role last year.

Energy --yes. Toughness --no. I very much doubt Pops is back. Ditto Joey unless they can't sign Marion or do an S &T. Parker is a maybe though I'm sure they would like to have his scoring off the bench and to have him as backup PG. Though apparently they are going to use Delfino sometimes in that role or so the rumour goes.

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I wanna be like Miikka

Exactly, with more minutes Evans will bring in some nice rebounds and brings some more D.

BC is going to be on Prime Time Sports tonight to discuss the trade.

Gozer · 06-09-2009, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

It's a little annoying reading some dufus comment on a deal when you know full well how much this helps the Raps.

It's even more annoying reading two guys arguing about who understands things better. Make an intelligent argument or let it pass, don't bring the thread down to Fire On Ice type quibbling.
Please!

I think I know the Raps and basketball insideout, I still get more wrong than right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Plus they are hard after bringing in GP which will also help on the toughness side. If they could add an athletic guy then in the draft they could change the whole look of the bench. BC with a good start to the offseason.

GP?

Gozer · 06-09-2009, 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Energy --yes. Toughness --no. I very much doubt Pops is back.

Bargs needs a guy like Pops playing with him, someone who can cover ground quickly and works hard. Bargs isn't lazy, but he has the range of a phonebooth.

moon · 06-09-2009, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Evans is a mediocre defender and rebouder--I'll let that stupid statement stand as evidence.

I guess it is because he is such a good rebounder and defender that he has been such a key member of his teams the last couple of years. Or why he was traded for the most useless piece of crap possible.

Four years ago he was a good rebounder, decent defender. Lately his play has deteriorated, it often does for undersized big men, and he has been reduced to being a mediocre rebounder and defender. He can be useful in limited minutes off the bench playing against second stringers, but to expect him to come in and have a big impact on the Raptors is insane.

Sorry for actually responding to your posts with analysis and showing that I actually have seen the guy play for more than just this season. I know you prefer to ignore what actually happens on the court and just assume that you are the only person who watches BB in Canada, but the fact is Evans is not the guy he was in Denver or Seattle and is unlikely to make the Raptors any better than they were before.

JohnnyFlame · 06-09-2009, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gozer

Bargs needs a guy like Pops playing with him, someone who can cover ground quickly and works hard. Bargs isn't lazy, but he has the range of a phonebooth.

Well only because of injuries is Pops even on the court with him. If they sign Marion it's Bosh and him up front with Bargs. Energy guy is going have to be the 2. If they are going to sign Delfino then he is logical candidate for that role.

Pops wont' beat out Evans for 2nd line duty. He isn't anywhere near as good.

GP is Georgio Printezis(Raptors draft pick) who they are trying to bring in this year to be our backup 3. Tough player who is also athletic and plays in the Greek League at the moment.

Gozer · 06-09-2009, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyFlame

Well only because of injuries is Pops even on the court with him. If they sign Marion it's Bosh and him up front with Bargs.

I don't see Pops starting, but with Bosh in limbo there's no way I let Pops walk with our lack of depth. He might not take the offer for 7/8th man, and then so be it.

killer_carlson · 06-09-2009, 06:51 PM

Evans is a great move. I think this finally spells the end for both Graham and Humphries. (because I do think Rasho comes back this off season as well)

malcolmk14 · 06-09-2009, 06:52 PM

You're right. Evans is a great rebounder. So great, in fact, that he averaged a whopping 7 minutes and 2.0 rebounds per game in the playoffs against Orlando, in a series where Philadelphia desperately lacked rebounding and toughness. [/sarcasm]

bluejays · 06-09-2009, 07:37 PM

Like Gozer said, addition by subtraction. I actually like Kapono's personality, but man on the court that laissez-faire attitude sucked the life out of the team when he was a starter. Being a one trick pony made him a threat last minute, but he fit in nowhere on the team. Evans should provide more toughness, and hopefully more of a killer instinct on the team. I don't think he'll be anything on the team actually, but a good bench guy who keeps the young guys in line. On Colangelo's end, it just saves some money as it really looks like Bosh will be asking for the max, and Colangelo probably has to table an offer that Bosh will be forced to accept or it'll look like he wants to leave the city. I'm just waiting for the other shoe to drop with Colangelo, because I'm certain he hates standing around doing nothing.

Ziggy Lidstrom · 06-09-2009, 07:39 PM

Malcolm and Moon. The raptors have plenty of perimeter oriented guys that cannot really create their own shot: Bargs, Calderon, Graham, Parker not including bosh. I look at this trade like another poster does: Addition by subtraction. Kapono wasn't really a good 6th man at all. He is a 9th guy on a good team. Evans has qualities that lack in our current group of bigs: Toughness, Rebounding and defensive acumen. Sure he is a couple of productive seasons removed from his denver and seattle days, but let's reserve judgement until training camp. I think evans diversifies our front court and sees that we lose a redundant component.

I watched Evans eat up the Rap's poor post defence to collect serious numbers, last year and the years prior.

It breaks down like this.

Kapono - Pros:Good perimeter shooter...Okay team player...
cons: every other part of his game.

Evans - Pros: Rebounding, toughness and defensive awareness...cheaper than JK
Cons: No offensive game, no elite athletic ability. undersized 4.

Thus, we save some cap room (marcus banks can go now too) and we gain a differnt dimension in our bigs' rotation. Sure, we lose an inconsistent dead eye shooter who is easily cancelled out by aggressive perimeter defenders, but he was so inneffective that i hear BC was considering using him as a decoy with a division rival(oops don't tell ed stefanski).

Pardon the shots at JK, but I was so unimpressed with that guy. I remember him going back to UCLA and thought there was no way this guy will be a pro player. Sure enough, he was a 2nd rounder who gets by as a niche player(three's only).

PS, Evans did not get a lot of burn due to their roster having a glut of players at the 345 spots: Dalembert, Ratliff, Brand, Young, Speights, smith and Marshall. Igudola plays the 3 so that's another one to add to the equation.

Evans was redundant there and JK was the redundent white boy, who became the butt of all the viewers' and fans' jokes.

moon · 06-09-2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ziggy Lidstrom

Malcolm and Moon. The raptors have plenty of perimeter oriented guys that cannot really create their own shot: Bargs, Calderon, Graham, Parker not including bosh. I look at this trade like another poster does: Addition by subtraction. Kapono wasn't really a good 6th man at all. He is a 9th guy on a good team. Evans has qualities that lack in our current group of bigs: Toughness, Rebounding and defensive acumen. Sure he is a couple of productive seasons removed from his denver and seattle days, but let's reserve judgement until training camp. I think evans diversifies our front court and sees that we lose a redundant component.

I watched Evans eat up the Rap's poor post defence to collect serious numbers, last year and the years prior.

I agree the Raptors didn't need Kapono and needed a tough inside guy. My point is that they need/can get someone a lot better than Evans.

Considering his numbers overall were so poor I think him "eating up" the Raptors says more about the Raptors then it does about him.

Quote:

PS, Evans did not get a lot of burn due to their roster having a glut of players at the 345 spots: Dalembert, Ratliff, Brand, Young, Speights, smith and Marshall. Igudola plays the 3 so that's another one to add to the equation.

Brand played 29 games, Ratliff 46 (and he sucks badly now), Marshall played 25 (and sucks as well) and Smith didn't even play for them so tough for him to take minutes away.

That leaves 3 legit guys in front of him for most of the season and Brand when he was in there. I personally am not sure why the 4th best big man on the 7th place team in the East is a big addition, or why with his great rebounding and defense he was the 4th guy off the bench, is thought to be a huge addition.

I like the idea of the move but really the player the Raptors needs should be better than Reggie Evans.

I wanna be like Miikka · 06-10-2009, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moon

I like the idea of the move but really the player the Raptors needs should be better than Reggie Evans.

Of course they need a player better then Evans, most of us are just commenting on this trade specifically. Kapono was trash and Evans at least has some hope of contributing to the Raps next year. I don't think anyone is on their knees praising Colangelo, this was an ok move but it has to followed up by much better moves if the Raptors are going to be a playoff team next season.