Legalized Rape in Afghanistan

[Thor]

Besides the obvious legalizing of rape towards married women, this is an added bullet to the heart of women in Afghanistan who daily fear being killed, mutilated, raped for such things as walking alone outside their home, going to school, etc. The very real threat of Honour killings/rape is a daily worry for Afghan women.

The bigger picture is that this is yet another example of why Afghanistan should be pressured to go the exact opposite direction and have women given more rights and protections.

Unfortunately in Islam, the poorer you are the more women are subjugated and treated as property. In Islamic countries the middle class and upper class women walk around looking much more western like in appearance and really out of touch with what the poor are going through, considering in most of these Islamic nations poor people represent a majority.

Its just so sad to keep hearing about this stuff, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Saudi Kingdom... They are all backwards in regards to women's rights and hide under religion to protect those attitudes.

In the end its the poverty and lack of education thats the biggest problem, if you give Afghanistan and other nations access to real education and work then you have something that can start to break down this cycle.

But since we Canadians and the west have invested into Afghanistan we should really be contacting our MPs, our UN rep, etc. The fact that these laws are being passed, the fact that young man who downloaded and printed out womens rights flyers got life imprisonment (down from death my hanging) and now that women are being yet again brought down by a system who treat their women like slaves and objects.

Its very sad.

[ok, ok,....I get it]

perhaps it's time to kill them all and let god sort it out........support our troops!

[HOZ]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

I think it legalizes a species of rape. Doesn't it?

We have a THANKS button....I think a Duuuuude...button is now necessary

[mikey_the_redneck]

Why would a guy want to get married if his wife can say "no"?
What's in it for the guys nowadays you know?

Besides, don't North American wedding vows typically say for the woman to "love and obey" or something like that.......?

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck

Why would a guy want to get married if his wife can say "no"?
What's in it for the guys nowadays you know?

Besides, don't North American wedding vows typically say for the woman to "love and obey" or something like that.......?

I'm pretty sure you're kidding. But you know what? I don' t think it is that funny.

[HPLovecraft]

In anger, I want to say pull out the troops!, but obviously it's an unrealistic assessment. In doing so, you likely not only condone these women to these types of laws, but to famine, death, and much worse.

The Afghan government needs to be pressured into knowing that the only thing holding that place together are foreign lives and blood. This crosses the line. I can understand passing laws with political idea, etc, that go against Western ideas, but when you start to impede basic human rights, that's when it has to stop. That's why we went in there in the first place (besides revenge, of course! ).

Basic human rights are not Western. They're universal.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by HPLovecraft

In anger, I want to say pull out the troops!, but obviously it's an unrealistic assessment. In doing so, you likely not only condone these women to these types of laws, but to famine, death, and much worse.

We shouldn't be there allowing Karzai to keep power if he is going to appease the same groups we're supposedly trying to remove from power in parts of Afghanistan still.

Anyone who knew anything about Karzai before he was installed as leader, knows he is a self-serving prick.

It seems very hypocritical of our government to put sanctions on other petty dictators and then send troops to keep another somewhere else in power.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Support our troops.

Amen Brotha.

[Yeah_Baby]

Don't I support the troops with my tax dollars?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

Don't I support the troops with my tax dollars?

And now your tax dollars go to supporting legalized rape!

Makes me yearn for another gun registry.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

And now your tax dollars go to supporting legalized rape!

Makes me yearn for another gun registry.

So you can shoot me?

[TangerZ]

Originally Posted by Thor

But since we Canadians and the west have invested into Afghanistan we should really be contacting our MPs, our UN rep, etc. The fact that these laws are being passed, the fact that young man who downloaded and printed out womens rights flyers got life imprisonment (down from death my hanging) and now that women are being yet again brought down by a system who treat their women like slaves and objects.

Its very sad.

This was what I was going to mention, and I wholeheartedly agree that we as Canadians, need to contact our representatives to put pressure on our government to help reverse or change these laws passed in Afghanistan. It's absolutely abhorrent that this is happening under the Western world's supposedly mindful and dutiful eye.

On a side note, someone mentioned it in another thread, and I am beginning to notice a common theme against some organized religions in your threads. Not that I care for organized religion, but some of your posts rather peculiarly relate to the crux of the issues under scope. Just saying.

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by TangerZ

This was what I was going to mention, and I wholeheartedly agree that we as Canadians, need to contact our representatives to put pressure on our government to help reverse or change these laws passed in Afghanistan. It's absolutely abhorrent that this is happening under the Western world's supposedly mindful and dutiful eye.

On a side note, someone mentioned it in another thread, and I am beginning to notice a common theme against some organized religions in your threads. Not that I care for organized religion, but some of your posts rather peculiarly relate to the crux of the issues under scope. Just saying.

welll....wouldnt you think that this law has a certain religious undercurrent?

[photon]

Originally Posted by Calgaryborn

The law says(and again none of us have seen the exact wording) that a wife must consent to the sexual demands of her husband. It doesn't say(at least we don't know it does) that a husband has the right to force himself upon his wife if she breaks this law. It might simply mean her husband would have grounds for a divorce if she didn't fulfill his request.

Because forcing himself on her physically would be wrong, but coercing her by threat of divorce (who knows how bad that would be over there) or other psychological abuse is ok.

[Ice]

Stories like this make me wonder why we even bother trying to improve the situations in countries under strict religious rule. Its futile to think that any woman in those cultures will ever be allowed the same rights and respect as men. Meanwhile, troops are dying trying to give people a better life and that will likely NEVER be the outcome. As far as Afghanistan goes, the US troops went there because terrorists set up camp there. Perhaps the mission needs to be something more along the lines of killing the terrorists, destroying their camps and leaving. Let whoever is running that country know that if there is never a chance of real human rights, there's no need for "peacekeeping" forces to be there. The resistance in the name of religion is just too strong.

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Ice

Stories like this make me wonder why we even bother trying to improve the situations in countries under strict religious rule. Its futile to think that any woman in those cultures will ever be allowed the same rights and respect as men. Meanwhile, troops are dying trying to give people a better life and that will likely NEVER be the outcome. As far as Afghanistan goes, the US troops went there because terrorists set up camp there. Perhaps the mission needs to be something more along the lines of killing the terrorists, destroying their camps and leaving. Let whoever is running that country know that if there is never a chance of real human rights, there's no need for "peacekeeping" forces to be there. The resistance in the name of religion is just too strong.

No kidding. They clearly don't want to change, so why are we wasting our time, money and lives over there. The money that the US has pissed away in the middle east would probably bail out every US automaker and launch about a dozen new ones to boot. If we're going to piss away money, might as well do it in our own countries.

[burn_this_city]

Now I'm not much of a theist **Pulls on the suspenders**. But to attribute this to Islam as a whole is wrong. Like any religion there are moderate liberal thinkers and hardlined fundamentalist sh1theads. I'd say this law is solely to appease the hardline Taliban types in that country. Theres an election approaching and he's trying to garner support from these fringe hardliners. Unfortunately part of being a hardliner (wahhabi muslim) involves treating your wife as property rather than as a person. If you actually read the Quran theres nothing in there that justifies these types of laws. This is cultural crap that has been fabricated over the last 1400 years as a means of controlling women.

Sharia law which comes from the Quran and has been expanded by people doesnt place women below men. Infact it treats women equally when talking about family law and divorce. It states that when women and men get divorced all property (dowry) must divided equally. Infact some scholars argue that modern law in the western world originates from Sharia law.

Obviously this kind of law and opinion needs to change. But to attribute this to any religion is wrong. Personally I think most of this fundamental islamification of the middle east comes from the creation of Israel by the UN. After the war most of the liberal thinkers in the islamic world were freeing women from veils and treating them as equals. The hardliners only gained traction when the west started treating muslims as second class citizens. It also doesnt help that the center for spreading Wahhabism is Saudi Arabia, Americas best friend in the gulf.

[Russic]

Afghanistan has always been a tough one for me. I see what we're doing and I of course I support our troops, but I have an ever-present doubt that our efforts will have been useful when we look back on this in a few years. Of course there will always be pockets of success here and there, but in the long run it's hard for me to imagine that a lot of the good we bring to that country won't be turned backwards in a few years. If that turns out to be the case then what did our men and women die for?

Seeing stuff like this is just heartbreaking when you look at all our soldiers have given. The fact that this situation was better when the Taliban was in control is unnerving.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Now I'm not much of a theist **Pulls on the suspenders**. But to attribute this to Islam as a whole is wrong. Like any religion there are moderate liberal thinkers and hardlined fundamentalist sh1theads. I'd say this law is solely to appease the hardline Taliban types in that country. Theres an election approaching and he's trying to garner support from these fringe hardliners. Unfortunately part of being a hardliner (wahhabi muslim) involves treating your wife as property rather than as a person. If you actually read the Quran theres nothing in there that justifies these types of laws. This is cultural crap that has been fabricated over the last 1400 years as a means of controlling women.

Sharia law which comes from the Quran and has been expanded by people doesnt place women below men. Infact it treats women equally when talking about family law and divorce. It states that when women and men get divorced all property (dowry) must divided equally. Infact some scholars argue that modern law in the western world originates from Sharia law.

Obviously this kind of law and opinion needs to change. But to attribute this to any religion is wrong. Personally I think most of this fundamental islamification of the middle east comes from the creation of Israel by the UN. After the war most of the liberal thinkers in the islamic world were freeing women from veils and treating them as equals. The hardliners only gained traction when the west started treating muslims as second class citizens. It also doesnt help that the center for spreading Wahhabism is Saudi Arabia, Americas best friend in the gulf.

This is by far the best post I have ever read from you. Well done!

[Cheese]

Seems like Canadians are quite outraged.

The Canadian government is spending $5 million on a separate project to reform Afghan family law and has been sideswiped by the controversial new legislation.
Prime Minister Stephen Harper said he's deeply troubled by a move which flies in the face of what the international community wants to accomplish in Afghanistan.
"This is antithetical to our mission in Afghanistan," he told a Canadian media outlet in London, where he's attending the G20 summit.
"The concept that women are full human beings with human rights is very, very central to the reason the international community is engaged in this country. . .