Anyone else see that Pro-Life Display on Campus?

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

My post wasn't really about the issue of abortion, but rather the issue of the display.

Personally I thought it was pretty over the top and distasteful, for no other reason that they are using someone else's death to attempt promote their own agenda.

Of course, since they are Jewish or from Rawanda, we don't really care, because they are just statistics and less human than us.

But I'd be pretty upset if that was my mother posted on that billboard.

Um, I think the point is that any life is worth the same, not that Jewish people or Rawandans are worth more or less. (Also, please remember that it wasn't just Jews who were killed during the Holocaust, and babies of all ethnicities are being killed by abortion. It's not about race!)

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

Doesn't that also mean your taxes are paying for it so you have a vested interest nomatter your position?

I would be more concerned with the moral implications as opposed to the cost. Besides I chacked and I found out that my taxes went to pay to send some kids to camp. After paying for that I was tapped.

But my point was that I had never bought the (often American) comment that abortion was being used as a form of birth control. However if it's free then that's a different story. Back in Junior High a friend got an abortion, and it cost her $300, never mind the cost of the trip to the States.

I'm not sure if this bit of info changes my mind or not as to the right or wrong of it.

[evman150]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

No, it has nothing to do with your leftist musings but rather the uninformed ignorance of your leftist musings. I think the MAJORITY of people in this thread are pro-life and agree with you on that. I think many liberals would be pretty much insulted by some of the things you say. Again, you are assuming that we're very conservative here and again it seems more like you are pushing the Alberta stereotype which is also not appreciated.

Also, Voltaire said that he'd defend to the death, your right to SAY something, but I certainly wouldn't defend the right for anybody to DO anything.

Are you kidding me? 90% of this board is "conservative". Or at least 90% of the Albertans. If that's not a valid stereotype...

Tell me then, who else (in general) if not those who are Christian, are "pro-life"?

I may not say it in the best way, but don't ridicule my opinions because of the crappy way in which I state them.

Did I say I was quoting Voltaire? Do you not think I know the quote? Do you think Voltaire ever encountered issues like abortion, ssm, dominatrix etc, or any of the other left/right issues that exist in today's society?

I suppose my statement needs a caveat, which I thought was implied, but I guess not. "As long as it does no harm, mental, physical or otherwise....etc..."

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

Yeah, are you sure about that? Not that I know anyone directly who has, but I thought I heard abortions cost like $800.

Nope. My brother's baby was aborted for free. It's a 'necessary medical procedure'.

[evman150]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

put down the pipe, and back away... nobody should be putting up massive billboards of extremely offensive and violent images in a public place...

I think they should be able to....why not? Because it offends some people? Not a valid reason in my books. These don't sound like "massive" billboards either. It's not like they're highway signs with swastikas on them. Even then....hmmm....

They have a cause, it's ridiculous, but it's a cause, and it deserves to be heard. They may not be presenting it in the most desirable way, that doesn't mean it shouldn't be presented.

I don't think they should be protected by cops though. If they're so zealous in their beliefs they should be able to stand up for what they believe in. Otherwise they shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Censorship is indicative of a regressive society.

[peter12]

Both pro-life and pro-choice infuriate me, they represent a tiny part of the population and have completely polarized the abortion debate. You've got nuts on both sides and really what do they accomplish? Nothing, no democratic debate, no discussion... just idiotic chanting of slogans at one another. Maybe elements of the pro-choice movement have the upper hand, pro-life can't seem to produce the valid arguments to support their position.

As for my own 2-bits, I like just about every Canadian and Albertan am pro-choice. Give me any reason for the legitimacy of legal abortion and I will give you my full intellectual agreement. To roughly quote Aristotle, the more perogatives we have, the more human we are. A woman should always have the choice as to what to do with her body.

However, just like the average Canadian, I am thankful my mother didn't have an abortion. It truly makes me a little bit uncomfortable with the possible desensitization to life that abortion may introduce into our society.
That's where I beleive pro-life is trying to go with their comparisons of genocide to abortion, it's just very extreme, disrespectful and distasteful.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by evman150

Are you kidding me? 90% of this board is "conservative". Or at least 90% of the Albertans. If that's not a valid stereotype...

Tell me then, who else (in general) if not those who are Christian, are "pro-life"?

I may not say it in the best way, but don't ridicule my opinions because of the crappy way in which I state them.

Did I say I was quoting Voltaire? Do you not think I know the quote? Do you think Voltaire ever encountered issues like abortion, ssm, dominatrix etc, or any of the other left/right issues that exist in today's society?

I suppose my statement needs a caveat, which I thought was implied, but I guess not. "As long as it does no harm, mental, physical or otherwise....etc..."

so because a lot of alberta decided not to vote for criminals... we're a bunch of backwards rednecks that are way behind the far superior province of bc?

religion has nothing to do with pro-choice/pro-life. pro-life is not exclusively christian. frankly its offensive that you're making comments like this and its a sad comentary on society when christians can be openly mocked/bashed for their beliefs but if you were to do that on judaism (and now islam) you'd be torn a new one for being politically incorrect.

as for being allowed to do anything as long as it causes no harm, those signs caused me to feel extremely uncomfortable walking to class which i pay a fair chunk of change to be allowed to do. this constitutes mental harm.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

For all of you guys like Azure who say it gets you thinking and you can just turn away - - ->

who's going to be first to raise the gauntlet by posting some grisly bloody pictures in here of aborted fetuses? Are you just going to turn away from your computer screen and let it burn into your brain? That thing is right in the middle of campus just like a picture would be in the middle of this thread, you just see it walking to class and I don't want to see that crap right after I've had breakfast.

I can't argue with that. Can you help it? Sure, file charges, or something. But we all know that the world is filled with many different types of people that will use any method to promote their agenda.

[FireFly]

Originally Posted by ken0042

I would be more concerned with the moral implications as opposed to the cost. Besides I chacked and I found out that my taxes went to pay to send some kids to camp. After paying for that I was tapped.

But my point was that I had never bought the (often American) comment that abortion was being used as a form of birth control. However if it's free then that's a different story. Back in Junior High a friend got an abortion, and it cost her $300, never mind the cost of the trip to the States.

I'm not sure if this bit of info changes my mind or not as to the right or wrong of it.

Well it costs in the US, but not in Canada. God Bless universal health care!

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by evman150

I think they should be able to....why not? Because it offends some people? Not a valid reason in my books. These don't sound like "massive" billboards either. It's not like they're highway signs with swastikas on them. Even then....hmmm....

They have a cause, it's ridiculous, but it's a cause, and it deserves to be heard. They may not be presenting it in the most desirable way, that doesn't mean it shouldn't be presented.

I don't think they should be protected by cops though. If they're so zealous in their beliefs they should be able to stand up for what they believe in. Otherwise they shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Censorship is indicative of a regressive society.

what about something as offensive as a neo-nazi rally. would you support their right to hold that? I believe you were the one (not 100% sure on this, don't feel like checking now that i'm the reply screen) that got their panties in a bunch over "mocking" the holocaust.

and its a good point! next election, i'm going to plaster everything i see with pictures of dead babies EVERYWHERE with the slogan "Vote Liberal. Choose your Canada". I'll do this especially right around the elementary schools. Anyone doesn't like it, they can turn away right? And I believe in my cause and am pushing my agenda so its ok, right? right?

[Thunderball]

Without going into too much detail, it is very important to make sure that abortion is always available to those who need it (rape, life of the mother in peril)... but ways must be made to ensure its not a contraceptive for women who choose not to use any other kind of birth control. Neither camp really has provisions for that. Pro-life says any abortion is evil for religious and secular reasons, and pro-choice says anything that prevents the woman's right to choose is regressive and also evil. That is why both sides irritate me.

[evman150]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

so because a lot of alberta decided not to vote for criminals... we're a bunch of backwards rednecks that are way behind the far superior province of bc?

religion has nothing to do with pro-choice/pro-life. pro-life is not exclusively christian. frankly its offensive that you're making comments like this and its a sad comentary on society when christians can be openly mocked/bashed for their beliefs but if you were to do that on judaism (and now islam) you'd be torn a new one for being politically incorrect.

as for being allowed to do anything as long as it causes no harm, those signs caused me to feel extremely uncomfortable walking to class which i pay a fair chunk of change to be allowed to do. this constitutes mental harm.

Religion has nothing to do with it? Ok then, fine. I said right off the bat that was the impression I was under yet nobody corrected me unitl now, instead labelling me as a moron. Can you blame me though? Whenever you hear of pro-life issues on tv and in the news, inevitably it is fundamentalists in the southern states. I was under the impression it said somewhere in the bible it was wrong. Nobody commented on this statement, instead ridiculing me for being a moron.

Yes you are backward for voting conservative. Sorry, but that's what I think. Don't like the "criminals"? Vote NDP, vote Green, vote Marijuana. Whatever.

And yes, socially, you are behind British Columbia. Of course from your viewpoint you are "ahead". It's all a matter of perspective.

As for your last point, a line has to be drawn somewhere. I guess we're just disagreeing where the line should be. I think it's a little further along, you think it's been passed. I'd really have to see the display myself, but I respect that you have been upset emotionally.

[Azure]

Someone has just been added to the ignore list.

How stupid can you get?

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

Without going into too much detail, it is very important to make sure that abortion is always available to those who need it (rape, life of the mother in peril)... but ways must be made to ensure its not a contraceptive for women who choose not to use any other kind of birth control. Neither camp really has provisions for that. Pro-life says any abortion is evil for religious and secular reasons, and pro-choice says anything that prevents the woman's right to choose is regressive and also evil. That is why both sides irritate me.

ok... i'm going to say this once more... see if you guys can catch this....

PRO-LIFE =/= RELIGIOUS

that's not to say that pro lifers can't be religious but i'm tired of reading this crap that they all are. its simply not true.

and most reasonable pro-life supporters agree that if carrying the baby to term will kill the mother that abortion may be an option. the people that you see demonstrating at the u of c are not your typical or representitive pro-lifers

[Displaced Flames fan]

Here in Wichita, which for some reason is a hotbed for abortion protest, they have taken to handing out their 'literature' to little kids to give to their parents.

Radical pro-lifers are the scum of the earth.

[Freeway]

Originally Posted by evman150

Religion has nothing to do with it? Ok then, fine. I said right off the bat that was the impression I was under yet nobody corrected me unitl now, instead labelling me as a moron. Can you blame me though? Whenever you hear of pro-life issues on tv and in the news, inevitably it is fundamentalists in the southern states. I was under the impression it said somewhere in the bible it was wrong. Nobody commented on this statement, instead ridiculing me for being a moron.

Yes you are backward for voting conservative. Sorry, but that's what I think. Don't like the "criminals"? Vote NDP, vote Green, vote Marijuana. Whatever.

And yes, socially, you are behind British Columbia. Of course from your viewpoint you are "ahead". It's all a matter of perspective.

As for your last point, a line has to be drawn somewhere. I guess we're just disagreeing where the line should be. I think it's a little further along, you think it's been passed. I'd really have to see the display myself, but I respect that you have been upset emotionally.

The Conservatives & Liberals are both centrist, albeit Liberals being left-leaning and Conservatives right-leaning. Beyond that, making broad generalizations about the populaces of provinces based upon their voting histories is just plain ignorant.

[Freeway]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

the people that you see demonstrating at the u of c are not your typical or representitive pro-lifers

I don't think this can be said enough.

[evman150]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

what about something as offensive as a neo-nazi rally. would you support their right to hold that? I believe you were the one (not 100% sure on this, don't feel like checking now that i'm the reply screen) that got their panties in a bunch over "mocking" the holocaust.

and its a good point! next election, i'm going to plaster everything i see with pictures of dead babies EVERYWHERE with the slogan "Vote Liberal. Choose your Canada". I'll do this especially right around the elementary schools. Anyone doesn't like it, they can turn away right? And I believe in my cause and am pushing my agenda so its ok, right? right?

The first paragraph there, that's racism. That is hate. Those are things I am vehemently against.

As for your second point, if you got permission from the party, good luck with that. If not, then get ready to be sued and jailed, and rightfully so. Say it in your name, not in someone else's name.

[Weiser Wonder]

Originally Posted by FireFly

Meh. I don't like the way it's become birth control. Let's look at a few facts, shall we?

There are hundreds of thousands of abortions every year.
At least thousands of those are done as a form of birth control.
(Why? Pills and condoms cost money (I know condoms can be found for free at clinics, but generally 14 year olds don't go to clinics for some reason, perhaps because it's taboo, I'm not sure,) but abortions are free in Canada, great country!)

Whether it's a life or not may be debatable, however those are hundreds of thousands of potential lives that are snuffed out every year. If you do that to babies, what would you call it?

Honestly? I'd call it necessary. When does life start? I'd say birth, because before that it's a part of the mother, and in my opinion that's her call.

Comparing it to genocide of any kind, is ridiculous. There's a difference between a personal decision a group of people torturing, killing, raping and utterly degrading a people, at least in my opinion.

Lastly, I don't find the logic in people seeing abortion as a way out. It sounds horrible, and I don't know anyone who says, "Screw condoms, if it comes to that we'll just abort." Free abortions might encourage this type of irresponsibility, but that's not why it's done. It is done to allow everyone to have access to that type of treatment, which is one thing I love about Canada.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Freeway

I don't think this can be said enough.

Did you see the bald guy in the biker duds getting screamed at by the bevy of FIRE girls?