Friedman's Nov 1st 32 thoughts update on Flames

[Sandman]

I like Hanifin. I’ve defended him before in the past. I feel like he’s a bit underrated, and gets crapped on too much. That said, I don’t think he’s worth anywhere NEAR the value of that contract, and whoever pitched those numbers should go soak their heads for awhile. Ludicrous!

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

...more than $7.25 million AAV?

For Hanifin?

And HE had to break off talks?

What was this team doing?

Sleepwalking!

[kyuss275]

Conroy is getting very lucky right now that Noah and lindholm didn’t sign extensions. IMO flames needed to purge the entire management team in summer. Flames needed outside eyes from organization. Current management is way too close to these players .

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by Locke

And honestly...I DGAF what the players are saying.

I think its pretty clear now that Sutter was the answer, not the problem.

He wins the Jack Adams and then takes this sorry sack of bastards within 2 points of the playoffs?

Problem? He's essentially a miracle worker.

Last year may have been his Magnum Opus. Should retroactively give him the jack Adams.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Conroy is getting very lucky right now that Noah and lindholm didn’t sign extensions. IMO flames needed to purge the entire management team in summer. Flames needed outside eyes from organization. Current management is way too close to these players .

You don’t think Dave Nonis or Jarome Iginla matter much?

I’m not arguing the point of resigning these guys, I don’t think the Flames should at this point and even if there was some incredible turn around I still wouldn’t think the Flames should try to resign them. We’ve seen enough. Time for a new direction.

But I don’t think we know enough to say this management team is too close to the team and is therefore incapable of making tough decisions. Fact is, the only guy they’ve resigned is Backlund and they’ve traded Toffoli. The rest of them (plus others) could be gone by the TDL.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Surely he has some trade value though? Retain half his salary and wouldn’t you get something for the guy. Or maybe he’s radioactive for other reasons.

I agree he’s been bad but not that long ago he was a building block.

Nah, he is in reclamation zone in my opinion. He’s been bad this season and has always been a defensive liability. He’s a guy you don’t hate to have on a stacked team to chip in but he’s not a top 6 guy. I’m still still hoping they can trade him for Frost.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by TOfan

You don’t think Dave Nonis or Jarome Iginla matter much?

I’m not arguing the point of resigning these guys, I don’t think the Flames should at this point and even if there was some incredible turn around I still wouldn’t think the Flames should try to resign them. We’ve seen enough. Time for a new direction.

But I don’t think we know enough to say this management team is too close to the team and is therefore incapable of making tough decisions. Fact is, the only guy they’ve resigned is Backlund and they’ve traded Toffoli. The rest of them (plus others) could be gone by the TDL.

It depends if you believe Hanifin had trade value with a 7.5 million dollar contract. That’s what Rasta implied Conroy thought

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by TOfan

You don’t think Dave Nonis or Jarome Iginla matter much?

I’m not arguing the point of resigning these guys, I don’t think the Flames should at this point and even if there was some incredible turn around I still wouldn’t think the Flames should try to resign them. We’ve seen enough. Time for a new direction.

But I don’t think we know enough to say this management team is too close to the team and is therefore incapable of making tough decisions. Fact is, the only guy they’ve resigned is Backlund and they’ve traded Toffoli. The rest of them (plus others) could be gone by the TDL.

Would love to know for a fact the offers fabled to Lindholm and Hanifin. If $60 million was offered to Hanifin and Edwards told them to take it off the table, I’d be concerned. And not about ownership meddling.

[Vinny01]

I wonder which player the flames were/are debating putting on waivers?

I also noticed in that article how Kent Johnson has hired a new agency firm which was the same group that represented both PLD and Seth Jones. Johnson has been scratched twice this year and I wonder if perhaps he is the target for the Flames on a Lindholm swap?


At 8 years over $7.5M per no wonder Noah was leaning towards staying. This start has been a blessing. Management can’t be fooled like they were after Johnny and Chucky left that there was a contending core left. Time to retool.


I even noticed Francis article on last nights game references a looming rebuild which 2 days ago he said they wouldn’t do

[madmike]

The most frustrating part of that article for me is it sounds like Edwards is meddling again. The guy just can’t help it.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

If #3/4 d-men were getting 7.5 AAV, then no one could afford a competent blue line.

Let's just not use Nurse as a frame of reference for how d-men should be priced. In fact, every team should ignore the Nurse benchmark. It isn't a benchmark, it's stupidity.

Hanifin is routinely ranked in the top 40-45 defenders. He'll get 7M easy where-ever he goes.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by madmike

The most frustrating part of that article for me is it sounds like Edwards is meddling again. The guy just can’t help it.

These takes are wild. Does anyone not work in a management role at their job? If I want to make a change to my team where I give someone a different role or want to hire or fire someone that needs to be run up the flagpole. If this team is going to shift the direction ownership needs to sign off.

It seems like people think a GM should have autonomy to make any move and take the team in any direction they see fit. Unless someone is the sole owner and proprietor of their business then thry have to answer to a boss. When you have capped a team out with long term deals and all of a sudden after 10 games want to drastically change direction then the top of the food chain in the org will get involved.

[Royle9]

Take that Hanifin money and burn it.
Both he and Lindholm can move on, sooner the better.

[Hockey_Ninja]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

These takes are wild. Does anyone not work in a management role at their job? If I want to make a change to my team where I give someone a different role or want to hire or fire someone that needs to be run up the flagpole. If this team is going to shift the direction ownership needs to sign off.

It seems like people think a GM should have autonomy to make any move and take the team in any direction they see fit. Unless someone is the sole owner and proprietor of their business then thry have to answer to a boss. When you have capped a team out with long term deals and all of a sudden after 10 games want to drastically change direction then the top of the food chain in the org will get involved.

Seravalli himself said on Barn Burner that every GM in the league has to answer to ownership. Even the ones who are ok with a rebuild. Edwards isn’t great and definitely shares blame for why the Flames are in the spot they are today. But the posters who think other GM’s don’t have to deal with ownership interference are just wrong

[442scotty]

Hanifin is very overrated by some. Hes a great skater! Trying to think what else he is so great at. He peaked early in his career and is so meh!

[I_H8_Crawford]

Originally Posted by madmike

The most frustrating part of that article for me is it sounds like Edwards is meddling again. The guy just can’t help it.

I read it as he sees that his "get in at all costs" plan won't work, so is open to a "retool" now as opposed to "win-now"

[Strange Brew]

Now we’re mad when the owner says not to sign these guys to eight year contracts?

[traptor]

Maybe im reading too deep into it but judging from that 32 thoughts, the flames are going to try and avoid a rebuild at all costs

They may very well sell the UFAs this seaaon, but I fully expect them to try and be competitive next season.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Would love to know for a fact the offers fabled to Lindholm and Hanifin. If $60 million was offered to Hanifin and Edwards told them to take it off the table, I’d be concerned. And not about ownership meddling.

Not directed at you specifically but I would love to know what’s going on internally. As we all would.

We’ve heard all kinds of speculation here. Seems like a reasonable assumption is the mandate is to compete for a playoff spot year after year. The actions of the organization over an extended period of time bridging multiple GM’s support this. From adding UFA’s and trading draft capital for proven NHLers, opposed to compiling draft capital, it’s pretty clear what the direction is from ownership. Treliving took, and still does, all kinds of criticism for this. But I strongly suspect he didn’t make these decisions on his own. He supported them and executed the plan but I doubt he set the mandate and I suspect, he probably explored options on a few occasions that would have resulted in a retool/rebuild. If many of his critics were in his shoes wouldn’t they have done the same? I would have. I’ll never understand the line of thinking where people think just because it’s occurred to them it hasn’t for someone else. Of course Treliving thought of trades for young assets.

We heard it was Edwards who hired Sutter when many believed Treliving couldn’t have possibly hired him for some made up reason. Now some are saying it’s Edwards slamming on the breaks related to contract negotiations. Edwards being in Edmonton could have been tied to the fact it was a novelty game, or perhaps there was some event centre business, or other business outside of hockey to tend to and made the trip to the game while he was here. Could be many things.

Anyway, the teams is at a crossroads, no question. And it could be that the players are forcing them into a new direction.

[Enoch Root]

When reporters speculate on contract size, they are often quite wrong, and usually to the high side. Friedman is notorious for being way above where they usually end up at (I think it's because he gets much of his information from agents).

Other reports were talking about numbers between Toews and Weegar. I suspect this guy just picked a number a little higher than Toews and ran with it: do some quick math, get a nice round number that will generate click bait, and BOOM, today's work is done!