Biggest Concern in Calgary?

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

I think the problem was Sutter, who really wanted to gift them minutes when they should be getting like 5-6min of icetime per game tops.

I get that people wanted him gone because he was a black hole of possession but there's no denying he brought an element to the team that we are now missing, and not only that - we're feeling it very early into the season too and it's only going to get worse.

Black hole of possession? Black hole is usually used to describe something that is lacking. Possession stats were amazing last season.

[STAMPEDRED]

Originally Posted by bax

Call me crazy, but I don’t really think any of the big contracts are a huge issue. At least not in the short term. The team is being forced into a rebuild so the cap space is whatever and now you have some veterans around for the rebuild.

Kadri’s contract is actually pretty buyout friendly for the last 2 seasons when you’re realistically looking at starting to compete for the playoffs again. The Weegar deal is completely fine. You could trade that contract at some point if you wanted to.

Huberdeau’s is a boat anchor and he’s here for the long haul. This could be a serious issue for the last 3-4 years of the deal, but hopefully with the cap rising it is manageable.

Right now huberdeaus contract is a boat anchor for the next 8 years lol. Boy did we ever get duped on this contract. The wizard got out wizard not by a team in the end, but by a player. Guess that was his Achilles heal sadly as free agent signings got him too in the past and ended with Kadri as well.

[Buff]

1. The compete level
2. Professionalism
3. Skill

A team that has no skill. We should when you look at the roster. Huberdeau is supposed to be the star of the team and I'm not basing that on his contract but what he did in the years before coming to Calgary. He has been non-existent. Was he piggy backing on the likes of Duclair and Bennett and time/space given to him because Barkov got the coverage? Is he truly unhappy here and just content to collect his huge salary and coast? Either he is not as advertised or not happy here or both. We hear hollow words from the so-called top players and leaders of the team.

Their apparent on-ice effort and compete levels are unprofessional and quite frankly a slap in the face of the fans who cheer them on.

We're stuck with Huberdeau and Kadri for many years and we're into the 2nd year of their abysmal performances. Unacceptable for the top two highest paid players on the team.

Now we have to sign Lindholm, Hanifin, Zadorov and Tanev or else replace them?

I have no problems giving out long term contracts but due to the contracts to Huberdeau and Kadri it is undesirable to have out contracts to those four players. Undesirable from the team's perspective and undesirable from those players to want to sign here long term.

We've come to a situation where it is time to dump players and the two we need to get rid of the most are on contracts that are unmovable. Nobody wants those contracts and if they are willing to take them on it will cost the Flames way too much.

I in no way am suggesting this is all on Huberdeau and Kadri but thanks to their contracts and performances they are easy marks to make my point. This is a more widespread issue across the roster.

[camm13]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

After that atrocious heritage classic and now currently third-to-last place after losing 5 straight games, only in front of the lowly Oilers and awful Sharks, I figured this would be a good time to revisit something I asked almost 3 years ago.

We are actually 31/32 with only the sharks behind us. The Oilers win moved them ahead of us with one game less played.


One of the biggest issues is the powerplay. Its been evident during the losing streak but especially last night when we actually got calls go our way and got 2 extended looks 5 on 3...and all they mustered was 3 shots or something, and the puck couldn't be kept in the o zone either. Wasn't savard supposed to be some sort of offensive specialist and savor for the powerplay

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Jordan!

Awfully Creepy that you've noticed - you've been here since 2011 and I have no idea who you are. This was the first game I've watched in it's entirety because I had the ability to do so.. It was streaming on Max app.

Everything else is highlights and twitter clips.

I don't believe you...on either point

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Black hole of possession? Black hole is usually used to describe something that is lacking. Possession stats were amazing last season.

Talking about Lucic not Sutter

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by camm13

We are actually 31/32 with only the sharks behind us. The Oilers win moved them ahead of us with one game less played.


One of the biggest issues is the powerplay. Its been evident during the losing streak but especially last night when we actually got calls go our way and got 2 extended looks 5 on 3...and all they mustered was 3 shots or something, and the puck couldn't be kept in the o zone either. Wasn't savard supposed to be some sort of offensive specialist and savor for the powerplay

I don't think an outdoor game is the best time to critique a power play...ice was ####, puck bouncing like a tennis ball. The other games? Sure

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by camm13

We are actually 31/32 with only the sharks behind us. The Oilers win moved them ahead of us with one game less played.


One of the biggest issues is the powerplay. Its been evident during the losing streak but especially last night when we actually got calls go our way and got 2 extended looks 5 on 3...and all they mustered was 3 shots or something, and the puck couldn't be kept in the o zone either. Wasn't savard supposed to be some sort of offensive specialist and savor for the powerplay

I don't know if the powerplay is a coaching problem or a personnel problem. At times over the season so far, it looked good, and at others it didn't. It's hard to say, but personally, I think it looks more like an execution issue and not a systems one. I think it's just a microcosm of the team as a whole. If they were producing 5-on-5, but not on the PP, I would probably look more to Savard.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Buff

1. The compete level
2. Professionalism
3. Skill

A team that has no skill. We should when you look at the roster. Huberdeau is supposed to be the star of the team and I'm not basing that on his contract but what he did in the years before coming to Calgary. He has been non-existent.

Yes. But this notion that Huberdeau can't be judged based on his contract? He absolutely can. Tkachuk and Gaudreau leaving left a big hole to fill in the room and talent-wise on the ice. It would be unfair to expect him to be something he's not in terms of TKachuk's sandpaper and compete level, but it is not something to expect him to drive the offense somewhat and to take charge of the power play.

Where is the pride? Even if your game has left you somewhat, great players find ways to evolve and there's no reason a guy like Huberdeau cannot be a game changer with the man advantage or in offensive zone time (which he is ridiculously slanted). Those tools don't just evaporate overnight and point squarely at a player that is checked out and doesn't care at all. Many fans seem to give him a pass in this regard and that really irritates me as he's one of the highest paid players in the league, and should at least flashing positively by breaking up plays or making people miss in space if the points aren't coming.

Would any of this be enough to turn the Flames fortunes around? Maybe in conjunction with Kadri doing more of the same it would be, but either way I don't see this group competing for the division even if it did happen, so maybe this is the best option to have the bottom fall right out and ideally finally change the directive of this franchise.

[Regorium]

It has to be ownership. The lack of a rebuild when gifted the perfect opportunity to do so with two high end expiring contracts in Huberdeau and Weegar, with Bedard on the way, screamed like a pure business decision to get taxpayer funding for an arena rather than building a cup winner.

We'll be forced into it, but I really think that if we can solve the ownership problem and actually rebuild (like full on scorched earth tank for a generational prospect level rebuild) now that we have a new arena, we can have a contending team in 5 years.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Yes. But this notion that Huberdeau can't be judged based on his contract? He absolutely can. Tkachuk and Gaudreau leaving left a big hole to fill in the room and talent-wise on the ice. It would be unfair to expect him to be something he's not in terms of TKachuk's sandpaper and compete level, but it is not something to expect him to drive the offense somewhat and to take charge of the power play.

Where is the pride? Even if your game has left you somewhat, great players find ways to evolve and there's no reason a guy like Huberdeau cannot be a game changer with the man advantage or in offensive zone time (which he is ridiculously slanted). Those tools don't just evaporate overnight and point squarely at a player that is checked out and doesn't care at all. Many fans seem to give him a pass in this regard and that really irritates me as he's one of the highest paid players in the league, and should at least flashing positively by breaking up plays or making people miss in space if the points aren't coming.

Would any of this be enough to turn the Flames fortunes around? Maybe in conjunction with Kadri doing more of the same it would be, but either way I don't see this group competing for the division even if it did happen, so maybe this is the best option to have the bottom fall right out and ideally finally change the directive of this franchise.

Just to be clear, I wasn't saying he can't be judged based on his contract, I was merely trying to mention that contract aside he should be held to higher standards. He got that contract based on his performances. They both go together but if you forget about what he makes and see what he used to do, he should be better. He should look better. As you say, he should be finding ways to fit. There is no pride or professionalism from him at all. He took his skill and put it in his back pocket and is keeping his hands full of money in his front pocket.

[saillias]

For me, that Conroy is in over his head managing this

[howard_the_duck]

Concern for me was locking more guys into long-term deals. That's why the poor start I think is a blessing, because even the most staunch advocates for bringing back Lindholm/Hanifin must now be questioning that route.

This will be the most painful year of being a Flames fan I can remember, particularly before Christmas. Moving into the new year and gearing up for the (hopefully) trade deadline returns for some expiring players will at least offer something to look forward to.

For now, it's just pain and a lack of much to be optimistic about. Has to start here, though.

[bax]

Originally Posted by STAMPEDRED

Right now huberdeaus contract is a boat anchor for the next 8 years lol. Boy did we ever get duped on this contract. The wizard got out wizard not by a team in the end, but by a player. Guess that was his Achilles heal sadly as free agent signings got him too in the past and ended with Kadri as well.

Yeah terrible contract, but my point was that it won’t really matter over the next 3-5 seasons because the team is going to be forced into a rebuild and will have cap space out the wazoo.

[Ferarri]

Some great points that address the main issues. I would also add the 'likeability' factor. There isn't anyone on this team that excites me. It's a collection of mediocre pieces that have shown very little pride or desire to win as a group.

Zadorov has been the closest player with that burning desire to win. You can tell he is frustrated and actually cares. A bottom pairing D man as your most passionate player isn't exactly a recipe for success.

The team just feels cold, boring, slow and un-likeable. That should be a concern for management/ownership. I don't want to spend money to watch a bunch of mediocre complimentary pieces skate around and collect a pay cheque. You need to sell hope when you struggle to win and this is a very dark timeline for this franchise.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by bax

Yeah terrible contract, but my point was that it won’t really matter over the next 3-5 seasons because the team is going to be forced into a rebuild and will have cap space out the wazoo.

Huberdeau has been a really good player over his career and his pass-first style of play lends itself to a longer career than, say, a power forward. I refuse to believe he suddenly lost it at his age - I think it’s more a reflection on team makeup (not that I’m excusing him for sucking). Maybe if we luck out on a high-talent high pick it will unlock vintage Huberdeau.

It’s pretty damning if it takes playing with particular players to unlock his talent, but the reward could be high.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by edslunch

Huberdeau has been a really good player over his career and his pass-first style of play lends itself to a longer career than, say, a power forward. I refuse to believe he suddenly lost it at his age - I think it’s more a reflection on team makeup (not that I’m excusing him for sucking). Maybe if we luck out on a high-talent high pick it will unlock vintage Huberdeau.

It’s pretty damning if it takes playing with particular players to unlock his talent, but the reward could be high.

Calgary needs to give him every opportunity to do just that, as they really have no choice.

His fall is really unprecedented, since he was very good for many years.

[camm13]

Originally Posted by dino7c

I don't think an outdoor game is the best time to critique a power play...ice was ####, puck bouncing like a tennis ball. The other games? Sure

I'm pretty sure they didn't have a 5 on 3 goal once last year either. The Oilers didn't seem to have much trouble on their PP on the same ice last night controlling play...

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by edslunch

Huberdeau has been a really good player over his career and his pass-first style of play lends itself to a longer career than, say, a power forward. I refuse to believe he suddenly lost it at his age - I think it’s more a reflection on team makeup (not that I’m excusing him for sucking). Maybe if we luck out on a high-talent high pick it will unlock vintage Huberdeau.

It’s pretty damning if it takes playing with particular players to unlock his talent, but the reward could be high.

Huberdeau set up Lindholm and Kadri with excellent opportunities on the 5 on 3 last - Kadri was 5 feet in front of the net, Lindholm had a step on his man 2-on-1.

Both guys passed. Didn’t even get a shot on goal.

Huberdeau shares in the blame, but it’s clear he has nothing to work with.

They need to get his confidence back - he’s not this bad. But absolutely nobody on the roster sees the game the way he does, and that’s a huge problem.

Huberdeau-Backlund-Coronato the rest of the way.

[atb]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Biggest concern is ownership and what they direct Conroy to do.

Force a trade to try and save this season a la Phaneuf and Jokinen?

Re-tool in the summer again and chase big name UFAs a la Brad Richards?

Good luck selling tickets if Edwards decides to go in that direction. Attendance is down, and will continue to trend down with this version of the team. This is even before considering the huge ticket price increase we will see with a new arena.