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[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Yes. It’s pretty much now proven he was a product of Gaudreau. That said, if he was playing up there IMO he’d be good for double the goals he has, based on the same level of play he has now. The question is - is there a combination that can recreate that even a little bit? It’s not Lucic/Lewis.

He's not capable of checking well enough to play with the Mangiapane's, Coleman's and other middle 6 forwards, and certainly can no longer finish plays or get nasty enough to justify a presence with the top dogs.

Let's remember that he spent about 50 games playing on the top PP unit and still only has the numbers he has. With Monahan, if he isn't banging in 20+ goals a year, there is basically nothing else there. In fact, playing the way he's playing now could be a serious concern going into the playoffs considering how ineffective any line he's on seems to be at 5-5.

Some tough conversations need to be had and I'm really hoping Sutter is prepared to have them. I view a 4th line with Carpenter in place of Monahan as a very hefty improvement and truly balancing out what all 4 lines can achieve.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

He's not capable of checking well enough to play with the Mangiapane's, Coleman's and other middle 6 forwards, and certainly can no longer finish plays or get nasty enough to justify a presence with the top dogs.

Let's remember that he spent about 50 games playing on the top PP unit and still only has the numbers he has. With Monahan, if he isn't banging in 20+ goals a year, there is basically nothing else there. In fact, playing the way he's playing now could be a serious concern going into the playoffs considering how ineffective any line he's on seems to be at 5-5.

Some tough conversations need to be had and I'm really hoping Sutter is prepared to have them. I view a 4th line with Carpenter in place of Monahan as a very hefty improvement and truly balancing out what all 4 lines can achieve.

I don’t know if he’s incapable of playing up - he sure didn’t look bad last time he was with Toffoli and Dube. But if you think Carpenter is a big improvement, I doubt it. He’s not even a regular centre.

ETA: I do think if you aren’t playing Monahan with better wingers, you may as well not play him though. I just don’t have a lot of faith that any centre improves the bottom line if Lewis and Lucic continue to play as badly as they have lately.

[HighLifeMan]

Considering the success Monahan/Mangiapane have had as a duo in limited time this season it really is puzzling that they haven't had an extended look together. It just makes the most sense to me. Hell - Mangiapane's only point in the last seven games came in the one game he played with Sean. Monahan simply will never work with Lucic and Lewis. Both the eye test and analytics support that. I am not sure why Sutter is so insistent on making a combination of those three work.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

Considering the success Monahan/Mangiapane have had as a duo in limited time this season it really is puzzling that they haven't had an extended look together. It just makes the most sense to me. Hell - Mangiapane's only point in the last seven games came in the one game he played with Sean. Monahan simply will never work with Lucic and Lewis. Both the eye test and analytics support that. I am not sure why Sutter is so insistent on making a combination of those three work.

If Sutter was telling the truth, he was concerned for some reason about Toffoli and Lindholm not producing in the last couple games. So the line changes he eventually made kept Monahan where he was.

[YYC in LAX]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

Considering the success Monahan/Mangiapane have had as a duo in limited time this season it really is puzzling that they haven't had an extended look together. It just makes the most sense to me. Hell - Mangiapane's only point in the last seven games came in the one game he played with Sean. Monahan simply will never work with Lucic and Lewis. Both the eye test and analytics support that. I am not sure why Sutter is so insistent on making a combination of those three work.

Monahan has done nothing to claim a spot on the top 3 lines. IMO, he should be in the press box, but he's probably a leader and liked in the dressing room. Appreciating Markstrom would want the first goal back from last night, Monahan's backhand clearing attempt was Tyke-level and unacceptable. He can't play hockey anymore. There's no excuses. He has no skating, no hockey IQ, no playmaking abilities and he's softer than Phil Kessel's body. Faceoff percentage is probably barely above 50% which is one of his remaining positive attributes. Hockey insiders have basically confirmed the Flames have been trying to trade him for three years, but can't find an suitors. He's fallen off harder than Mike Richards did.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

Considering the success Monahan/Mangiapane have had as a duo in limited time this season it really is puzzling that they haven't had an extended look together. It just makes the most sense to me. Hell - Mangiapane's only point in the last seven games came in the one game he played with Sean. Monahan simply will never work with Lucic and Lewis. Both the eye test and analytics support that. I am not sure why Sutter is so insistent on making a combination of those three work.

I thought they were good with Toffoli

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Jarnkrok
Mangiapane - Monahan - Toffoli
Dube - Backlund - Tkachuk
Lucic - Carpenter - Coleman

softens the top line, but really balances things out

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I thought they were good with Toffoli

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Jarnkrok
Mangiapane - Monahan - Toffoli
Dube - Backlund - Tkachuk
Lucic - Carpenter - Coleman

softens the top line, but really balances things out

If you want, you could put Jarnkrok with Backlund and Dube - their styles might mesh. Certainly a decent speed line.

Coleman’s the guy who gets jobbed in that formation.