Calgary Speed limits to be standard 30km/hr?

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Those are expensive, and it's not easy to get the city to put them in.

Why are we only looking at fatalities? The ratio of traffic injuries to fatalities is something like 60:1. There were 1,200 pedestrian casualty collisions in Alberta in 2015, so around 450 in Calgary. If there were 450 Calgarians hospitalized from violent muggings in a year, there's be a mass outrage and calls for drastic government action.

I've always found it interesting how differently we treat fractured skulls, broken arms, sliced tendons, etc. from violent crime vs auto collisions. We dramatically over-estimate the risk of the former and underestimated the risk of the latter. From a utilitarian perspective, we should more effort into reducing fractured skulls from pedestrian heads hitting pavement and the hoods of cars as we do reducing fractured skulls from crow bars and fists hitting heads.

and is there any evidence to show that a fair number (or any) of these injuries are occuring on residential streets? or do they mostly happen on more main/arterial roads, or downtown, roads that this law would not impact at all? seems like we would need some data to back this law change up.

I thought the whole reason we set residential limits at 50 was the assumption if you see you are about to hit someone you slam on the breaks, thereby slowing to ~30 before you hit them, the point at which 90% survive.

[troutman]

The problem with 50 on residential streets is some people will think it is ok to go 60 or 70.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Swarly

and is there any evidence to show that a fair number (or any) of these injuries are occuring on residential streets? or do they mostly happen on more main/arterial roads, or downtown, roads that this law would not impact at all? seems like we would need some data to back this law change up.

I thought the whole reason we set residential limits at 50 was the assumption if you see you are about to hit someone you slam on the breaks, thereby slowing to ~30 before you hit them, the point at which 90% survive.

If only someone had posted that earlier


https://fusiontables.googleuserconte...hml=GEOCODABLE

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by troutman

The problem with 50 on residential streets is some people will think it is ok to go 60 or 70.

some people will still go 60 if it becomes 30km. better make it 20 to discourage that behavior, and if they still do it make it 10. changing the laws rather than enforcing the current one is the only way those extreme outliers will learn.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Swarly

I thought the whole reason we set residential limits at 50 was the assumption if you see you are about to hit someone you slam on the breaks, thereby slowing to ~30 before you hit them, the point at which 90% survive.

That's the beauty of this change. You won't even need to slow down if a pedestrian runs in front of your vehicle anymore. Just keep on trucking, they're most likely going to survive.

[BeltlineFan]

Originally Posted by troutman

The problem with 50 on residential streets is some people will think it is ok to go 60 or 70.

I live on a street somewhere between a residential street and a collector street, it doesn't have a yellow line and has cars on both sides but connects two communities.

I would be okay with people doing 40 or even 50 but it's on a hill and people constantly take their feet off the brake and fly down the hill going 60+, not cool.

[Handsome B. Wonderful]

I don't know if some of the people in my neighbourhood will be able to handle 30 km/h. Their cars apparently only go 20 km/h.

[Flames0910]

Originally Posted by Swarly

and is there any evidence to show that a fair number (or any) of these injuries are occuring on residential streets? or do they mostly happen on more main/arterial roads, or downtown, roads that this law would not impact at all? seems like we would need some data to back this law change up.

Already posted in the thread and in the Notice of Motion. The city’s pedestrian strategy report in 2016 found that 50 per cent of all pedestrian collisions (and 83 per cent of collisions for small children) occur on residential and collector roads within communities.

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

If only someone had posted that earlier


https://fusiontables.googleuserconte...hml=GEOCODABLE

thanks, I saw your map. I meant the other side has yet to show any data supporting this lower speed limit.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Then your 'law' was not fulfilled by my post.

As the arbiter of Shantz's Law, I would say in the context of this particular proposal/law, calling school zones cash cows qualifies.

[ikaris]

Fully supportive of this. I live in between centre street and Edmonton trail and I’m sick and tired of the #######s that speed through our community with no consideration for children.

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by Flames0910

Already posted in the thread and in the Notice of Motion. The city’s pedestrian strategy report in 2016 found that 50 per cent of all pedestrian collisions (and 83 per cent of collisions for small children) occur on residential and collector roads within communities.

So they are starting out by twisting the stats to support their desired outcome then.

Saying that you need to lower residential limits to 30kph because 50% of collisions happen on collector and residential roads is disingenuous. They have the stats for residential collisions, so why are they not using that statistic to justify their position? I'd suspect that they are so low that they needed to lump in collectors to bring the number up to something they can make a fuss about.

They also don't seem to differentiate between collisions where the vehicle was at fault versus a pedestrian at fault, nor do they propose a solution to reduce the amount of collisions caused by pedestrians, even though that represents 50% of all collisions.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by llwhiteoutll

So they are starting out by twisting the stats to support their desired outcome then.

Saying that you need to lower residential limits to 30kph because 50% of collisions happen on collector and residential roads is disingenuous. They have the stats for residential collisions, so why are they not using that statistic to justify their position? I'd suspect that they are so low that they needed to lump in collectors to bring the number up to something they can make a fuss about.

They also don't seem to differentiate between collisions where the vehicle was at fault versus a pedestrian at fault, nor do they propose a solution to reduce the amount of collisions caused by pedestrians, even though that represents 50% of all collisions.

Well with Farrell being behind this we can certainly suspect what the actual end goal is.. the attack on cars!

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by ikaris

Fully supportive of this. I live in between centre street and Edmonton trail and I’m sick and tired of the #######s that speed through our community with no consideration for children.

So a solution to a problem that doesn't exist then? In your area, between Center St and Edmonton Trail and 16th Ave and McKnight, there were a whopping 10 collisions from 1996-2012. One major injury, 6 minor injuries and 3 no injury. Your statement also assumes that you are trained to estimate speed in order to know if a vehicles is exceeding the limit.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by llwhiteoutll

So a solution to a problem that doesn't exist then? In your area, between Center St and Edmonton Trail and 16th Ave and McKnight, there were a whopping 10 collisions from 1996-2012. One major injury, 6 minor injuries and 3 no injury. Your statement also assumes that you are trained to estimate speed in order to know if a vehicles is exceeding the limit.

Oh man, are people ever SO BAD at this! A lot of folks can't even guesstimate well their own speed, in the car they are driving, without looking at their speedometer, but are experts at how fast a car they aren't in is going.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Slava

I think it's for the unmarked, residential roads. Basically where the speed limit is 50km/hr by default today it would be reduced to 30 km/hr.

Next they’ll reduce school zones to 10km/hr then.

[GGG]

Already posted in the thread and in the Notice of Motion. The city’s pedestrian strategy report in 2016 found that 50 per cent of all pedestrian collisions (and 83 per cent of collisions for small children) occur on residential and collector roads within communities.

However you need to know the brake down between collector and residential as collector roads are not affected by this motion. So if we are down to 180 possible accidents that could be prevented each year. If you cut that in half again you are down to 90. Then factor in that 20% are hit and run and you aren't changing those peoples behaviour by change the law and you are down to 75.

So you want to waste 700 years of Calgarians lives to prevent 75 accidents which we know that the majority occur at below 30km/hr already.

[pepper24]

NDP can go ahead and bring in this wimp liberal law but UCP will just abolish next spring after election. Waste of taxpayers money from bloated government waste and the reddest of tape.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by pepper24

NDP can go ahead and bring in this wimp liberal law but UCP will just abolish next spring after election. Waste of taxpayers money from bloated government waste and the reddest of tape.

Wat?

[username]

I'm literally laughing out loud at people complaining that their commute time might go up by one minute.