Lazar vs 2nd round pick

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Anyone who can hire a decent head coach.

In other words, you don't know, but you're sure it must be an easy job.

I do give him credit, he turned 2 firsts and 4 seconds into 2 decent players. Not everyone can do that.

In other words, you have no argument, but you can always double down on sarcasm.

That being said, the Flames will have a real dry pool of prospects in 2021, barring a festivus miracle.

In other words, you're sure every prospect now in the system is going to bust.

I suppose if you ignore every good thing Treliving has done and everything that hasn't had time to produce results yet, yeah, he should definitely be fired.

[Samonadreau]

BT isn't immune to criticism right now but also doesn't deserve to be fired. Only way you justify that is if the 2018 1st is a lottery pick. Then it's don't let the door hit your ### on the way out.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Samonadreau

BT isn't immune to criticism right now but also doesn't deserve to be fired. Only way you justify that is if the 2018 1st is a lottery pick. Then it's don't let the door hit your ### on the way out.

Treliving stuck his neck out with the Gulutzan hire. He'll pay for the coahes failure if it comes to it. Because if this roster fails this year, you're exactly right, Lotto pick is with another team, buh bye.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

In other words, you don't know, but you're sure it must be an easy job.



In other words, you're sure every prospect now in the system is going to bust.

I suppose if you ignore every good thing Treliving has done and everything that hasn't had time to produce results yet, yeah, he should definitely be fired.

Let's actually review everything he has done, and do our best to spot the good moves.

1) He recoups a 7th round pick for McCollum - being Christmas and all I would actually rank this a top 5 trade by BT

2) Lack and Murphy for a 6th round pick and Kanzig - Here BT did the impossible, he lost a trade where he was giving up Kanzig and a 6th.

3) Hamonic and a 4th for a 1st, 2nd and conditional 2nd. He wins this trade if the Flames go to conference finals or beyond in the next 3 years, if not tough to say he wins it. He blows this trade in Seguin fashion if they miss the playoffs. The only real trades this guy wins (even potentially are ones where he is sinking picks in to get the player)

4) Mike Smith for Brandon Hickey, Chad Johnson and a 3rd. Gave himself some insurance in this trade as he may keep a 2nd if they miss the playoffs. He wins this trade if the Flames go deep in the next 2 years, too early to determine if this was actually a good move or if signing Elliott would have garnered the same result for a cheaper price.

5) Lazar trade, looks bad right now.

6) Stone for a 3rd and a 5th. BT wins this trade hands down.

7) Chiasson for Sieloff - another win for BT, when you get the NHL player you win.

8) Elliott for a 2nd and conditional 3rd - BT loses this trade. It is possible that he loses both goalie deals in a 12 month period, which is impressive.

9) Kris Russell for Jyrii Jokipaka, Pollack and a 2nd. BT wins this by recouping assets at the deadline in a year where they were not competitive.

10) Backstrom and a 6th for David Jones - It is Christmas, give BT a win for getting a 6th round pick.

11) Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th. Another BT win, although he must be thankful for the Feaster assets he is able to move for a couple wins at the deadline.

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

13) 2nd for Sven - see above.

14) Hamilton for a 1st, 2nd and 2nd - win for BT, probably his best move.

15) Freddie Hamilton for a 7th round pick. A marginal move, probably equally as good on the waiver wire without giving anything up.

16) Glencross for two 2nds - another win for BT

17) Shore for Knights - a wash

18) Bollig for a 3rd - BT loses, tough to do when giving up a 3rd for a supposed NHL player, but he did it.

So BT is an average trader at best, he is good in two scenario's: when he is recouping assets at a deadline when the Flames are out and when trading all his future picks for right now. Most NHL GM's can accomplish something in those circumstances.

His free agent signings have been putrid and his coach hirings are equally as bad. Trading is his best skill.

Finally my point about the prospects was that we will not have any real 00's and 01's in the prospect pool in 2021, given all the picks we have given up. So right now the only prospects we will have will be 98's and 99's. If you cannot see that BT gutted the prospect pool I do not know what to say.

I would be curious what aspects of the GM job you think he does well? Trades? UFA signings? Coach signings? I like how you reference his "moves that have not had time to produce results yet". This guy basically makes one type of move, win now. He does not make moves for the future. I think I have listed the good things he has done in the trades above.

A quick rundown of the UFA moves I have missed (feel free to put any in the good move category)

Brouwer
Raymond
Hiller
Frolik
Johnson
Versteeg
Grossman

[Red Potato Standing By]

Didn’t Sven ask for a trade?and wasn’t the second the highest that was offered?

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Zethrynn

Didn’t Sven ask for a trade?and wasn’t the second the highest that was offered?

Yes. Sven basically said, trade me or I'm going back to Europe. If any magicians here think BT was offered anything more than a second, you're kidding yourself.

Hartley drove Sven out of town and nearly the NHL.

[Flamescuprun2018]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Let's actually review everything he has done, and do our best to spot the good moves.

1) He recoups a 7th round pick for McCollum - being Christmas and all I would actually rank this a top 5 trade by BT

2) Lack and Murphy for a 6th round pick and Kanzig - Here BT did the impossible, he lost a trade where he was giving up Kanzig and a 6th.

3) Hamonic and a 4th for a 1st, 2nd and conditional 2nd. He wins this trade if the Flames go to conference finals or beyond in the next 3 years, if not tough to say he wins it. He blows this trade in Seguin fashion if they miss the playoffs. The only real trades this guy wins (even potentially are ones where he is sinking picks in to get the player)

4) Mike Smith for Brandon Hickey, Chad Johnson and a 3rd. Gave himself some insurance in this trade as he may keep a 2nd if they miss the playoffs. He wins this trade if the Flames go deep in the next 2 years, too early to determine if this was actually a good move or if signing Elliott would have garnered the same result for a cheaper price.

5) Lazar trade, looks bad right now.

6) Stone for a 3rd and a 5th. BT wins this trade hands down.

7) Chiasson for Sieloff - another win for BT, when you get the NHL player you win.

8) Elliott for a 2nd and conditional 3rd - BT loses this trade. It is possible that he loses both goalie deals in a 12 month period, which is impressive.

9) Kris Russell for Jyrii Jokipaka, Pollack and a 2nd. BT wins this by recouping assets at the deadline in a year where they were not competitive.

10) Backstrom and a 6th for David Jones - It is Christmas, give BT a win for getting a 6th round pick.

11) Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th. Another BT win, although he must be thankful for the Feaster assets he is able to move for a couple wins at the deadline.

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

13) 2nd for Sven - see above.

14) Hamilton for a 1st, 2nd and 2nd - win for BT, probably his best move.

15) Freddie Hamilton for a 7th round pick. A marginal move, probably equally as good on the waiver wire without giving anything up.

16) Glencross for two 2nds - another win for BT

17) Shore for Knights - a wash

18) Bollig for a 3rd - BT loses, tough to do when giving up a 3rd for a supposed NHL player, but he did it.

So BT is an average trader at best, he is good in two scenario's: when he is recouping assets at a deadline when the Flames are out and when trading all his future picks for right now. Most NHL GM's can accomplish something in those circumstances.

His free agent signings have been putrid and his coach hirings are equally as bad. Trading is his best skill.

Finally my point about the prospects was that we will not have any real 00's and 01's in the prospect pool in 2021, given all the picks we have given up. So right now the only prospects we will have will be 98's and 99's. If you cannot see that BT gutted the prospect pool I do not know what to say.

I would be curious what aspects of the GM job you think he does well? Trades? UFA signings? Coach signings? I like how you reference his "moves that have not had time to produce results yet". This guy basically makes one type of move, win now. He does not make moves for the future. I think I have listed the good things he has done in the trades above.

A quick rundown of the UFA moves I have missed (feel free to put any in the good move category)

Brouwer
Raymond
Hiller
Frolik
Johnson
Versteeg
Grossman

Pretty fair and balanced critique. Some points of contention.

I do think he has shown through trade deadline day he can think future too (Hudler, Russell, Glencross trades).

Frolik, Johnson, Jagr and Versteeg were good UFA moves. Jagr is mentoring our youth at worst and may still contribute when the games really count if he can heal his groin. Stealing Versteeg from under the Coilers noses was brilliant. Frolik was his best UFA signing to date and 2nd line player for reasonable cost. Johnson saved our season in Nov/Dec last year and had a 0.930 save percentage for a part of the year.

Sven was an entitled one way player who wanted to leave. We have amazing depth on LW (Gaudreau, Bennett, Tkachuk) so still prefer Rasmus regardless of how many points Sven plays on the 1st or 2nd line of a weak Vancouver team.

Shinkaruk on a tear in AHL this year so still not clear on Granlund trade. Granlund likely would have been lost to waivers the next year.

Lack trade is neutral at worst since a very cheap one year deal with retained salary. Any other UFA goalies would have been more dollars and a longer term contract which makes no sense with Smith and 3 emerging prospects soon ready for NHL. What kind of message is that for Rittich and Gillies if the Flames sign a backup for two-three years and have Smith. He wanted the prospects to play more games at AHL rather than sit on bench for 60 games. Good development strategy.


Foo signing this summer and Rittich signing the year before were wins. No cost for reasonable asset. Many teams were interested and we got both thanks to BT touting the benefits of being a Flame. Rittich might even be a huge win.

Also like a number of prospect signings that are still under the radar. Hrivik, Gawdin, Healey come to mind. No cost and potential for asset growth.

BT is leading our developmental program system. We have absolutely nothing to complain about in that regard with the recent callups (Jankowski, Hathaway, Rittich and Kulak) and Stockton 1st place standing despite young team.

Fundamentally this all comes down to philosophy around contender window. Gaudreau is our best player and for only 5 more years. He is certain to return to Philly area once UFA and has said so. Do we hold off on going for it another year or two and play an unproven starter goalie and unproven top 4 defenseman or do we roll the dice and see if this team can finish high in standings and make a run for it. A calculated gamble that most of us were very in favor of when it happened.

GG is definitely on a short leash and rightfully so. As a players coach I wonder if it is more the long game we win than the short game since he can keep the room in his camp by choosing his battles wisely and getting irritated only when necessary. A tough coach eventually loses the room when trying to crack the whip too often. Hope I am right, but may be quite wrong.

Doubting my optimism but still optimistic for a bit longer. Too many quality personalities in the Flames locker room to lose faith yet.

GG will definitely be the fired at end of season if we "Seguin" our first rounder this year.

I put much of this lacklustre first 35 games on the players who either have been too sloppy or lazy to get any consistency going. Despite the Canadiens game I am seeing improvement recently.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Let's actually review everything he has done, and do our best to spot the good moves.

1) He recoups a 7th round pick for McCollum - being Christmas and all I would actually rank this a top 5 trade by BT

2) Lack and Murphy for a 6th round pick and Kanzig - Here BT did the impossible, he lost a trade where he was giving up Kanzig and a 6th.

3) Hamonic and a 4th for a 1st, 2nd and conditional 2nd. He wins this trade if the Flames go to conference finals or beyond in the next 3 years, if not tough to say he wins it. He blows this trade in Seguin fashion if they miss the playoffs. The only real trades this guy wins (even potentially are ones where he is sinking picks in to get the player)

4) Mike Smith for Brandon Hickey, Chad Johnson and a 3rd. Gave himself some insurance in this trade as he may keep a 2nd if they miss the playoffs. He wins this trade if the Flames go deep in the next 2 years, too early to determine if this was actually a good move or if signing Elliott would have garnered the same result for a cheaper price.

5) Lazar trade, looks bad right now.

6) Stone for a 3rd and a 5th. BT wins this trade hands down.

7) Chiasson for Sieloff - another win for BT, when you get the NHL player you win.

8) Elliott for a 2nd and conditional 3rd - BT loses this trade. It is possible that he loses both goalie deals in a 12 month period, which is impressive.

9) Kris Russell for Jyrii Jokipaka, Pollack and a 2nd. BT wins this by recouping assets at the deadline in a year where they were not competitive.

10) Backstrom and a 6th for David Jones - It is Christmas, give BT a win for getting a 6th round pick.

11) Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th. Another BT win, although he must be thankful for the Feaster assets he is able to move for a couple wins at the deadline.

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

13) 2nd for Sven - see above.

14) Hamilton for a 1st, 2nd and 2nd - win for BT, probably his best move.

15) Freddie Hamilton for a 7th round pick. A marginal move, probably equally as good on the waiver wire without giving anything up.

16) Glencross for two 2nds - another win for BT

17) Shore for Knights - a wash

18) Bollig for a 3rd - BT loses, tough to do when giving up a 3rd for a supposed NHL player, but he did it.

So BT is an average trader at best, he is good in two scenario's: when he is recouping assets at a deadline when the Flames are out and when trading all his future picks for right now. Most NHL GM's can accomplish something in those circumstances.

His free agent signings have been putrid and his coach hirings are equally as bad. Trading is his best skill.

Finally my point about the prospects was that we will not have any real 00's and 01's in the prospect pool in 2021, given all the picks we have given up. So right now the only prospects we will have will be 98's and 99's. If you cannot see that BT gutted the prospect pool I do not know what to say.

I would be curious what aspects of the GM job you think he does well? Trades? UFA signings? Coach signings? I like how you reference his "moves that have not had time to produce results yet". This guy basically makes one type of move, win now. He does not make moves for the future. I think I have listed the good things he has done in the trades above.

A quick rundown of the UFA moves I have missed (feel free to put any in the good move category)

Brouwer
Raymond
Hiller
Frolik
Johnson
Versteeg
Grossman

Love how fans get to cherry pick when it comes to analysis.

Unfortunately part of being a GM is risk. You're not going to win every trade or every signing. No none does. Further all these moves were likely discussed and analyzed by a group of hockey executives, not just BT.

Without getting too long winded, suggesting we won't have any prospects/draft picks come 2021 is premature. The 2018 draft isn't until June. The Flames have plenty of time to acquire draft picks if they choose to.

Sorry to say, but the essay you just wrote is moot.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

Seriously? A player with 9 points in 36 games while getting 16 minutes of ice time a game and power play time is playing chess? And where would he even fit in our line up?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Seriously? A player with 9 points in 36 games while getting 16 minutes of ice time a game and power play time is playing chess? And where would he even fit in our line up?

Hunter has 12 points in the AHL, do not sell him short.

I suspect Granlund could compete with Brouwer, Stajan or Lazar for a spot in the lineup.

[Eric Vail]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I really like Lazar as a person, I think he’s a phenomenal interview as well. But as a player, he leaves a lot to be desired. I’ve said this before, but our pro scouting has been a failure. Very few hits and too many misses that have come back to hurt this team.

They targeted guys like Lazar, Brouwer, Bollig, Raymond, Hiller, Chiasson, F Hamilton, Elliott, Shinkaruk and etc while jettisoning useful guys like Paul Byron, Sven Baertschi, Markus Granlund and etc in the process is not a good track record nor does it give me a ton of confidence in our pro scouting department.

You need a more complete list to compare, otherwise it is cherry picking. How about Versteeg, Frolik, Jagr, Smith and Stone? You can't leave all of them out of an evaluation.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Hunter has 12 points in the AHL, do not sell him short.

I suspect Granlund could compete with Brouwer, Stajan or Lazar for a spot in the lineup.

So basically he's a 4th liner or fringe NHL'er. Major loss.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Hunter has 12 points in the AHL, do not sell him short.

I suspect Granlund could compete with Brouwer, Stajan or Lazar for a spot in the lineup.

At the time this trade was made, its probably not unfair to say that Flames management felt Granlund was replaceable and Hunter had the higher upside. Given their depth chart it was a move they, obviously, felt they could make.

Regardless, do you think the Flames would be better if Granlund was on our fourth line today?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Love how fans get to cherry pick when it comes to analysis.

Unfortunately part of being a GM is risk. You're not going to win every trade or every signing. No none does. Further all these moves were likely discussed and analyzed by a group of hockey executives, not just BT.

Without getting too long winded, suggesting we won't have any prospects/draft picks come 2021 is premature. The 2018 draft isn't until June. The Flames have plenty of time to acquire draft picks if they choose to.

Sorry to say, but the essay you just wrote is moot.

If BT is acquiring 2018 picks, this season has been an abject failure. Who are you trading for those picks? Johnny? Monahan? Backlund? Maybe Lazar for a 2nd?

BT built a team to win now, he traded all his picks for a shot this year and next, and right now he has nothing to show for it. His team is barely ahead of the Edmonton Oilers, except the Oilers have all their picks in 2018 and 2019.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Let's actually review everything he has done, and do our best to spot the good moves.

1) He recoups a 7th round pick for McCollum - being Christmas and all I would actually rank this a top 5 trade by BT

2) Lack and Murphy for a 6th round pick and Kanzig - Here BT did the impossible, he lost a trade where he was giving up Kanzig and a 6th.

3) Hamonic and a 4th for a 1st, 2nd and conditional 2nd. He wins this trade if the Flames go to conference finals or beyond in the next 3 years, if not tough to say he wins it. He blows this trade in Seguin fashion if they miss the playoffs. The only real trades this guy wins (even potentially are ones where he is sinking picks in to get the player)

4) Mike Smith for Brandon Hickey, Chad Johnson and a 3rd. Gave himself some insurance in this trade as he may keep a 2nd if they miss the playoffs. He wins this trade if the Flames go deep in the next 2 years, too early to determine if this was actually a good move or if signing Elliott would have garnered the same result for a cheaper price.

5) Lazar trade, looks bad right now.

6) Stone for a 3rd and a 5th. BT wins this trade hands down.

7) Chiasson for Sieloff - another win for BT, when you get the NHL player you win.

8) Elliott for a 2nd and conditional 3rd - BT loses this trade. It is possible that he loses both goalie deals in a 12 month period, which is impressive.

9) Kris Russell for Jyrii Jokipaka, Pollack and a 2nd. BT wins this by recouping assets at the deadline in a year where they were not competitive.

10) Backstrom and a 6th for David Jones - It is Christmas, give BT a win for getting a 6th round pick.

11) Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th. Another BT win, although he must be thankful for the Feaster assets he is able to move for a couple wins at the deadline.

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

13) 2nd for Sven - see above.

14) Hamilton for a 1st, 2nd and 2nd - win for BT, probably his best move.

15) Freddie Hamilton for a 7th round pick. A marginal move, probably equally as good on the waiver wire without giving anything up.

16) Glencross for two 2nds - another win for BT

17) Shore for Knights - a wash

18) Bollig for a 3rd - BT loses, tough to do when giving up a 3rd for a supposed NHL player, but he did it.

So BT is an average trader at best, he is good in two scenario's: when he is recouping assets at a deadline when the Flames are out and when trading all his future picks for right now. Most NHL GM's can accomplish something in those circumstances.

His free agent signings have been putrid and his coach hirings are equally as bad. Trading is his best skill.

Finally my point about the prospects was that we will not have any real 00's and 01's in the prospect pool in 2021, given all the picks we have given up. So right now the only prospects we will have will be 98's and 99's. If you cannot see that BT gutted the prospect pool I do not know what to say.

I would be curious what aspects of the GM job you think he does well? Trades? UFA signings? Coach signings? I like how you reference his "moves that have not had time to produce results yet". This guy basically makes one type of move, win now. He does not make moves for the future. I think I have listed the good things he has done in the trades above.

A quick rundown of the UFA moves I have missed (feel free to put any in the good move category)

Brouwer
Raymond
Hiller
Frolik
Johnson
Versteeg
Grossman

This list comes off as attempting to fill a narrative more than a chronological tale of a GM's work, especially with some of the pithy comments. However, there are some good points in there. Yes, Brad does tend to really sink picks when he sees a player he wants.

What is still on the table though, imo, is his ability to recoup those picks. He's already shown he has this skillset in spades (a second and third for Glencross? That was filthy) and I believe he'll do that again in the next few seasons.

He definitely deserves some criticism, but I think he gets a bit of retooling/trading and a much needed second coaching hire before we can truly assess the ability of a rookie GM.

[jayswin]

Many GM's correct mistakes, retool, hire new coaches along the way in their rebuilds and we don't hang it on other GM's as job ending mistakes/corrections. We're hyper focused on this team because we're passionate fans. I mean if we were Lightening fans we likely would have been trying to push Yzerman into the guillotine ourselves in his early days and look at them now.

Brad has done a ton of good, with some bad and will get way more leash than some on here seem to believe. Although, it's shrinking a bit with this much young talent and poor on ice results.

He'll get his second coaching change, and if I were him I'd jump on it now. Next season Brad's clock will start ticking if we're still a bubble team.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

If BT is acquiring 2018 picks, this season has been an abject failure. Who are you trading for those picks? Johnny? Monahan? Backlund? Maybe Lazar for a 2nd?

BT built a team to win now, he traded all his picks for a shot this year and next, and right now he has nothing to show for it. His team is barely ahead of the Edmonton Oilers, except the Oilers have all their picks in 2018 and 2019.

Brodie.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

If BT is acquiring 2018 picks, this season has been an abject failure. Who are you trading for those picks? Johnny? Monahan? Backlund? Maybe Lazar for a 2nd?

BT built a team to win now, he traded all his picks for a shot this year and next, and right now he has nothing to show for it. His team is barely ahead of the Edmonton Oilers, except the Oilers have all their picks in 2018 and 2019.

It's fine to miss out on picks for one season if he can recoup and stock up for the next. I don't think he's going to get much this off season and that's fine.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Brodie.

If we trade Brodie it will be for scoring help up front, not for a pick.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Let's actually review everything he has done, and do our best to spot the good moves.

1) He recoups a 7th round pick for McCollum - being Christmas and all I would actually rank this a top 5 trade by BT

2) Lack and Murphy for a 6th round pick and Kanzig - Here BT did the impossible, he lost a trade where he was giving up Kanzig and a 6th.

3) Hamonic and a 4th for a 1st, 2nd and conditional 2nd. He wins this trade if the Flames go to conference finals or beyond in the next 3 years, if not tough to say he wins it. He blows this trade in Seguin fashion if they miss the playoffs. The only real trades this guy wins (even potentially are ones where he is sinking picks in to get the player)

4) Mike Smith for Brandon Hickey, Chad Johnson and a 3rd. Gave himself some insurance in this trade as he may keep a 2nd if they miss the playoffs. He wins this trade if the Flames go deep in the next 2 years, too early to determine if this was actually a good move or if signing Elliott would have garnered the same result for a cheaper price.

5) Lazar trade, looks bad right now.

6) Stone for a 3rd and a 5th. BT wins this trade hands down.

7) Chiasson for Sieloff - another win for BT, when you get the NHL player you win.

8) Elliott for a 2nd and conditional 3rd - BT loses this trade. It is possible that he loses both goalie deals in a 12 month period, which is impressive.

9) Kris Russell for Jyrii Jokipaka, Pollack and a 2nd. BT wins this by recouping assets at the deadline in a year where they were not competitive.

10) Backstrom and a 6th for David Jones - It is Christmas, give BT a win for getting a 6th round pick.

11) Hudler for a 2nd and a 4th. Another BT win, although he must be thankful for the Feaster assets he is able to move for a couple wins at the deadline.

12) Granlund for Shinkaruk - This is where it starts getting ugly. Dim Jim sees BT coming from a mile away and he owns him each and every time. BT should not trade with dim Jim, dim Jim is playing chess while BT is playing snakes and ladders.

13) 2nd for Sven - see above.

14) Hamilton for a 1st, 2nd and 2nd - win for BT, probably his best move.

15) Freddie Hamilton for a 7th round pick. A marginal move, probably equally as good on the waiver wire without giving anything up.

16) Glencross for two 2nds - another win for BT

17) Shore for Knights - a wash

18) Bollig for a 3rd - BT loses, tough to do when giving up a 3rd for a supposed NHL player, but he did it.

So BT is an average trader at best, he is good in two scenario's: when he is recouping assets at a deadline when the Flames are out and when trading all his future picks for right now. Most NHL GM's can accomplish something in those circumstances.

His free agent signings have been putrid and his coach hirings are equally as bad. Trading is his best skill.

Finally my point about the prospects was that we will not have any real 00's and 01's in the prospect pool in 2021, given all the picks we have given up. So right now the only prospects we will have will be 98's and 99's. If you cannot see that BT gutted the prospect pool I do not know what to say.

I would be curious what aspects of the GM job you think he does well? Trades? UFA signings? Coach signings? I like how you reference his "moves that have not had time to produce results yet". This guy basically makes one type of move, win now. He does not make moves for the future. I think I have listed the good things he has done in the trades above.

A quick rundown of the UFA moves I have missed (feel free to put any in the good move category)

Brouwer
Raymond
Hiller
Frolik
Johnson
Versteeg
Grossman

#9 is a win and #6 ?? both can't be wins.

#14 Hamilton for Boesser and 2 2nds? Or Barzal or Connor.... not a clear cut win unless the Flames draft poorly out of the #15 spot.

#3 Hamonic looks really bad. He was coming off a bad year in NY ... the Islanders are a better team without him and better than the Flames with him.

# 5 Looking at the numbers of NHL players the Flames have drafted in the 2nd round and their NHL impact and Lazar is not at all a bad trade. He has more NHL games with the Flames (28) than the sum total all the Flames last 7 2nd round picks (4).