[PGT] Flames Lose Split Squad Games

[FBI]

Not specifically directed at you transplant, but I'm getting a little tired of the complaining that the game isn't rough and tumble like the eighties anymore. I get it, there's not as much fighting and huge hits. Hockey is still effin awesome and I don't get why people are still watching if they really don't like it anymore. There was one guy yesterday with a huge rant about this and it's getting OLD.

Unwatchable? I'm just pumped that hockey is back. I'm still waiting for some footage so I can watch games where we sucked just to check out the chemistry and young players etc. instead of complaining that the game isn't the same, why don't we focus on things like skill and finesse while still enjoying the rough stuff when it DOES come.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Well finally got a chance to see the replay of this. Talk about overreaction on your part. Clownish behaviour? That would be Yakupov sliding across the rink on his knees. This kid did a small fist pump. Big whoop.

Some people sure make mountains out of molehills.

It's 5-1. Your team just got blown out in a game where they didn't make it 5-1 until three minutes earlier. Don't celebrate - you have nothing to celebrate. Ryan Strome knew enough not to celebrate his 5-0 goal.

I have nothing against celebrations - I actually thought Yakupov, while over the top, was at least sort of okay because of the context of the goal.

AHL players who were 1st round picks four years ago should skate to the bench.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by FBI

Not specifically directed at you transplant, but I'm getting a little tired of the complaining that the game isn't rough and tumble like the eighties anymore. I get it, there's not as much fighting and huge hits. Hockey is still effin awesome and I don't get why people are still watching if they really don't like it anymore. There was one guy yesterday with a huge rant about this and it's getting OLD.

Unwatchable? I'm just pumped that hockey is back. I'm still waiting for some footage so I can watch games where we sucked just to check out the chemistry and young players etc. instead of complaining that the game isn't the same, why don't we focus on things like skill and finesse while still enjoying the rough stuff when it DOES come.

I'm glad you enjoy it. I certainly don't as much as I once did and for the reasons i mentioned. I hope it's OK to have that point of view?

I'm not talking about fighting, though that was always a by-product when the game was played with the emotion displayed years ago. Skill and finesse were always part of the game, as I mentioned. Again though, it's the passion that is missing. It's like watching robots at times. People complained last year when Johnny got his finger broken on a blatant slash...where was the response? There wasn't one. That's the kind of stuff Im talking about.

Its funny, Warrener was just on the radio and saying the exact same thing. He was at the game last night and said there was nary even a body check in the first 10 minutes. Against the friggin Oilers? Unwatchable stuff. He never played in "rough and tumble 80's".

[442scotty]

I like the fact that the league is cracking down on stick work. There were a lot of calls that normally would be garbage but they need to call everything when the sticks get up anywhere near the hands. That way both the refs and the players will get used to it and things like Gaudreau's broken finger will be a thing of the past. The crackdown will reward us with more exciting play.

[flylock shox]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I'm glad you enjoy it. I certainly don't as much as I once did and for the reasons i mentioned. I hope it's OK to have that point of view?

I'm not talking about fighting, though that was always a by-product when the game was played with the emotion displayed years ago. Skill and finesse were always part of the game, as I mentioned. Again though, it's the passion that is missing. It's like watching robots at times. People complained last year when Johnny got his finger broken on a blatant slash...where was the response? There wasn't one. That's the kind of stuff Im talking about.

Its funny, Warrener was just on the radio and saying the exact same thing. He was at the game last night and said there was nary even a body check in the first 10 minutes. Against the friggin Oilers? Unwatchable stuff. He never played in "rough and tumble 80's".

I tend to agree with you, and think it's largely a byproduct of the game and the players being overcoached (or heavily coached, if you prefer). It takes spontaneity out of the game to an extent, and removes both errors and creativity, in addition to reducing big hits and fighting in favour of discipline and positioning.

My main gripe - other than the lack of jam that's so often on display - is the muffling of both skilled play and errors due to the format of the game and the level of coaching. Watching the Young Stars tourney, it occurred to me how much the game would benefit from the rink just being expanded a foot or two in every direction. With the speed of the game, the size of the players, and the level of coaching, skilled players are always being asked to stickhandle in a phonebooth. If they just had another half second, or another couple of feet of space, we'd see less chip and chase and more skilled plays, and more defensive errors, making for a more entertaining game.

[jaikorven]

The refs were overboard in my opinion on the slashing calls. If they call it this way continually it will mess with the flow of the games. Here's hoping they relax it a bit and just call the dangerous ones not the ones that barely brush the glove.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by jaikorven

The refs were overboard in my opinion on the slashing calls. If they call it this way continually it will mess with the flow of the games. Here's hoping they relax it a bit and just call the dangerous ones not the ones that barely brush the glove.

I think the hope is that with a fierce crackdown in the preseason players will adjust and infractions will greatly diminish in the first few weeks of the regular season. This is exactly like what I recall of the start of the 2005 season.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by jaikorven

The refs were overboard in my opinion on the slashing calls. If they call it this way continually it will mess with the flow of the games. Here's hoping they relax it a bit and just call the dangerous ones not the ones that barely brush the glove.

Got to remember it is preseason for them too. I have to think that after the games the refs would have been debriefed, there would have been examples made in the tapes of what should and shouldn't be called and how to proceed. Plus it is new to the players so that will take an adjustment period.

I expect it to flow into the first month but by November I expect the calls to have calmed down significantly.

[Finger Cookin]

Even with the valid point about young players not going out to try and make an impression or making a name for themselves, I think you'll see more emotion when the games actually count and aren't meaningless split squad games where 2/3 of the roster in each game is simply trying to not get hurt.

Also, refs shouldn't worry about managing the flow of the game. Call penalties as they're written in the rulebook, and let the players adjust or not. They're refs, not managers.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by Jbo

I know it is pre-season, but I thought Smith looked awful tonight, given his comments about coming into training camp motivated.

I don't want to get down, but a team as fragile as the Flames have been in net, need a guy that doesn't give up such softies.

Smith is all talk. But expect him to allow 1 goal next game with a .970 sv%

Very inconsistent goaltender

[tvp2003]

Last year Elliott was lights out in the preseason (0.83 GAA, .962 Sv%). So was Hiller and Ramo (and Ortio) the year before.

If a lackluster preseason is how we reverse that trend, I have no issues with it.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Bouw N Arrow

Smith is all talk. But expect him to allow 1 goal next game with a .970 sv%

Very inconsistent goaltender

Oh yeah!?!

Well Hickey won't sign with you!

[Kovaz]

It's also the first game of the pre-season. The last thing either team wants is to up the pace physically, and then end up with someone important getting injured by a tweener trying to make a name for himself.

I hope they tone back the calls a bit before the regular season, but at the same time this is exactly what I wanted to happen, so I think it's just as much if not more on the players to adjust. That breakaway penalty by Brodie is a classic example. Sure, he barely touched Khaira, but what is Brodie trying to do there, if not whack him on the hands and mess up his shot? That's exactly the type of play that injured Gaudreau last year, but if you call it with zero tolerance the hope is players stop doing it.

As for evaluating players, I thought Gaudreau looked dangerous every time he had the puck. In particular, he was more decisive with his passing than I remember from last year. Might be just a tad quicker this year too.

Bennett looked really good in the Edmonton game as well. Should've had two beautiful assists but Poirier and Hrivik each dropped the ball. Can't wait to see what he'll do this year.

Dube also stood out to me. I can easily see him being a Frolik-like player in the NHL sooner than later. Just a non-stop motor and a great skater. I loved his hustle to set up Jankowski's goal - made the Larsson-Klefbom pair look bad.

I thought Gio and Brodie were both pretty bad. They made more bad decisions than I'm used to from either of them. Gio's giveaway on the Yamamoto goal was horrific, and Brodie's timing when standing up at his own blueline was really off. Probably just rusty, but I'll start getting concerned if they look like this 3 games from now.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Was at the game tonight too.

Smith was bad, agreed, wasn't sharp. In fact if he stops the two softies Calgary wins so that was the difference.

Jankowski looked alright. I think he's overrated on these boards but he didn't look out of place. His puck handling seemed poor though. Seemed to constantly bobble it or couldn't seem to control it very well.

Gaudreau and Monahan I thought looked good which was encouraging. Ferland is not a top line RW and I wish he would go back to what made him which is hitting and mucking it up.

The NHL product seems to focus on the refs and some of the calls tonight were ridiculous. I can't remember a preseason game where there was no fights, and I've probably been to a preseason game just about every year since the mid 90's. The NHL product taking fighting and even hitting seems removed from the game just sucks any energy out of the sport. It really just isn't that interesting without that raw intensity or emotion which comes from the physical play. There was a moment where Draisaitl was being a ###### bag to Giordano and they both got called on the play. They went to the box and were chirping each other. I thought something might come of that... a hit... a fight... a something but no looks like they peacefully and diplomatically resolved their issue through discussion in the penalty box. Talk about boring.

Kylington made a nice move at the blue line once. Dube should have scored on a breakaway, barely missed the last part of a nice deke.

Brouwer should be cut, legitimately. I'm not sure he is a NHL player.

Mangiapane took a penalty when the refs decided in one of those moments that the game was about them, so somewhat unfair to him. Still, not sure he's a NHLer.

Hamonic looked not noticeable (in a good way for a dman). Brodie played good. Valimaki was smooth but unnoticeable in a good way.

Gillies I thought looked good. I hope the Flames are quicker to move kids into the roster if we get goaltending like Smith showed tonight so we don't burn 1/4 of a season on subpar NHL goaltending.

That's about my thoughts tonight.

Thanks Really good summary..

It is really hard to tell how good the Flames are when a soft goal goes in. If the soft goal is stopped it changes the flow of the game. Maybe the team that gets a soft goal would work harder to get a good goal or play tougher defense without the lead.

I doubt that soft goals were near as a big thing with Smith in Arizona. It will be interesting how Smith stands up to the fan outrage when he lets in a softie. He plays as poorly in the first 3-4 games in the regular season and he will not want to read CP or the Calgary papers.

It is pretty obvious that Ferland is not a top-6 forward talent. If the league listens to the Gaudreau lobby and banishes slashing from the game there is no reason or rationalization that most skilled player available not be put on the big line.

Hudler was a 30-year old with a history of 40-55 pts seasons before he got 76 with Gaudreau/Monahan. Versteeg is 31 and a solid 40-50 pt scorer through his career. Is that move just too obvious?

[Love]

Let's see how many he reels in with that one

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

The first two games of PRESEASON and they were split squads...

Can we atleast give the new tandum more then a day?? Post like these are tough to read - the sky isn't falling, the season hasn't started, there is still time for them to show value...

I don't care if it is warm up, stop an easy shot. Too many face palms after goals last night. I know it didn't cost us anything in the standings, but the guys playing in front of these goaltender can see these things finding their way into the net too, which has to be pretty tough and give them PTSD flashbacks to the Anaheim series. Yeah, there is time to right the ship, but holy crap, both the vets looked horrible.

You can't compare goalies right now this year to last year; it's ridiculous to say last years tandum was better than this years based on a split squad viewing.

I'm not projecting them based on last night's games. I making a projection on watching them the last few years. I really don't think we improved ourselves in net like some are suggesting. I've never been a Lack fan, even when he was a legend in Vancouver. I've had to watch way too much of Mike Smith and know just how hot and cold he is, and when he is cold he gets hot-headed. I'm desperately hoping they can provide the tending we need, but my head does not agree with what my heart is telling me. My fingers are crossed so hard they are breaking.

[dammage79]

It's pre season. I don't care if they go 0 for. As long as they can get the kinks out before game #1 and can accumulate points consistently from the get go things will be gravy.

Still think there's room for more scoring. Hopefully Bennett is the answer along with a few other guys like Shinkaruk and Jankowski and Foo.

[Journey17]

Did anyone else notice that Brodie and Hamonic were split up in the third period. Something to watch to see whether one of the young dmen plays with Hamonic on the third pairing to even out the pairings.

I agree with the other commentators that Dube really stood out. I can't wait to see him versus a more experienced lineup. I'd like to see him without a thug on his line. I loved his play in the young stars.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by New Era

I don't care if it is warm up, stop an easy shot. Too many face palms after goals last night. I know it didn't cost us anything in the standings, but the guys playing in front of these goaltender can see these things finding their way into the net too, which has to be pretty tough and give them PTSD flashbacks to the Anaheim series...

Prove it.

[Flash Walken]

I remember when Brian Elliott was amazing in pre-season