Jankowski vs Bennett - Battle for the #3C?

[getbak]

Jankowski has played 1 NHL game and taken 8 NHL faceoffs. Bennett has played 159 NHL games and taken 1164 NHL faceoffs.

When Jankowski was the age that Bennett is now, the Flames sent him back to college to play his senior year because they thought he still needed another year of development before turning pro. Bennett has played 2 full NHL seasons at the same age.

[handgroen]

i think you let both guys play centre, bennett on the third line, and jankowski on the fourth. i know there's a danger in trying to develop 2 young centres at once but they're going to be getting some amazing suppourt from the back end, and i think jankowski will be defensively responsible enough, he doesn't seem like he'll be a liability.

FORWARDS
(lh)gaudreau - (lh)monahan -(lh)ferland

(lh)tkachuk - (lh)backlund - (lh)frolik

versteeg(rh) - (lh)bennett - lazar(rh)

(lh)stajan - (lh)jankowski - brouwer(rh)


OR

you decide to move bennett to the wing. if this is the case i might want him playing with backlund, utilize his motor and hope for "the backlund effect" to pull his game up.

FORWARDS
(lh)gaudreau - (lh)monahan -(lh)frolik

(lh)tkachuk - (lh)backlund - (lh)bennett

versteeg(rh) - (lh)jankowski - lazar(rh)

(lh)stajan - (lh)stajan - brouwer(rh)

we're sitting pretty on the back end.

DEFENCE
(lh)giordano - hamilton(rh)

(lh)brodie - hamonic(rh)

(lh)kulak - stone(rh)

and just for fun

PK1
(lh)frolik - (lh)backlund

(lh)giordano - stone(rh)

PK2
(lh)jankowski lazar(rh)

(lh)brodie - hamonic(rh)

PP1
(lh)gaudreau - (lh)monahan - (lh)bennett

(lh)brodie - hamilton(rh)

PP2
(lh)tkachuk - (lh)backlund - (lh)frolik

(lh)giordano - stone(rh)

[Flamenfame]

Originally Posted by getbak

Jankowski has played 1 NHL game and taken 8 NHL faceoffs. Bennett has played 159 NHL games and taken 1164 NHL faceoffs.

When Jankowski was the age that Bennett is now, the Flames sent him back to college to play his senior year because they thought he still needed another year of development before turning pro. Bennett has played 2 full NHL seasons at the same age.

I think Bennett breaks out this season in a big way.

[MarkGio]

I think Jankowski will play on the wing for most of the year, and then moving to centre when Stajan gets scratched or traded. Hopefully he plays some games as a centre next year.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I would imagine that last season's centers will start this season as the centers.

I love Jankowski, and have loved him since the pick was originally made. I do think he has the skill-set to develop into a top-line center. I don't think that will happen on the Flames, but that is how highly I regard Jankowski.

With that being said, for those that think that Jankowski is a BETTER defensive center than Bennett, consider this. When Jankowski was first drafted, one of the big question marks was his defensive acumen. Even more of a question mark considering the level of hockey that he was playing at, and the corresponding quality of competition.

I think it is safe to assume that most people on these boards now see him as this defensive stalwart (and rightfully so!). He is NOT going to come in and play defence at a high level off the bat. He is going to have to further develop that, but his base is already quite high and I don't expect it to be a long-term issue at all.

I also urge people to look at Monahan and remember his trajectory. He came into the NHL having a better than average defensive game. He was still sheltered, and Hartley worked with him extensively on his defensive game. People forget how Monahan was becoming quite the defensive stalwart. Remember when Backlund and Stajan were both hurt to start the season? Monahan was tasked with shutting-down the opposing team's best lines, and he was actually doing a pretty good job at it. However, his offensive game started to disappear, and Hartley had that talk with him about needing to provide offence and not being too worried about defence. He did the same thing with Backlund as well. I still think Hartley is undeservedly criticized at times on these boards - I thought he did a fantastic job in developing Calgary's players.

Hartley started working on Bennett' defensive game too last season. This season, Gulutzan has really worked on Bennett as well. Tough love for a while with a lot of benchings, but Bennett is really responding. When you look at his defensive acumen when he first entered the league, and how he finished last season off, it seems like 2 completely different players. Bennett has made MASSIVE strides. Bennett IS developing along nicely. He still has more developing to do, but there is no question that his defensive game has taken a huge step. I expect him to get even better this season.

I really think it is too soon to toss out the idea of Bennett at center. People are looking at his offensive stats more than anything. Although Textcritic (rightfully) pointed out how well Bennett was performing with Brouwer (which ended when Brouwer broke his hand and completely evaporated offensively), I feel that Bennett could use wingers that play with more pace.

Down the line, I really do think on RW that a Lazar or Poirier would compliment Bennett really well. This season, I would be ecstatic if his wingers were Versteeg and Jankowski. Not quite the blazing speed that Bennett provides, but two players that are more skilled.

Jankowski will get his chance as a center. Monahan, Backlund, Bennett - eventually one or more will have an injury. Jankowski would just slide to center at that point.

Jankowski started his NCAA career on the wing. It seems that hasn't negatively impacted his development at center, has it? I think a season on the wing would be a great start for Jankowski to adjust to the speed of the NHL, as well as the overall skill and physicality. I think him either playing on Backlund's wing or on Bennett's wing makes a whole lot of sense. He will get his chances at center this year. Bennett is a very aggressive player, and though I do think his propensity for taking offensive zone penalties are a thing of the past, he will probably be in the box now and then. Slide Janowski over to center when their shift comes up, bring up a winger from the 4th line, and hopefully that line doesn't miss too much.

In time, the cream will rise to the surface. I just look at it like Team Canada. Look how many natural centers they select every year. I don't care if all 12 forwards on the Flames are natural centers. In fact, that would probably make this team even more difficult to play against.

Jankowski probably does a few things better than Bennett does as a center right now, but I bet you that Bennett does a few things better than Jankowski does as well. The development that Bennett has done has been massive. Jankowski can definitely benefit from the lower responsibility of being a winger to get acclimated to the NHL. Let's see what happens during his first season.

Just because the Flames start off with Monahan, Backlund, Bennett and Stajan as the centers, doesn't necessarily mean that they will finish that way. I bet that Lazar will eventually take over for Stajan closer to the end of the season, and Jankowski will at least get some time as a center.

[jonkaupp]

I don't think most posters suggesting Bennett going to the wing are doing so because they don't think Bennett can play center but because everyone here envisioned Bennett as a first line high point producing player and there just clearly is no room for that in the top two Center positions. Bennett, imo, has proven he can play center but he hasn't proven he can play center and produce offensively, particularly with two very good centres in front of him. In my thinking, we would likely get a lot more production out of Bennett on the first line as a winger and then if there is an injury to either Backlund or Monahan, he would simply slide over to the center position. Fact is he just won't get enough ice time to truly ever be the player we think he is if he's stuck behind the two guys in front of him. Jankowski on the other hand is probably a more natural center and is viewed largely and a middle lines type player so it makes sense to start him as your third line center (assuming he proves so in camp and beyond).

Joe Pavelski seems like a good comparable, he is a natural center who plays on the wing because he clearly belongs on the top line. Bennett will never blossom into the 70-80 point guy I think he is if he remains stuck at 3C. And it's not a matter of just proving he should be a top 2 center because we have very good known commodities in those positions already.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I would imagine that last season's centers will start this season as the centers.

I love Jankowski, and have loved him since the pick was originally made. I do think he has the skill-set to develop into a top-line center. I don't think that will happen on the Flames, but that is how highly I regard Jankowski.

With that being said, for those that think that Jankowski is a BETTER defensive center than Bennett, consider this. When Jankowski was first drafted, one of the big question marks was his defensive acumen. Even more of a question mark considering the level of hockey that he was playing at, and the corresponding quality of competition.

I think it is safe to assume that most people on these boards now see him as this defensive stalwart (and rightfully so!). He is NOT going to come in and play defence at a high level off the bat. He is going to have to further develop that, but his base is already quite high and I don't expect it to be a long-term issue at all.

I also urge people to look at Monahan and remember his trajectory. He came into the NHL having a better than average defensive game. He was still sheltered, and Hartley worked with him extensively on his defensive game. People forget how Monahan was becoming quite the defensive stalwart. Remember when Backlund and Stajan were both hurt to start the season? Monahan was tasked with shutting-down the opposing team's best lines, and he was actually doing a pretty good job at it. However, his offensive game started to disappear, and Hartley had that talk with him about needing to provide offence and not being too worried about defence. He did the same thing with Backlund as well. I still think Hartley is undeservedly criticized at times on these boards - I thought he did a fantastic job in developing Calgary's players.

Hartley started working on Bennett' defensive game too last season. This season, Gulutzan has really worked on Bennett as well. Tough love for a while with a lot of benchings, but Bennett is really responding. When you look at his defensive acumen when he first entered the league, and how he finished last season off, it seems like 2 completely different players. Bennett has made MASSIVE strides. Bennett IS developing along nicely. He still has more developing to do, but there is no question that his defensive game has taken a huge step. I expect him to get even better this season.

I really think it is too soon to toss out the idea of Bennett at center. People are looking at his offensive stats more than anything. Although Textcritic (rightfully) pointed out how well Bennett was performing with Brouwer (which ended when Brouwer broke his hand and completely evaporated offensively), I feel that Bennett could use wingers that play with more pace.

Down the line, I really do think on RW that a Lazar or Poirier would compliment Bennett really well. This season, I would be ecstatic if his wingers were Versteeg and Jankowski. Not quite the blazing speed that Bennett provides, but two players that are more skilled.

Jankowski will get his chance as a center. Monahan, Backlund, Bennett - eventually one or more will have an injury. Jankowski would just slide to center at that point.

Jankowski started his NCAA career on the wing. It seems that hasn't negatively impacted his development at center, has it? I think a season on the wing would be a great start for Jankowski to adjust to the speed of the NHL, as well as the overall skill and physicality. I think him either playing on Backlund's wing or on Bennett's wing makes a whole lot of sense. He will get his chances at center this year. Bennett is a very aggressive player, and though I do think his propensity for taking offensive zone penalties are a thing of the past, he will probably be in the box now and then. Slide Janowski over to center when their shift comes up, bring up a winger from the 4th line, and hopefully that line doesn't miss too much.

In time, the cream will rise to the surface. I just look at it like Team Canada. Look how many natural centers they select every year. I don't care if all 12 forwards on the Flames are natural centers. In fact, that would probably make this team even more difficult to play against.

Jankowski probably does a few things better than Bennett does as a center right now, but I bet you that Bennett does a few things better than Jankowski does as well. The development that Bennett has done has been massive. Jankowski can definitely benefit from the lower responsibility of being a winger to get acclimated to the NHL. Let's see what happens during his first season.

Just because the Flames start off with Monahan, Backlund, Bennett and Stajan as the centers, doesn't necessarily mean that they will finish that way. I bet that Lazar will eventually take over for Stajan closer to the end of the season, and Jankowski will at least get some time as a center.

I agree with almost everything you have said, with the exception that I wouldn't break up the Flames' best possession/shutdown line, at least not at the beginning of the season.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

I agree with not playing either on the fourth line. Given the comments from the coaching staff regarding Bennett at centre, do you think Jankowski returning to AHL is a foregone conclusion?

No, I think Jankowski will be given an opportunity to make the team. If he does make it then the coaching staff has some lineup questions to figure out.

Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski

Do you see centre as Bennett's best position (I guess I mean extracting the most offense out of him)?

Some of the best I've seen of him was when he was playing wing on Backlund's line. I'm sure we could easily develop him at centre and he'd be fine. But if you HAVE to move one of them to the wing then here are the reasons why I think Bennett makes a better winger than Jankowski:

1) Bennett is extremely tenacious along the boards. He's like a dog on a bone after the puck. Gritty, greasy. I feel like part of his game is diminished at centre.
2) Bennett has the speed and skill to beat people down the wing. I think he can take people on one on one and beat them.
3) From what I've seen Jankowski is more of a natural playmaker with better vision.
4) Jankowski has been strong on face-offs in his career.

Let's not forget Bennett started on the wing in junior. And early on in his draft year there were criticisms that he didn't use his line mates enough. Maybe I've missed a lot of them but I don't recall a ton of sweet Bennett set ups to other people. I feel like the centre is the distributor and the wingers and the ones who wanna hold onto the puck and beat guys one on one, along the boards, behind the net, etc.

Basically I see Jankowski as a big, playmaking centre. Bennett to me seems like a tenacious puck hound with tremendous puck skills. I haven't seen enough of his vision to be convinced he'll be a better threat long term at centre than Janko. That said I didn't watch a ton of Stockton and not as much of the Flames last year as I would have liked to. So my impressions may be dated, biased or skewed. But that's how I see it.

[CliffFletcher]

Can someone explain to me what about Bennett's play makes him a strong centre? I was under the impression that the qualities that earmark a centre are:

* Vision

* Puck distribution

* Defensive awareness and responsibility

Those qualities don't jump out at me when I watch Bennett play.

[EldrickOnIce]

^ I agree
I keep 'feeling' like he's a bit in over his head. So the natural reaction is to do it yourself, and I don't think there has been much progression in these areas.
If Jankowski has those qualities, Bennett would be a fantastic presence on wing.

Or more likely, Flames brass knows/sees a whole lot more than I do, and Bennett will develop into that great center everyone envisions.

[flame^thrower]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland

After seeing part 2 video of his year by AC there is no question in my mind that right now he's penciled in as the top line RW at this point in time. I think he's poised to break out and with a healthy Monahan and a Johnny who is part of the entire preseason this line could hit the ground running come the start of the season

Jankowski - Backlund - Frolik

Now before making the case of the MMM line which I fully agree was incredible last year and a large part of our success this is still technically the MMM line and having our rookie step in with Backs and Fro again makes a ton of sense if you really think about how well Tkachuk benefited.

Tkachuk - Bennett - Versteeg

This is not a demotion for Tkachuk and if anything is a reward for both him and Bennett; Versteeg riding shotgun with these two opens up tons of possibilities for the Flames in terms of matchups as our top 3 lines can all put the puck in the net - a true nightmare when matched with our top 5 D.

Brouwer - Stajan - Lazar

Brouwer will do himself a big favour if he takes this role and runs with it and with the steady play of Stajan and a young, fueled Lazar looking to make a mark this makes for a fourth line that is offensively more inclined than most if any in the league.

I quite like the looks of this. If your adamant on Jankowski playing center then you can switch lines with Lazar and play him with Stajan sharing center duties. Might be a bit stifling for him on that line though

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Can someone explain to me what about Bennett's play makes him a strong centre? I was under the impression that the qualities that earmark a centre are:

* Vision

* Puck distribution

* Defensive awareness and responsibility

Those qualities don't jump out at me when I watch Bennett play.

I think Bennett's vision is underrated and lack of which is overstated. He has the ability but is learning to use his teammates better. It will help if he is given better and consistent linemates next year.

I also think his defensive game is improving which is also going to take time.

The biggest issue I see with Bennett is his performance relative to his draft spot and peers. Bennett was easily the highest touted of the Flames recent top 10 picks. He was the only one that was considered number 1 in his year. The best we heard about for Tkachuk was 4th and Monahan was 5th. When Monahan made the team it was only he and Sven that Flames fans were hyped about. He was very hot and cold like Bennett as a rookie and scored 22 goals and 34pts. Bennett scored 18 goals and 36pts. Tkachuk certainly had a far more impressive rookie season than either playing tough top 6 minutes.

Monahan broke out huge with Gaudreau in his sophomore year and Bennett had a sophomore slump. This also doesn't bring up the fact that Gaudreau had an elite first 2 seasons in the league so Bennett is 4th when if comes to young impact forwards on the team. I believe that situation has resulted in some of the fans giving up on Bennett too soon and ready to trade him.

The concern I have is will these expectations lead to a Baertschi scenario. Basically Sven could never live up to the hype in Calgary and I believe requested a trade when he saw Gaudreau, and Monahan pass him in terms of our top young players. If Jankowski is able to pass Bennett next year perhaps he looks at Monahan, Backlund, Jankowski and then Gaudreau, Tkachuk and doesn't see a spot for him in the top 3 centre spots up the middle or top 6 LW and asks to be moved? I really hope not and hope next year is his breakout season and we hear plenty of Bennie and the Jets at the Dome this year

[jonkaupp]

What do you consider a breakout? 45 point at 3C? Fact is he's not gonna get the ice time he needs to have a really big offensive season if he's stuck as the third center. If he's gonna have a big year he's either gotta displace the ice time of the top two centres (unlikely) or move to the wing. Or we gotta accept that maybe he doesn't have the offensive upside we hoped and is gonna settle in as a very good third line center (which I don't believe)

[MarkGio]

Originally Posted by jonkaupp

I don't think most posters suggesting Bennett going to the wing are doing so because they don't think Bennett can play center but because everyone here envisioned Bennett as a first line high point producing player and there just clearly is no room for that in the top two Center positions. Bennett, imo, has proven he can play center but he hasn't proven he can play center and produce offensively, particularly with two very good centres in front of him. In my thinking, we would likely get a lot more production out of Bennett on the first line as a winger and then if there is an injury to either Backlund or Monahan, he would simply slide over to the center position. Fact is he just won't get enough ice time to truly ever be the player we think he is if he's stuck behind the two guys in front of him. Jankowski on the other hand is probably a more natural center and is viewed largely and a middle lines type player so it makes sense to start him as your third line center (assuming he proves so in camp and beyond).

Joe Pavelski seems like a good comparable, he is a natural center who plays on the wing because he clearly belongs on the top line. Bennett will never blossom into the 70-80 point guy I think he is if he remains stuck at 3C. And it's not a matter of just proving he should be a top 2 center because we have very good known commodities in those positions already.

This is a good point. Upon reflection, let's say Jankowski could be only 80% effective as Bennett as our 3rd line C, but Bennett could be 80% more impactful as the team's top RW, I think it's a risk worth taking.

[Heavy Jack]

Originally Posted by MarkGio

This is a good point. Upon reflection, let's say Jankowski could be only 80% effective as Bennett as our 3rd line C, but Bennett could be 80% more impactful as the team's top RW, I think it's a risk worth taking.

Another way of looking at it though is what's more impactful to the team as a whole? Is it one offensive power-house line, one shut-down line and two bottom six groupings or is it 3 balanced scoring attacks with an energy line:

Gaudreau - Monahan - Bennett 20+ mins
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik 14 -16mins
Versteeg - Jankowski - Ferland 12 -14 mins
Brouwer - Stajan - Lazar 8 -10 mins

vs

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland 18 - 20mins
Jankowski - Backlund - Frolik 17 mins
Tkachuk - Bennett - Versteeg 15 mins
Brouwer - Stajan - Lazar 8 - 10 mins

Personally I like the balanced attack approach versus loading up the top 6 and feel that teams that take line-up 2 approach tend to be more fresh come playoff time.

Look at the approach that we took with Backlund as well when looking at Bennett - it was a long and patient process that eventually led to Backlund finishing 4th for Selke voting last year and a 50 point season. I think Bennett has a lot more potential to be more than what Backlund is for us and think that patience is key with Bennett as well. Heck if Bennett starts well in his third line center role it could allow the Flames to open up to thoughts about selling high on Backlund for a top line RWer.

Lots of things to consider than merely points when looking at Bennett and whether he'd be more productive as 3rd line center versus 1st line rw and I think those points lead to Bennett playing center versus wing being a better option for the club long term.

[Jeff Lebowski]

I'd like to see more dynamic offensive hockey out of the forward group. I think that's best realized with lines looking like:

Gaudreau - Monahan - Tkachuk
Bennett - Backlund - Frolik
Ferland - Jankowski - Lazar
Versteeg - Stajan - Brouwer

That's obviously contingent on Jankowski proving he's capable of playing and producing at NHL level.

I think that slots guys in best position to consistently produce while having a nice balance of skillsets out there too.

[Lanny_McDonald]

(lh)Gaudreau - (lh)Monahan -(rh)Lazar
(lh)Tkachuk - (lh)Backlund - (lh)Frolik
(lh) Ferland - (lh)Bennett - (rh)Versteeg
(lh)Stajan - (lh)Jankowski - (rh)Brouwer

(rw) Hathaway - (rw) Foo

I actually think this might be a damn good lineup. Right handed shots where they should be. A veteran on the Bennett line to aid his development. Jankowski with two vets, including a center to jump in should he struggle in assignment draws. Good balance and some good grit on each line.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by New Era

(lh)Gaudreau - (lh)Monahan -(rh)Lazar
(lh)Tkachuk - (lh)Backlund - (lh)Frolik
(lh) Ferland - (lh)Bennett - (rh)Versteeg
(lh)Stajan - (lh)Jankowski - (rh)Brouwer

(rw) Hathaway - (rw) Foo

I actually think this might be a damn good lineup. Right handed shots where they should be. A veteran on the Bennett line to aid his development. Jankowski with two vets, including a center to jump in should he struggle in assignment draws. Good balance and some good grit on each line.

That's a very solid line-up, love it top to bottom. I would just maybe swap out Lazar and Ferland if Ferland can keep up with those two guys. He's deadly when he's on his game.

[Love]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Can someone explain to me what about Bennett's play makes him a strong centre? I was under the impression that the qualities that earmark a centre are:

* Vision

* Puck distribution

* Defensive awareness and responsibility

Those qualities don't jump out at me when I watch Bennett play.

None of those qualities jump out at me when I watch Monahan play either

[Groot]

I'm probably closest to Heavy Jack, I liked the balanced approach and think that Ferland is undervalued and will be a great option for the top line. Lots of interesting stats and figures in this article

https://flamesnation.ca/2017/02/22/r...-sean-monahan/

"Revisiting Gaudreau – Monahan – Ferland
Via Corsica, the Flames’ best 5v5 CF% line in the 2015-16 season, minimum 100 minutes played together, was actually those three."

And Ferland would be on pace for 27 goals based on his performance from Feb 21 on wards last season when he joined the top line again.

I want to see how Bennett and Tkachuk can play together. I think they could be a formidable tandem like Monahan/Gaudreau and Backlund/Frolik. Also gives Tkachuk more offensive starts, and I wouldn't mind seeing Ferland on the right side here either, based on how other RW'ers come together.

Jankowski is ready for the NHL and more two-way then Bennett it seems, so giving him a year with Backlund and Frolik could do wonders for his development at an NHL level.

Gaudreau - Monahan - Ferland
Tkachuk - Bennett - Versteeg
Jankowski - Backlund - Frolik
Brouwer - Stajan - Lazar
*Hathaway, Hamilton

Who cares about 1st, 2nd, or 3rd line distinction, each of those top 3 lines could play 20 minutes per game. That would be a nightmare for other teams to match with.