Why are University Campuses against Men's Resource Centres?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by octothorp

The version of feminism that you, in this thread, are attempting to use as your definition of modern feminism is the definition that scares people away from identifying with it. It is also likely the definition with which fewest people relate.

True. It's also the version that dominates on campus, and the version (judging by their quotes) embraced by the students union representatives who oppose the men's group at Ryerson. Feminist groups outside campus are also far more leftist than Canada's population in general, weighing in with dogmatic positions on everything from global warming to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

So I suppose the question is how accurately do self-identified feminist activists and organizations represent the political values of Canadian women in general. The answer, as far as I can see, is not very.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

True. It's also the version that dominates on campus, and the version (judging by their quotes) embraced by the students union representatives who oppose the men's group at Ryerson. Feminist groups outside campus are also far more leftist than Canada's population in general, weighing in with dogmatic positions on everything from global warming to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

So I suppose the question is how accurately do self-identified feminist activists and organizations represent the political values of Canadian women in general. The answer, as far as I can see, is not very.

The issue IMO isn't the politics of the students, but how they are going about pursuing them. The issue isn't feminism, but students using feminism to squash other opinions. I agree that some extreme politics are incompatible with openness and freedom of thought, the brand of "left wing" politics on campus has gone so far in pursuing those extremists, that they've become extremists themselves.

[FlamesAddiction]

Not all feminists are even leftists. There are a growing number of feminists who identify as conservatives.

Like most segments of society, people tend to be more complicated than the labels put on them. It is true that traditionally, many feminists felt that capitalism promoted a male power structure, but I think that ideology has been changing.

[taco.vidal]

Thats the kind of emerging thinking thats behind this.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by taco.vidal

Thats the kind of emerging thinking thats behind this.

So they're completely incapable of being reasoned with.

Thats nice to know.

[GGG]

What is the difference in services provided by a Women's centre or Men's centre than by the typical campus health centre? All I know about them is that when I was in Uni that the women's centre gave out free condoms.

[Locke]

Why do we have to have Men's and Women's Health Centres? Can we not just have 'Health Centres?'

Unisex? Treated equally?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by taco.vidal

Thats the kind of emerging thinking thats behind this.

The original tweet was from a parody/satire account specifically designed to make fun of identity politics and the left, and 99.9% of all interactions with the tweet are people laughing at how ridiculous it is.

That's the kind of emerging thinking behind alt-right trolls, not behind the left. Sometimes I wonder if anyone looks into absolutely anything before they share it, instead of just "this appears to confirm my POV - LIKE + SHARE + COMMENT."

It is a funny charicature though. A little sad that some people on the right are so easily spoon fed this stuff as though it's real. The line "if it's on the internet it must be true!" is actually only funny if you're in on the joke, not the inspiration behind it.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Not all feminists are even leftists. There are a growing number of feminists who identify as conservatives.

Like most segments of society, people tend to be more complicated than the labels put on them. It is true that traditionally, many feminists felt that capitalism promoted a male power structure, but I think that ideology has been changing.

I think a major issue, is that society has not bundled together a set of diverse beliefs into either "liberal/left" or "conservative/right". Both sets of labels have lost all meaning, and all politics is just about ensuring that the side you support wins.

[taco.vidal]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

The original tweet was from a parody/satire account specifically designed to make fun of identity politics and the left, and 99.9% of all interactions with the tweet are people laughing at how ridiculous it is.

That's the kind of emerging thinking behind alt-right trolls, not behind the left. Sometimes I wonder if anyone looks into absolutely anything before they share it, instead of just "this appears to confirm my POV - LIKE + SHARE + COMMENT."

It is a funny charicature though. A little sad that some people on the right are so easily spoon fed this stuff as though it's real. The line "if it's on the internet it must be true!" is actually only funny if you're in on the joke, not the inspiration behind it.

Its funny because its true. There's a ton of hate right now directed towards white CIS males especially in universities, both by academics and student bodies.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

It is a funny charicature though. A little sad that some people on the right are so easily spoon fed this stuff as though it's real. The line "if it's on the internet it must be true!" is actually only funny if you're in on the joke, not the inspiration behind it.

You're not familiar with post-modernism? It was the most influential philosophy to emerge in Western academia the late 20th century. There absolutely are schools of thought in the humanities and social sciences that hold logic and science to be social constructs employed to maintain the patriarchal hegemony.

In the prelude to their mob attack on sociologist Charles Murray, the students at Middlebury College in Vermont declared:

“Science has always been used to legitimize racism, sexism, classism, transphobia, ableism, and homophobia, all veiled as rational and fact, and supported by the government and state. In this world today, there is little that is true ‘fact.’”

This, it seems to me, gets to the heart of the question — not that the students shut down a speech, but why they did. I do not doubt their good intentions. But, in a strange echo of the Trumpian right, they are insisting on the superiority of their orthodoxy to “facts.” They are hostile, like all fundamentalists, to science, because it might counter doctrine. And they shut down the event because intersectionality rejects the entire idea of free debate, science, or truth independent of white male power...

At a later moment, the students start clapping in unison, and you can feel the hysteria rising, as the chants grow louder. “Your message is hatred. We will not tolerate it!” The final climactic chant is “Shut it down! Shut it down!” It feels like something out of The Crucible. Most of the students have never read a word of Murray’s — and many professors who supported the shutdown admitted as much. But the intersectional zeal is so great he must be banished — even to the point of physical violence.

This matters, it seems to me, because reason and empirical debate are essential to the functioning of a liberal democracy. We need a common discourse to deliberate. We need facts independent of anyone’s ideology or political side, if we are to survive as a free and democratic society. Trump has surely shown us this. And if a university cannot allow these facts and arguments to be freely engaged, then nowhere is safe. Universities are the sanctuary cities of reason. If reason must be subordinate to ideology even there, our experiment in self-government is over.

- Is Intersectionality a Religion? - Andrew Sullivan

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by taco.vidal

Its funny because its true. There's a ton of hate right now directed towards white CIS males especially in universities, both by academics and student bodies.

Of course, caricatures are inherently funny because they are exaggerations of the truth.

That's not really a good excuse to share an lol worthy caricature as evidence of the "emerging thinking behind this" considering it's a response to the "emerging thinking," not behind it, and is... you know... a caricature.

It just makes it looks like you shared something that fit your bias regardless of source.

[peter12]

Oh stop it, Pepsi.

[V]

What? Pepsi is right. He posted it thinking it was a blatant example of idiocy on the left, and got caught looking silly.

[PsYcNeT]

OMG this is literally every hillbilly Conservative right now, WHO GETS A TATTOO LIKE THIS??

[PsYcNeT]

Speaking of Conservatives on Twitter, the Anime-Right is always a fun browse to play "Poe Or No?" with. They are very mad(?) about Wolfenstein II at the moment.

NSFW!

[CliffFletcher]

Can you cut the trolling and let the adults talk?

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Can you cut the trolling and let the adults talk?

Sorry dude I'll let you get back to your intricate dance around not explicitly stating you hate non-subservient women, but implying it.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

Sorry dude I'll let you get back to your intricate dance around not explicitly stating you hate non-subservient women, but implying it.

This is garbage ad hominem.

[taco.vidal]

Originally Posted by V

What? Pepsi is right. He posted it thinking it was a blatant example of idiocy on the left, and got caught looking silly.

I posted it because its funny because the sentiment is true not because the tweet is authentic. Its not new and has been floating around and amply discussed for several months.