I find it a little disturbing how some folks in this thread seem to be working themselves up towards a lather because of a stupid opinion piece by a largely insignificant person.
I think the thing that really, I dont know if it angers me or saddens me, but you get this kind of thing from someone who is fairly highly educated and working for a relatively respected but high volume distributor.
Think about this for a second. This author is close to Master's Degree in Philosophy. This could likely have cost her tens of thousands of dollars and this pathetic thesis is so half-baked its ridiculous.
Whatever the goal was, whether it was to promote her feminist activism, which I doubt because most of the women I know are far too intelligent to think this piece is anything other than complete drivel, and the distributor should be above publishing mindless garbage for clickbait. Leave that to the King (Mark Spector).
The drunk guy at the end of the bar could have done better than this. Regardless of his race.
I hope those student loans were worth it.
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I find it a little disturbing how some folks in this thread seem to be working themselves up towards a lather because of a stupid opinion piece by a largely insignificant person.
No doubt somewhere on Stormfront there's an opinion piece by a largely insignificant person saying blacks shouldn't be allowed to vote. It's only worth worrying about in that it's a POV that's tolerated within a larger sub-culture that does have social and political influence.
The columnist in the OP is largely insignificant. The ideology that fostered her beliefs is not. People who believe white men are the source of all the world's ills have a lot of influence of education, culture, and politics in 2017.
Those zealots and their counterparts on the far right inspire one another. They're mutually-reinforcing in their mindless dogma and their hate. And it's the responsibility of moderates to call them out.
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I think the thing that really, I dont know if it angers me or saddens me, but you get this kind of thing from someone who is fairly highly educated and working for a relatively respected but high volume distributor.
Think about this for a second. This author is close to Master's Degree in Philosophy. This could likely have cost her tens of thousands of dollars and this pathetic thesis is so half-baked its ridiculous.
Whatever the goal was, whether it was to promote her feminist activism, which I doubt because most of the women I know are far too intelligent to think this piece is anything other than complete drivel, and the distributor should be above publishing mindless garbage for clickbait. Leave that to the King (Mark Spector).
The drunk guy at the end of the bar could have done better than this. Regardless of his race.
I hope those student loans were worth it.
Have you been in an philosophy class? Or know anything about South Africa? This article shouldn't seem even slightly weird.
It's unfair and flat out wrong to label it unintelligent or "mindless garbage" simply because you disagree with the premise. Suggesting that this would cost someone getting a masters in philosophy grant money or future prospects shows zero understanding of philosophy. If anything, you should have noticed her education and said "Ok, this makes more sense."
I disagree with the premise, but it's a pretty solid social theory piece. The question is posed and the consequences of the answer are explored.
There is no reason to personally attack this person, despite how offended you are. It's an opinion piece from a philosopher out of South Africa. Apply context and relax.
No doubt somewhere on Stormfront there's an opinion piece by a largely insignificant person saying blacks shouldn't be allowed to vote. It's only worth worrying about in that it's a POV that's tolerated within a larger sub-culture that does have social and political influence.
The columnist in the OP is largely insignificant. The ideology that fostered her beliefs is not. People who believe white men are the source of all the world's ills have a lot of influence of education, culture, and politics in 2017.
Those zealots and their counterparts on the far right inspire one another. They're mutually-reinforcing in their mindless dogma and their hate. And it's the responsibility of moderates to call them out.
Fair enough. That being the case, where's the thread here devoted to calling out the stupid opinion piece on Infowars, Stormfront or Breitbart?
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It's unfair and flat out wrong to label it unintelligent or "mindless garbage" simply because you disagree with the premise. Suggesting that this would cost someone getting a masters in philosophy grant money or future prospects shows zero understanding of philosophy. If anything, you should have noticed her education and said "Ok, this makes more sense."
I disagree with the premise, but it's a pretty solid social theory piece. The question is posed and the consequences of the answer are explored.
It's boilerplate Marxist gender feminism, topped with a racist and misandrist bow.
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Originally Posted by PepsiFree
There is no reason to personally attack this person, despite how offended you are. It's an opinion piece from a philosopher out of South Africa. Apply context and relax.
There's every reason for people who feel Marxism and gender feminism are terrible ideas to attack those ideas.
It's also legitimate to ask why the Huffington Post is promoting radicalism of this sort. Either they're too dumb to recognize that this stuff just fuels the far right, or they're happy enough to contribute to the toxic polarization of political dialog in the interests of page-hits. Either way, it's not a good look.
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Originally Posted by fotze
If this day gets you riled up, you obviously aren't numb to the disappointment yet to be a real fan.
Have you been in an philosophy class? Or know anything about South Africa? This article shouldn't seem even slightly weird.
It's unfair and flat out wrong to label it unintelligent or "mindless garbage" simply because you disagree with the premise. Suggesting that this would cost someone getting a masters in philosophy grant money or future prospects shows zero understanding of philosophy. If anything, you should have noticed her education and said "Ok, this makes more sense."
I disagree with the premise, but it's a pretty solid social theory piece. The question is posed and the consequences of the answer are explored.
There is no reason to personally attack this person, despite how offended you are. It's an opinion piece from a philosopher out of South Africa. Apply context and relax.
Yes. And yes. And yes again.
"Flat out wrog to label it 'Mindless Garbage'?"
Removing voting rights from any demographic based on race seems like an easy one to dismiss out of hand.
Granted, I didnt realize that she was talking exclusively about South Africa, especially not after little snippets like....
Quote:
the denial of the vote to white men for 20 years (just less than a generation) would go some way to seeing a decline in the influence of reactionary and neo-liberal ideology in the world.
That being said, someone from South Africa really should know better. And I mean that intuitively. Not requiring a Master's in Philosophy.
You know, seeing as how there was a racial demographic that did have its rights suppressed for a while. I dont recall that having gone all that well and it took a miracle to turn it around.
But I'll defer to you, the South African authority.
A 'solid social theory piece?'
One group removing rights from another. Yup. I think we can see how well this works in actual practice, no need for the 'social theory.'
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Fair enough. That being the case, where's the thread here devoted to calling out the stupid opinion piece on Infowars, Stormfront or Breitbart?
If you want to post a link to a stupid far-right opinion piece and call it out, go ahead. The entire American Politics thread is more or less devoted to calling out the Trump administration and American right-wing politics in general.
For my part, I'm not a right-winger, I don't associate with right-wingers or read right-wing media sources. It's an alien culture to me that I have no influence in.
I am, however, a centrist liberal, and have lots of centre-left friends and family. I listen to the CBC, and read the Globe and Mail, the Guardian, and the Atlantic. I come across radical leftists nonsense all the time. So that's where I aim my criticism and try to exert influence - on the liberal left who, out of complacency and guilt, have let liberalism be hijacked and subverted by illiberal* radicals. And I believe reducing the influence of the radical left will help deflate the far right.
* You'll note that the author of the opinion piece came right out and denounced liberalism. However wrong-headed her political goals, at least she recognizes that they're fundamentally at odds with liberalism.
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It's boilerplate Marxist gender feminism, topped with a racist and misandrist bow.
There's every reason for people who feel Marxism and gender feminism are terrible ideas to attack those ideas.
It's also legitimate to ask why the Huffington Post is promoting radicalism of this sort. Either they're too dumb to recognize that this stuff just fuels the far right, or they're happy enough to contribute to the toxic polarization of political dialog in the interests of page-hits. Either way, it's not a good look.
This is all true. But again, there are ideological publications everywhere. It seems like the ultra-liberal ones are kept to a higher standard than the ultra-conservative ones.
At the risk of repeating myself, I find the reaction to this more concerning than the article itself. There's almost a visceral anger towards what should be a throw-away article to the point where the reaction is completely out of proportion. It's like jailing someone for jaywalking.
The thing that concerns me the most about this reaction is that it is essentially the same mind-set that is pushing racism, ultra-nationalism and hyper-conservatism into legitimate political discourse all over the world. Look no further than the recent US Presidential election for evidence of this. It's also no coincidence that Breitbart and Infowars are so influential on the Trump administration. I haven't read all the responses here but it wouldn't surprise me if someone threw in a "safe space", "triggered" or "snow flake" reference. These blatant over reactions do exactly what you complained about: it inspires others to do the same and builds on itself.
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Removing voting rights from any demographic based on race seems like an easy one to dismiss out of hand.
Granted, I didnt realize that she was talking exclusively about South Africa, especially not after little snippets like....
That being said, someone from South Africa really should know better. And I mean that intuitively. Not requiring a Master's in Philosophy.
You know, seeing as how there was a racial demographic that did have its rights suppressed for a while. I dont recall that having gone all that well and it took a miracle to turn it around.
But I'll defer to you, the South African authority.
A 'solid social theory piece?'
One group removing rights from another. Yup. I think we can see how well this works in actual practice, no need for the 'social theory.'
I don't entirely believe you have recently, based on any assumption that this would be somehow costly or unfit for a Philosophy student. I've sat through much more awful and offensive arguments than the one she is making.
As I said, it's an interesting theory piece because it's impact would be incredibly different than what you're referencing, OBVIOUSLY you can see how it would have a different impact. That's what the article is about. "There's a lot wrong with the world, if _ were to happen, would it fix it?" I believe the answer is 100% no and that the article isn't even worth getting upset over considering how meaningless its reach is (as though one South African black feminist in a SA HuffPo Op-Ed is going to change the tides of all western power structures, lol!), but that doesn't cause me to need to label her unintelligent.
And I did not say she was talking exclusively about SA, I said that the article should be viewed in the context in which it exists: a SA black feminist philosophy student writing an OP-ed on SA's version of HuffPo. It's mostly just funny how far the reach was to find something offensive on a world stage, when minorities in North America have to laugh off a ton of stuff from right here at home so as not to be constantly angry or labelled "snowflakes."
This is all true. But again, there are ideological publications everywhere. It seems like the ultra-liberal ones are kept to a higher standard than the ultra-conservative ones.
At the risk of repeating myself, I find the reaction to this more concerning than the article itself. There's almost a visceral anger towards what should be a throw-away article to the point where the reaction is completely out of proportion. It's like jailing someone for jaywalking.
The thing that concerns me the most about this reaction is that it is essentially the same mind-set that is pushing racism, ultra-nationalism and hyper-conservatism into legitimate political discourse all over the world. Look no further than the recent US Presidential election for evidence of this. It's also no coincidence that Breitbart and Infowars are so influential on the Trump administration. I haven't read all the responses here but it wouldn't surprise me if someone threw in a "safe space", "triggered" or "snow flake" reference. These blatant over reactions do exactly what you complained about: it inspires others to do the same and builds on itself.
Hm. That is a very interesting point.
I'll admit, I've likely done the very same thing. I think I tend to dismiss a lot of crap out of hand.
I generally look past most of that stuff, but its seemingly becoming more and more mainstream.
The last thing we want is 'Extremes' becoming the Norm.
I wonder why that is. Is it maybe that there is so much input and communication that we as a society have become jaded and only extreme ideas register enough of a response?
I'm not really sure.
For instance, removing rights from one group based exclusively on race is a stupid idea and is sufficiently preposterous to be dismissed out of hand and we dont need to think about it, its been actually done many, many times with fairly disastrous effects.
I guess I see the idea of: What happens if you do it to White Males, the single most influential demographic on the face of the Earth.
But again, it falls on its face. It cant be done. And it shouldnt be done.
So the fact that it might be an interesting theory fails because the basic premise of, again, removing rights based on race, is inherently flawed.
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I find the reaction to this more concerning than the article itself. There's almost a visceral anger towards what should be a throw-away article to the point where the reaction is completely out of proportion.
An article extolling the 'virtues' of denying people the right to vote purely based on gender and/or race should receive visceral anger. I would be more concerned for society if the reaction was anything but this.
