Last I heard he was still suffering from symptoms due to the hit so his career ending is not the only element at play. If his quality of life is still suffering this much time later that is a big deal.
I hadn't seen that clip, but I'm really surprised there wasn't a suspension for that. He crushes the linesman without making any effort to stop or avoid him, and without the mitigating circumstances of just being hit. I'm guessing the linesman blamed himself for cutting off Weber, and at least he saw it coming. Still though, not a whole ton of difference in my eyes and I never even heard about that one.
^ I hadn't seen that first clip, but I'm really surprised there wasn't a suspension for that. He crushes the linesman without making any effort to stop or avoid him, and without the mitigating circumstances of just being hit. I'm guessing the linesman blamed himself for cutting off Weber, and at least he saw it coming. Still though, not a whole ton of difference in my eyes and I never even heard about that one.
But but but, he's always just floating around, he practically deserves it!
Henderson called 1249 regular season and 11 playoff games. Him getting crashed into half a dozen times in the fastest league in the world hardly supports the notion he was some kind of wandering fool who had no idea how to avoid getting hit.
For crying out loud, no matter what was really in Wideman's head that day this person got hurt and had to hang up his skates early. That is downright sh---y and one thing that should not be the subject of debate.
Moreover, the risk of an official being seriously hurt is exactly why there is an onus on the players to avoid them as best they can at all times. Even when they are in the wrong place or outright get in the way.
Back to the issue, the thing that really makes me mad is how the league continues to say publicly the arbitrator applied a standard not agreed to in the CBA (the position of the NHLPA suggests otherwise). Well, NHL (Gary), that is what the judge would have said if you had won. That never happened. You are wrong. Case closed.
The Following User Says Thank You to MBates For This Useful Post:
Ok, well how about the aggravated assault card? If this took place 10' over, in the stands, there'd be criminal charges. He would have possibly done jail time. Unless he played the NCR card, because of his concussion, and then he would have been undergone a psych evaluation by court appointed doctors instead of at home texting other players.
We'll just never agree. I saw a brutal, anger fueled hit on a person that wasn't even playing the game, and you saw a guy that was seeing stars and tweety birds accidentally? throw a vicious crosscheck that accidentally? hit an official, causing permanent injury.
I just don't know how you reconcile the fact that his contact was perfectly timed, and the jersey he hit was striped. He saw well enough to hit his target, but not well enough to see his target?
If you are trying to understand the other point of view, try a word other than "target". Glorious hits are "perfectly timed" constantly, probably daily, between two unsuspecting players. Didn't Doan just get obliterated during warm up? Perfectly timed hit, heaviest I've seen in a while. No intent there and none here.
If you are trying to understand the other point of view, try a word other than "target". Glorious hits are "perfectly timed" constantly, probably daily, between two unsuspecting players. Didn't Doan just get obliterated during warm up? Perfectly timed hit, heaviest I've seen in a while. No intent there and none here.
He wound up with both arms, stick in both hands, and f-ing smoked him dead center, in the back, at maximum impact. Perfectly timed. Target. Deliberate.
He wound up with both arms, stick in both hands, and f-ing smoked him dead center, in the back, at maximum impact. Perfectly timed. Target. Deliberate.
Dude your constant fly bys on Wideman are getting tired. He served 20, should have been 10, was appealed and he won, was counter appealed and he won. What gives?
I don't see you coming to widemans aid in the 20 seconds before the exchange with the ref when they clearly missed calling a penalty on a dangerous hit that one could argue affected Wideman's ability to make rational judgments on the ice.
Fly bys? I'm explaining each of my points here, but I agree, it's time to stop. What's embarrassing, is that you think that nailing an official is no big deal.
Fly bys? I'm explaining each of my points here, but I agree, it's time to stop. What's embarrassing, is that you think that nailing an official is no big deal.
There is so much other variables your not even considering.. what's your opinion on what I stated in the post above??
Is it not possible that Wideman was tunnel visioned after getting smoked by a dirty hit??
At the speed that the game is being played at would not be possible that players/refs blurred into the surroundings of the game/arena as he clearly laboured back to the bench??
Was what he did wreckless? Yes. Was what he did 100 %, with out a doubt, pre meditated with the goal of ending an officials career?? That's totally an up in the air opinion and knowing Widemans previous history in the league, with no previous violent behaviour toward players and refs alike.. I think you have an unecessary hate for Dennis and I don't get your stance when clearly many different people have reviewed this case and ruled in favour of a 10 game suspension.
There is so much other variables your not even considering.. what's your opinion on what I stated in the post above??
Which post? I've answered all of them. Specify which one was not answered sufficiently.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavy Jack
Is it not possible that Wideman was tunnel visioned after getting smoked by a dirty hit??
At the speed that the game is being played at would not be possible that players/refs blurred into the surroundings of the game/arena as he clearly laboured back to the bench??
Ok, this is where we're seeing different things. Same as Jay Random taking such offence, I see a malicious hit, you guys apparently see an accident.
I see a guy striding toward the bench, head down, and then looking up, changing direction (toward Henderson) and then winding up and DRILLING him. That does not look like an accident to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavy Jack
Was what he did wreckless? Yes. Was what he did 100 %, with out a doubt, pre meditated with the goal of ending an officials career?? That's totally an up in the air opinion and knowing Widemans previous history in the league, with no previous violent behaviour toward players and refs alike.. I think you have an unecessary hate for Dennis and I don't get your stance when clearly many different people have reviewed this case and ruled in favour of a 10 game suspension.
It's not about "Dennis". It's not because he sucks now. It's because he did that while being a Calgary Flame, and playing in the NHL. That was total garbage, and I bet that the tune around here would be mighty different if it was a Canuck or Oiler that did that.
If he was Sami Kappanning his way to the bench and then ran into an official, I'd understand. When he's skating directly towards him, looks up and sees him, raises his stick and hits him with both hands on the stick, and crumples the guy? That's well beyond an accident.
He actually pivots his skates to the right -- away from Henderson and his arms come up as he reacts to the body that has come into his lane as the puck/play turns back against his skating path. He's holding a stick which made he collision with Henderson worse for the ref no doubt. Wideman reacted the same way most would have reacted in that situation IMO - with the play coming back at him quickly and just having his bell rung his primary focus was getting to the bench, Henderson came into his vision quickly, seemed to surprise him and his body reacted.
It's not as viscious as your making it out to be.
All this aside my opinion and your opinion are moot... far more qualified people have ruled on this numerous times with the same conclusion.
Well the intent to injure piece is already ruled in favor of Wideman by both a neutral arbitrator and judge. So whether or not you think you're right that's how two neutral parties saw it. We may agree to disagree, sure, but that's typically echoed by people who are wrong.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751
The Oilers won't finish 14th in the West forever.
Eventually a couple of expansion teams will be added which will nestle the Oilers into 16th.
Whether it ended 10 games early or 100, it still ended early as a direct result of Wideman's actions. So yes, one does get to play that card if they so choose.
So it ended 10 games early (actually 20-odd). You don't get to pretend that he had years left to go in his career and should be compensated (or Wideman punished) on that basis.
Quote:
This is the kind of argument we still get out of Canuck fans. "Moore was just a 4th line scrub who was going to be quickly out of the league anyway. NBD"
As a matter of fact, I think the very least Bertuzzi should have been liable for was Moore's probable career earnings at league minimum. I have never defended Bertuzzi's action in the slightest. We know it was deliberate, we know it was premeditated. He chased Moore around the rink to catch him, for crying out loud.
We don't know nearly as much about what was going on in Wideman's head. It would be wise not to pretend that we did.
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
He wound up with both arms, stick in both hands, and f-ing smoked him dead center, in the back, at maximum impact. Perfectly timed. Target. Deliberate.
The arbitrator and the judge both ruled that it was not deliberate. You have no access to better information than they had.
__________________
WARNING: The preceding message may not have been processed in a sarcasm-free facility.
The Following User Says Thank You to Jay Random For This Useful Post:
He wound up with both arms, stick in both hands, and f-ing smoked him dead center, in the back, at maximum impact. Perfectly timed. Target. Deliberate.
Except for the fact that collisions often look intentional when they clearly are not (teammate-on-teammate). Hell, even Weber's hit above looks intentional. It wasn't and neither was Wideman's. He didn't see him and then he did. He braced himself. It happens all the time. He didn't see him and then he did.
It was either accidental or malicious. It didn't happen in a vacuum, we know Wideman's character from the evidence of his 800 games played. His character happens to line up with the most logical explanation - it was likely an accident. The director of officiating agrees.
"You'd say different if he was an oiler" is bull#### and often a sign of an argument on shaky footing.
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to sun For This Useful Post:
He wound up with both arms, stick in both hands, and f-ing smoked him dead center, in the back, at maximum impact. Perfectly timed. Target. Deliberate.
Wow. This wasn't even close to what happened. Wound up? False. Stick in both hands? True. Smoked him dead center (not sure how to answer that, so 'sure'?), maximum impact? Yeah... NOOO.
Take a look at the video again. You are GREATLY exaggerating the incident to fit your narrative that Wideman is some evil person who was hell bent on seeking vengeance not against the guy who hit him, but for a LINESMAN (who doesn't call penalties, btw) for a hit that occurred.
It is one thing to not believe Wideman in that the hit made him dazed (though looking at his skating and his reaction immediately before the incident seems to fit, though nobody will know for sure), and therefore he wasn't sure what was happening as he hit the linesman. It is something altogether to make it seem like he was winding up from the blueline with Henderson's number at full speed trying to 'break his neck'.
Look at Wideman's speed
Look at how Wideman actually slowed down at the last instant.
Look at Wideman's skates and how they were positioned.
Look at Wideman's grip on his stick - is that how NHL players crosscheck?
Your narration is grossly misleading. Maybe Wideman did intentionally hit Henderson - but that was without question NOT an intent to injure. Not when you actually take a look at the crosscheck, speed and positioning.
I would agree with Rick and Kelly as Wideman appeared 'dazed'. It looked like to me that at the last second, he saw the linesman, got his hands up to protect himself and push away, which seems likely with how his skates were positioned.
Even if you don't agree with that take, I don't see how in the world one looks at that and thinks "That was a deliberate, malicious intent to injure". Watch any hockey game to see what a crosscheck looks like - crosschecks that don't even result in penalties - and get back to me.
For me, it was either 'dazed' and innocent (and if you have ever had your bell rung, you would know what it means to have that dark tunnel vision where you aren't really seeing anything) or at most some frustration with the linesman in his way.
Either way, your exaggeration is grossly misleading. Take a look at the video again, and tell me that it isn't the case.
Look at this crosscheck for comparison - Phil Kessel on Dorsett. Look at the skate positioning, hand positioning on the stick, how Kessel is using his weight to help with the crosscheck.
Compare once again to Wideman's hit on Henderson. You might argue that Wideman knew what he was doing and that he hit Henderson on purpose - and you may even be right. But tell me again how that was a vicious, intent to injure type of incident. I don't see it, no matter how many times I look for it. It simply isn't there.
The way you describe it is simply a gross exaggeration. Add to the fact that Wideman has had an incredibly clean record right up until that point, and your explanation would actually be comical, if it wasn't for Henderson actually sustaining injury.
The Following 13 Users Say Thank You to Calgary4LIfe For This Useful Post:
Except for the fact that collisions often look intentional when they clearly are not (teammate-on-teammate). Hell, even Weber's hit above looks intentional. It wasn't and neither was Wideman's. He didn't see him and then he did. He braced himself. It happens all the time. He didn't see him and then he did.
It was either accidental or malicious. It didn't happen in a vacuum, we know Wideman's character from the evidence of his 800 games played. His character happens to line up with the most logical explanation - it was likely an accident. The director of officiating agrees.
"You'd say different if he was an oiler" is bull#### and often a sign of an argument on shaky footing.
Uh oh! Shaky footing? I better really, really leave this conversation now.
You have proven that Wideman did not deliberately smash his stick into the back of Henderson. It was only an accident. Even though it was an accident, it somehow still warranted punishment. In my opinion, a hell of a lot more.
IDFK. You guys win. Wideman did it by accident. Charged up behind him, smoked his ass, skated away, texted about it later, and it was all just a big old accident. Gotcha. I'm done. Your incoming disagreement is something that I agree to disagree with.
C4L, seriuosly, how do you not see him wind up? How?
