If the Flames are still in contention at the Trade Deadline... - Page 4 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Cleveland Steam Whistle · 12-23-2016, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

lol no it's not

Kadri is worth marginally more than Backlund.

Brodie is in an entirely different league value-wise.

Brodie for Marner is actually pretty fair value. Marner has more upside but is an easier type of asset to acquire. Brodie is the rarest of assets, a top pairing defenseman that is only 26.

Acquiring Brodie makes any team instantly, and significantly better (unless they already have 4 great defensemen and have no room for him).

Marner has the potential to be a star, but teams need multiple stars up front to be contenders.

It's actually pretty fair value, despite them being such different tyoes of assets.

Brodie for Kadri is beyond laughable. IT's 'fire the GM right fricking now' laughable.

Brodie's "top pairing" reputation doesn't extend beyond this board. I'd be shocked if around the league he's thought of as anything more than a top 4 d nan who might have top D potential. He's number 3 on our depth chart right now, and dropped behind Russell and Wideman just two seasons ago when Gio got hurt. Brodie's reputation on this board is not translatable anywhere else.

You are drastically under valuing Kadri as well, he's a centre putting up good numbers on a bad team. Way too early to peg him as Backlund ceiling right now, he's a desirable asset in his own right.

Cleveland Steam Whistle · 12-23-2016, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

You're talking about a 2nd/3rd line C for a young defenseman that was seriously considered for Team Canada last year.

I know everyone has a right to an opinion, but holy ####...

Consideration for team Canada.....says who?

This board maybe, but that doesn't count.

Cleveland Steam Whistle · 12-23-2016, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flamesforcup

I wouldn't do Brodie for Marner. A #1 dman>Winger

This post illustrates the blindness. Brodie is not a number one adman to anyone not on Calgary puck.

flamesforcup · 12-23-2016, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Brodie's "top pairing" reputation doesn't extend beyond this board. I'd be shocked if around the league he's thought of as anything more than a top 4 d nan who might have top D potential. He's number 3 on our depth chart right now, and dropped behind Russell and Wideman just two seasons ago when Gio got hurt. Brodie's reputation on this board is not translatable anywhere else.

You are drastically under valuing Kadri as well, he's a centre putting up good numbers on a bad team. Way too early to peg him as Backlund ceiling right now, he's a desirable asset in his own right.

Wow. A rough 30 games and he's just an average top 4 now? People need to stop having such recency bias and look long term.

flamesforcup · 12-23-2016, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

This post illustrates the blindness. Brodie is not a number one adman to anyone not on Calgary puck.

Really last year when he was our best dman and had 40 points in 70 games he wasn't a #1 dman? When he dragged a top 4 of Russel,Wideman,Engellend to the playoffs and almost singlehandedly won the Canucks series he wasn't a #1 dman?

Enoch Root · 12-23-2016, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Consideration for team Canada.....says who?

This board maybe, but that doesn't count.

Look it up.

Team Canada management was reported to be at games viewing Brodie. It was talked about on HNIC.

He was most definitely in the conversation.

And it is you that is out of whack on Brodie, not these boards.

Cleveland Steam Whistle · 12-23-2016, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flamesforcup

Wow. A rough 30 games and he's just an average top 4 now? People need to stop having such recency bias and look long term.

Well if we are talking trade, his play right now will be a huge factor (another reason not to trade him now, his value is low). But I don't believe he's ever played as a number 1, or even close to it. When he plays at his best, he's still a very suspect player(relatively speaking given he plays tough minutes) in his own end who causes a lot of errors that end up in his net. I feel that gets over looked on this board because of the large number of spectacular plays he makes that create goals for us. I don't believe GMs sround the league Miss that point like this board does though.

Cleveland Steam Whistle · 12-23-2016, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flamesforcup

Really last year when he was our best dman and had 40 points in 70 games he wasn't a #1 dman? When he dragged a top 4 of Russel,Wideman,Engellend to the playoffs and almost singlehandedly won the Canucks series he wasn't a #1 dman?

How did he drag us there playin on the 2nd pair?

flamesforcup · 12-23-2016, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

How did he drag us there playin on the 2nd pair?

Russel and Wideman might've got the extra pp time but Brodie was given the toughest minutes and was a huge part of our transition game.

Enoch Root · 12-23-2016, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Well if we are talking trade, his play right now will be a huge factor (another reason not to trade him now, his value is low). But I don't believe he's ever played as a number 1, or even close to it. When he plays at his best, he's still a very suspect player(relatively speaking given he plays tough minutes) in his own end who causes a lot of errors that end up in his net. I feel that gets over looked on this board because of the large number of spectacular plays he makes that create goals for us. I don't believe GMs sround the league Miss that point like this board does though.

Well, fortunately we have you to tell us what we're missing.

TheScorpion · 12-23-2016, 10:56 AM

The Flames used eight defensemen in the 2015 playoffs.

T.J. Brodie, Kris Russell, Dennis Wideman, David Schlemko, Raphael Diaz, Deryk Engelland, Tyler Wotherspoon, and Corey Potter.

This was the most common lineup:

Russell - Wideman
Brodie - Schlemko
Wotherspoon - Engelland

Potter and Diaz were typically used as extras.

Brodie hardly dragged that team to the 2nd round. If anyone did, it was the Ferland - Stajan - Jones line.

Enoch Root · 12-23-2016, 11:06 AM

IMO, Brodie was the best player in that series.

And I was not the only one to post that here at the time - it was generally agreed.

Goodlad · 12-23-2016, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Brodie's "top pairing" reputation doesn't extend beyond this board. I'd be shocked if around the league he's thought of as anything more than a top 4 d nan who might have top D potential. He's number 3 on our depth chart right now, and dropped behind Russell and Wideman just two seasons ago when Gio got hurt. Brodie's reputation on this board is not translatable anywhere else.

You are drastically under valuing Kadri as well, he's a centre putting up good numbers on a bad team. Way too early to peg him as Backlund ceiling right now, he's a desirable asset in his own right.

This seems like a very strange assessment to me. On other boards I've been on Brodie is generally accepted as a top 50 defenseman in the league with very few outliers arguing he wasn't. That would definitively make him a top pairing defenseman at the very least.
Most of that ranking is actually based on his ability as a shutdown defensman and not his offense. Barring his rough patch this season he's been an advanced stats darling, logging some of the toughest minutes in the league.

CSharp · 12-23-2016, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macho0978

They need a 2nd line player. Defence is fine

Maybe Brodie for Kadri?

Cams for a 3rd. Not sure Burke would give up more though

Why the heck would you want to trade Brodie let alone for Kadri. Flames have enough small players. You make that trade and it'll be another bent over sideways Gilmore trade the 3rd time around!

GoJetsGo · 12-23-2016, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Brodie's "top pairing" reputation doesn't extend beyond this board. I'd be shocked if around the league he's thought of as anything more than a top 4 d nan who might have top D potential.

This is out to lunch.

He's been widely talked about around the league the past few seasons by many fan bases and on national broadcasts.

I get that fan bases over-value their own players but you're being equally drastic in the other direction.

He's having a poor season this year under several difficult circumstances. No need to go on and on with the "anything more that a top 4 d-man" talk. It's ridiculous, and an extremely counterproductive drum for you to be beating as a Flames fan.

robbie111 · 12-23-2016, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VilleN

How has the idea of trading Brodie for Kadri not been laughed and ridiculed out of this thread?? I personally think that Brodie is better than Adam Larsson, and I'd much rather have Hall than Kadri... I think the more reasonable ask would be Marner for Brodie... in any case, trading Brodie is a terrible idea.

Exactly. People forget how good Brodie has been and due to tough circumstances in his personal life he's now having a down year. Trading Brodie for Kadri is the biggest joke I've heard.

Might as well say the Leafs would trade Matthews and Marner for Brodie. Thats about as likely.

Also anyone who thinks Brodie is not a future #1 has no clue and is not worth listening to with regards to any hockey insight they think they have.

VilleN · 12-23-2016, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Jesus, Brodie isn't even close to worth Marner at this point in time. Marner is playing well right now and has franchise player potential (not saying he will be that, but right now his value will be precieved as such).

I don't like a Kadri for Brodie deal right now because I don't think it makes our team better based on our needs, I'd rather keep Brodie. But the value of the two players being proposed is pretty fair IMO.

If we traded Brodie for Kadri, the Adam Larsson/Hall deal looks incredible. Brodie is better than Larsson, Hall is better than Marner... we'd look like absolute morons if we traded Brodie for Kadri.

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dying4acup · 12-24-2016, 01:28 AM

Wtf are we talking about trading Brodie? Seriously?

savemedrzaius · 12-24-2016, 01:51 AM

Marner for Brodie is a fair trade. You guys know hockeys really good.

savemedrzaius · 12-24-2016, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

lol no it's not

Kadri is worth marginally more than Backlund.

Brodie is in an entirely different league value-wise.

Brodie for Marner is actually pretty fair value. Marner has more upside but is an easier type of asset to acquire. Brodie is the rarest of assets, a top pairing defenseman that is only 26.

Acquiring Brodie makes any team instantly, and significantly better (unless they already have 4 great defensemen and have no room for him).

Marner has the potential to be a star, but teams need multiple stars up front to be contenders.

It's actually pretty fair value, despite them being such different tyoes of assets.

Brodie for Kadri is beyond laughable. IT's 'fire the GM right fricking now' laughable.

Speaking of laughable...Marner is an easier asset to acquire? The 19 year old rookie with 26 points in 32 games? Yeah those guys can be found anywhere. When Gaudreau was a rookie (and older) and put up 64 points in 80 games you all would have been fine with him being traded for a defenceman like Brodie having the season he is having at his age with what..2 more years left on his contract? Seriously?