Air Canada to begin clamping down on carry-on bags

[Dagger]

If the airlines didn't try to squeeze $25 a bag out of everyone this wouldn't be a problem. But since they are, as long as the attendants are just eye balling it for ridiculously sized items and not making everyone place their backpacks and purses in the size checking skeletons then whatever.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Traveling days before Xmas last year was brutal. I almost always only have one piece of luggage but with gifts I had another, between my girlfriend and I that was 100 extra bucks for luggage.

About half an hour before the flight WestJet was saying over the speaker that due to , full flight,wanting a quick turnaround etc etc they were offering anyone with extra luggage to come to the front and they'd make sure the bags got below for them, free of charge. Couldn't believe it.

Can't stand seeing some people with their oversized purses, which don't count as carry-on for some reason, then a mini suitcase with wheels and another shoulder bag. It's bonkers.

[Winsor_Pilates]

The other issue for me is the people with multiple items in the overhead bin. They stuff their carry on, purse, jacket, duty free bags, and take up an entire bin all before others can even get on the plane.
And people with odd length bags that don't fit length wise into the bin and need to be turned width wise, taking up double the space.

A lot of people just need better plane edicate

[Kswiss]

Come to think of it. They should minus $25 if you DONT have carry on. All the cheapos wont bring diddly squat.

[tvp2003]

Size of carry-on is one thing but I'm not sure I understand the weight limit. I'm sure I've been over 22 pounds for my carry-on bag; mind you, that included my heavy as lead laptop, but as long as I'm carrying it, why should it matter to anyone else? As someone posted earlier, is taking a jacket out and wearing it (to meet the 22 pound cut-off) any different than leaving it in the bag to start with?

I suppose the overhead bins could pose a risk for flight attendants (i.e. maybe they're only required to lift bags of 22 pounds or less), but if I put my bag under the seat in front of me, who cares if it's a few pounds over?

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Dagger

If the airlines didn't try to squeeze $25 a bag out of everyone this wouldn't be a problem.

I find it interesting that more people here are complaining about the passengers rather then the airlines for the $25 check in fee. Look at how many people use the gate check. Lets face it, if you fly, you are probably going to take luggage - its just how you are going to try and avoid it, maybe pack your bags denser so they'll fit? Wear your jacket and swearshirt on board then take it off once you board?

[Acey]

Originally Posted by tvp2003

if I put my bag under the seat in front of me, who cares if it's a few pounds over?

Costs for an airplane are extremely sensitive to weight.

“Every 25 pounds we remove, we save $440,000 a year,” Mr. McGraw said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/11/business/11air.html

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Acey

Costs for an airplane are extremely sensitive to weight.



http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/11/business/11air.html

Opening a can of worms then, but I don't see them taxing you based upon total weight usage (your weight + baggage weight) .... of coarse though, they can't due to PR reasons.

[gottabekd]

I don't fly all that often, so it always confused me why people rush to line up to get on the plane as soon as they announce "priority boarding".

Then one trip it finally occurred to me that they need to do this to ensure they can get some overhead bin space.

[Acey]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Opening a can of worms then, but I don't see them taxing you based upon total weight usage (your weight + baggage weight) .... of coarse though, they can't due to PR reasons.

Pretty much. They use average figures that they're constantly tweaking, and it accounts for people wearing heavier clothes in the winter, the destination, etc.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by gottabekd

I don't fly all that often, so it always confused me why people rush to line up to get on the plane as soon as they announce "priority boarding".

Then one trip it finally occurred to me that they need to do this to ensure they can get some overhead bin space.

Yup, I fly every week and that is the best part of priority. Get on first so my backpack can go in the bin and not at my feet.

[littlereddevil]

Originally Posted by Dagger

If the airlines didn't try to squeeze $25 a bag out of everyone this wouldn't be a problem. But since they are, as long as the attendants are just eye balling it for ridiculously sized items and not making everyone place their backpacks and purses in the size checking skeletons then whatever.

Not that I agree with the checked baggage fee, but I find it rather amusing, maybe slightly ironic, that people complain about this fee more than the outrageous fact that we pay $500+ to fly from Calgary to Toronto.

[Ryan Coke]

Yes, outrageous. What is the 'right' amount to pay to fly from Toronto to Calgary?

[sa226]

Originally Posted by littlereddevil

Not that I agree with the checked baggage fee, but I find it rather amusing, maybe slightly ironic, that people complain about this fee more than the outrageous fact that we pay $500+ to fly from Calgary to Toronto.

Whats ironic is that the very notion that 500$ to fly from Calgary to Toronto is outrageous is a big reason why the baggage fee exists.

[Acey]

YYC-YYZ and back is less than $600 all in on tango fares assuming you book a week or two in advance, so let's not exaggerate. The base fare is mostly attributable to high demand and the duopoly that exists on the route, but keep in mind you pay $30 for the lovely new terminal in Calgary, you pay $25 to Toronto, an airport that has some of the highest landing fees in the world, you pay for security, and you pay tax. This represents $100 of your round-trip airfare that's out of AC's hands regardless of their base airfare.



Then you help pay for gas (not cheap), and you help pay for the very high Canadian air traffic control user fees, which are very very not cheap. The airline get dinged for every mile flown in Canadian airspace, and then further dinged just to have their plane in the vicinity of Toronto which is the busiest airspace in Canada.

Just some side info, here's a display of what Toronto - Vancouver flights do sometimes, not only for favourable winds, but because sometimes flying longer over less expensive airspace can end up saving you money. AC's dispatch in Toronto has powerful software (taken from German airline Lufthansa) that takes it all into consideration and picks the most optimal route. Whatever.



Do a dummy booking on something like Vancouver - Honolulu, you'll see that despite flying 900 miles further, the base fare is $100 less... and I reckon that is almost entirely attributable to the aforementioned duopoly and high demand, more specifically the difference in elasticity of demand on the two routes. People are more likely to sideline their Hawaii plans versus some necessary family or business travel to the east coast via Toronto. It's no surprise, but I've been told that Air Canada prints money on Calgary/Edmonton - Toronto to the point that one of the afternoon Edmonton - Toronto flights is (or was at one point) the most profitable domestic leg in their system. Anyway, going to Hawaii you pay less for ATC fees because very little of the flight is in expensive Canadian airspace, but you do pay US tax and customs/immigration fee which negate the advantage of only having to pay Vancouver's $20 improvement fee and not that of an additional Canadian airport.

I don't expect this info to make it any easier to pay an arm and a leg to get to Toronto, and yes AC/WJ are screwing you, but maybe this will shed some light on the method in which they're screwing you and where your money is going.

So... the comparison to the US, who include in the base fare whatever fuel surcharge they want to add:

United dummy booking on round-trip Los Angeles - Chicago (similar length to YYC-YYZ)

Base fare: $153.49 USD x2

Taxes/fees - $51.22:
Federal ticket tax of 7.5%: $23.02
9/11 Security fee: $11.20
Facility Charge: $9.00 (compare to outrageous Canadian AIF's above)
US Flight Segment Tax: $8.00 (effectively your ATC fees, pretty much nothing)

Total: $358.20 USD = $439.96 CAD

So there you see US flyers get it easy with fees and, there's competition as well. I count six airlines - American, United, Virgin, Spirit, Southwest, and Frontier flying LAX/SNA/ONT - ORD/MDW. Again for comparison, a dummy booking SFO-MIA (50% longer flight distance, and is the only airline on the route) is $590 USD ($724 CAD) round-trip, of which $67 USD is fees.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

Yup, I fly every week and that is the best part of priority. Get on first so my backpack can go in the bin and not at my feet.

With priority can't you get on last and still have the overhead space? That's really what I want. I have no desire to sit an airplane for half an hour while everyone else boards before sitting there for another say five hours. I also don't carry much on though because once I make the decision I'm checking a bag then I might as well pack it well and not carry all kinds of stuff around the airport with me. I am probably in the minority though.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by littlereddevil

Not that I agree with the checked baggage fee, but I find it rather amusing, maybe slightly ironic, that people complain about this fee more than the outrageous fact that we pay $500+ to fly from Calgary to Toronto.

Air travel is has gotten way cheaper over the last 30 years. When we moved to Calgary in 1979, it was $400 per seat one-way from Toronto to Calgary. That's $1,284 in today's dollars.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by Slava

With priority can't you get on last and still have the overhead space? That's really what I want. I have no desire to sit an airplane for half an hour while everyone else boards before sitting there for another say five hours. I also don't carry much on though because once I make the decision I'm checking a bag then I might as well pack it well and not carry all kinds of stuff around the airport with me. I am probably in the minority though.

I can only speak to short haul flights on small planes but you need to get the eff on ASAP or you risk having your bags at your feet. There are always 4 or 5 people walking up and down the aisle opening bins looking for somewhere to put their bag.

I am the same. I only have my laptop backback. If I need to bring more than that I will check a bag. It helps that I don't have to pay the $25 but I have always done it this was, even when you didn't have to pay.

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by Slava

With priority can't you get on last and still have the overhead space? That's really what I want. I have no desire to sit an airplane for half an hour while everyone else boards before sitting there for another say five hours. I also don't carry much on though because once I make the decision I'm checking a bag then I might as well pack it well and not carry all kinds of stuff around the airport with me. I am probably in the minority though.

Depends on how you get the priority boarding. If you get priority through either the Gold member system (WJ) or by sitting in an exit row, there are no reserved bins. If you are sitting in Plus (WJ), there are reserved overhead bins. Basically you can get on last, find the carry-on of someone in the back of the plane in the Plus bin, dump it on the floor, put your stuff in and you're good.

[cracher]

Originally Posted by Slava

With priority can't you get on last and still have the overhead space? That's really what I want. I have no desire to sit an airplane for half an hour while everyone else boards before sitting there for another say five hours. I also don't carry much on though because once I make the decision I'm checking a bag then I might as well pack it well and not carry all kinds of stuff around the airport with me. I am probably in the minority though.

It generally is not a problem to find overhead space if you are sitting in Zone 1. My grandma wasn't feeling so great at the beginning of the year so I did 19 round trips over 45 days, often being the last person to board. There was always a spot for the carryon.

With regards to Calgary to Toronto, I think they can charge $700+ and still sell flights. What are the alternatives? Driving - 10L/100km at $1.25/L over 3400km plus 2 days of time plus a hotel stay in the middle. $500 plane ticket wins every time.