Oops... $6M Calgary Bridge doesn't fit...

[4X4]

So much bridge hate in this city. It's weird. I think it'd be cool if Calgary developed some kind of bridge fetish, where companies or community associations would sponsor pedestrian bridges all over the city, and they'd try to one up the last one built.

Rome has fountains, Edmonton has mullets, Calgary could have bridges.

I'm only half kidding. Nothing turns me off more about walking than having to cross a big f-off street like MacLeod, or Shaganappi. Frankly, I'd rather drive, even if I live in this community, and I just want to go to that mall just across there, but if I have to walk up along a sidewalk that's just a few feet from cars going 60-80, then stand at a corner, while hundreds of cars wizz by, then scurry across the 6 lane street quickly before the light turns, or to get out of the way of people trying to turn left, I'll just drive, TYVM.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Do you know how much it costs to put in things like traffic lights, that save a few motorists 30 seconds of driving or waiting at stop signs?

People that complain about relatively small things like this would be shocked at what infrastructure costs for a major city are. The Glenmore Trail - Ogden Road SE interchange costs 125 million.

[Fire]

Originally Posted by Joborule

You're missing the point.

Shaganappi is a big road with heavy vehicle traffic to cross. It's designated as a HOV corridor, so that means priority will be given to N-S traffic, rather than pedestrian traffic wanting to cross over from one side to the other.

Because of this barrier, it greatly discourages pedestrian traffic between either side of Shaganappi, both for crossing over it, as well locally. But if you give them access that doesn't interfere with traffic, and it'll encourage more pedestrian traffic, which leads to more business for retail/commercial on both side of Shaganappi. And in the future, they will likely be residential buildings constructed where Canadian Tire and Northland Mall are right now, so the bridge will be needed anyway.

You make some good points. You have lessen my rage. For some reason I was also thinking you could cross on the Crowchild overpass which is not the case.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by 4X4

So much bridge hate in this city. It's weird. I think it'd be cool if Calgary developed some kind of bridge fetish, where companies or community associations would sponsor pedestrian bridges all over the city, and they'd try to one up the last one built.

That's a bit of a misnomer. Few people actually hate the bridge. Lots of people hate the way it was handled from beginning to end by city hall. The majority of Calgarians didn't want the bridge originally. City hall went ahead against the majority which you can understand would equate to some unhappy people. Then then go ahead and outsource it overseas which is that last thing you would think a city hall would try and pull on a construction that was already not widely accepted. The bridge was late, the welding was bad, it supposedly went over budget. Although the finished product is all right it was just handled so poorly that it just throws another wrench in the growing distrust citizens have for city hall.

Sometimes it's good to look at an outside perspective and from the outside you certainly can critique the bridge and the way it was handled;

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/03/07...payer-watchdog

This is via the taxpayer watchdog not anyone vested one way or another. It is what it is.

Now that the smoke has cleared its a nice bridge but at the end of the day it's just a bridge and the fact that it's a highly controversial topic in this city still is 100% the fault of city hall so don't blame us blame the people that created the mess. In hockey terms you could say city hall handled things in a similar manner that Kevin Lowe, MacTavish, Katz have handled that organization. Sure they are going to get a fantastic new building in a few years that fans will use and love but that doesn't change the fact that their fans are very unhappy about how they are operating the business.

[darklord700]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

It's just shrinkage. It happens to everyone.

The length of a bridge is a function of temperature or even atmospheric pressure. I can see how it can shrink 10cm from on location to another.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

That's a bit of a misnomer. Few people actually hate the bridge. Lots of people hate the way it was handled from beginning to end by city hall. The majority of Calgarians didn't want the bridge originally. City hall went ahead against the majority which you can understand would equate to some unhappy people. Then then go ahead and outsource it overseas which is that last thing you would think a city hall would try and pull on a construction that was already not widely accepted. The bridge was late, the welding was bad, it supposedly went over budget. Although the finished product is all right it was just handled so poorly that it just throws another wrench in the growing distrust citizens have for city hall.

Sometimes it's good to look at an outside perspective and from the outside you certainly can critique the bridge and the way it was handled;

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/03/07...payer-watchdog

This is via the taxpayer watchdog not anyone vested one way or another. It is what it is.

Now that the smoke has cleared its a nice bridge but at the end of the day it's just a bridge and the fact that it's a highly controversial topic in this city still is 100% the fault of city hall so don't blame us blame the people that created the mess. In hockey terms you could say city hall handled things in a similar manner that Kevin Lowe, MacTavish, Katz have handled that organization. Sure they are going to get a fantastic new building in a few years that fans will use and love but that doesn't change the fact that their fans are very unhappy about how they are operating the business.

It was only "highly controversial" because people are stupid. And what exactly was "the mess" ? A delay? Dear god.

The design contract was handed to an architect renowned worldwide for his bridges.

THE HORROR!

Sometimes a person's resume counts for something. Even in construction.

Even your in your article the watchdog group says they couldn't take it off the list because of "popular demand". So I wouldn't really put that opinion too high and act like it's some scientific result.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by nik-

It was only "highly controversial" because people are stupid. And what exactly was "the mess" ? A delay? Dear god.

The design contract was handed to an architect renowned worldwide for his bridges.

THE HORROR!

Sometimes a person's resume counts for something. Even in construction.

Even your in your article the watchdog group says they couldn't take it off the list because of "popular demand". So I wouldn't really put that opinion too high and act like it's some scientific result.

This is not a good opening sentence when it comes to trying to make a case to support your opinion.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

This is not a good opening sentence when it comes to trying to make a case to support your opinion.

If people are still crying about the Peace Bridge, any case I try to make will be wasted. The case has been made on this site numerous times. Obviously they have a set in stone opinion and it's a waste of time.

[mrkajz44]

For those that don't drive there, the issue is not that the traffic lights are 350m away with a crosswalk. It's the fact that people were not using the crosswalk (no matter how reasonably close it was). There are people running accross lanes of 5 or so lanes of traffic where most people are doing about 80. It was dangerous. And sometimes people on the road stopped (!!) to let the people jaywalk.

I think this is more about cutting down on those incidents than anything else.

[Addick]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Now that the smoke has cleared its a nice bridge but at the end of the day it's just a bridge and the fact that it's a highly controversial topic in this city still is 100% the fault of city hall so don't blame us blame the people that created the mess.

People were furious because they didn't know: i) how much a pedestrian bridge actually costs; ii) how minuscule the cost of the bridge was compared the infrastructure burden they place on the City; and iii) about the spending restrictions placed on the Provincial funds used to pay for the bridge.

Is it really the City's fault that people had the misconceptions coming to the debate? It is really the City's fault that when they put out the correct information local media decided to show the local outrage rather than publish the facts?

[Flash Walken]

When I talk to local vancouverites who have recently been to Calgary, the Peace Bridge is a top 5 discussion topic for 100% of them.

Everyone seems to think it's really cool.

I've seen it but haven't walked through it. Next time I've back in Calgary, it's on my list of things to do.

It's already a landmark.

You know what people said about Calgary prior to the peace bridge? It's brown and the sides of the road are dirty and the weather is unpredictable.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Addick

People were furious because they didn't know: i) how much a pedestrian bridge actually costs; ii) how minuscule the cost of the bridge was compared the infrastructure burden they place on the City; and iii) about the spending restrictions placed on the Provincial funds used to pay for the bridge.

Is it really the City's fault that people had the misconceptions coming to the debate? It is really the City's fault that when they put out the correct information local media decided to show the local outrage rather than publish the facts?

Can I remind you of the responses of the contempt that city hall had for city residents that opposed the bridge;

“As with most bold architecture, there will be some people who love it and some people who don’t love it. I think it’s beautiful, elegant.” -Alderman Druh Farrell

“Sometimes there are people who vote against sunshine.” – Mayor Dave Bronconnier

This is the politician "your opinions don't matter as we know what's best" speak that drives citizens crazy. I didn't think it was even up for debate at this stage that city hall's poor handling of the bridge is the main reason that it's become so controversial.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

You know what people said about Calgary prior to the peace bridge? It's brown and the sides of the road are dirty and the weather is unpredictable.

Well that hasn't changed as the city still looks like a dump for 7-8 months of the year and well you only have to be in Calgary this January to know about how the weather is all over the map.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Well that hasn't changed as the city still looks like a dump for 7-8 months of the year and well you only have to be in Calgary this January to know about how the weather is all over the map.

But the discussion has shifted, which was his point.

[rotten42]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Can I remind you of the responses of the contempt that city hall had for city residents that opposed the bridge;

“As with most bold architecture, there will be some people who love it and some people who don’t love it. I think it’s beautiful, elegant.” -Alderman Druh Farrell

“Sometimes there are people who vote against sunshine.” – Mayor Dave Bronconnier

This is the politician "your opinions don't matter as we know what's best" speak that drives citizens crazy. I didn't think it was even up for debate at this stage that city hall's poor handling of the bridge is the main reason that it's become so controversial.

This has always been my position. It isn't the bridge that I'm pissed with. It was the process. That said this bridge over Shag is needed. I've had to hit the binders on many occasions from people trying to run across there.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Can I remind you of the responses of the contempt that city hall had for city residents that opposed the bridge;

“As with most bold architecture, there will be some people who love it and some people who don’t love it. I think it’s beautiful, elegant.” -Alderman Druh Farrell

“Sometimes there are people who vote against sunshine.” – Mayor Dave Bronconnier

This is the politician "your opinions don't matter as we know what's best" speak that drives citizens crazy. I didn't think it was even up for debate at this stage that city hall's poor handling of the bridge is the main reason that it's become so controversial.

How is that comment from Farrell contempt?

It seems like a perfectly vanilla, obvious statement.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Well that hasn't changed as the city still looks like a dump for 7-8 months of the year and well you only have to be in Calgary this January to know about how the weather is all over the map.

Well now it's a city that looks less like a dump 7-8 months of the year, and more beautiful for the remaining 4-5 months.

All for the low cost of satisfying pedestrian traffic.

You are proving the Bronco sunshine quote here that you think so unfairly characterizes your dissent.

Even more Bizarre, when you stack this opinion on the belief that the city of Calgary should help the flames build a new building.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Even more Bizarre, when you stack this opinion on the belief that the city of Calgary should help the flames build a new building.

I do agree the city should help but I certainly would hope they go about it much smarter as it will be equally a hot topic. Coming out and saying "people will complain about anything" and working secretly behind the scenes with the Flames rather than being transparent would indeed likely result in the same sort of PR disaster.

I know you guys love the bridge and that's great and all but I'm a little shocked you guys think the city handled it well.

[nik-]

What do you think they didn't handle well? Single sourcing it? Not letting the public decide the design?

[SebC]

Originally Posted by rotten42

This has always been my position. It isn't the bridge that I'm pissed with. It was the process.

But without the process, you don't get the Peace Bridge. You get boring.