Does Giordano win the Norris?

[Huntingwhale]

He'll get a nomination. But to win the actual trophy I think the team will have to make the playoffs.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

I agree with you, but history is littered with defensemen who were better than the Norris winner but didn't win the award because they didn't make the playoffs.

Really? Littered? I call bull#### on that. Where is this list of Norris quality defensemen that didn't get a sniff because their teams didn't make the playoffs?

I've heard that narrative for the Hart trophy, but never for the Norris. I think you might be getting the two awards mixed up.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by New Era

Really? Littered? I call bull#### on that. Where is this list of Norris quality defensemen that didn't get a sniff because their teams didn't make the playoffs?

I've heard that narrative for the Hart trophy, but never for the Norris. I think you might be getting the two awards mixed up.

Always so snarky. How about this:
I cannot find a single Norris trophy winner that didn't make the playoffs

[codynw]

Originally Posted by New Era

Really? Littered? I call bull#### on that. Where is this list of Norris quality defensemen that didn't get a sniff because their teams didn't make the playoffs?

I've heard that narrative for the Hart trophy, but never for the Norris. I think you might be getting the two awards mixed up.

Shea Weber is a pretty good example. I'm sure he's not alone.

[Locke]

Gio has every handicap in the book, hes kicking ass and taking names on a bubble team in the West.

To beat out the big names hes going to have to put up a performance that cant be ignored. He's going to have to be head and shoulders above everyone else.

If his name is 'in the mix' then hes going to get screwed.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

He should be in the mix, as he is having a great year, but in no way is he a lock. I think by the end of the year, he will be one of the leading D scorers, but unless the Flames make the playoffs, or he is ahead in the scoring race by a sizable margin, my guess is that he will be passed over for the win. Tons of great defensemen have not won the award, no shame in that.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Always so snarky. How about this:
I cannot find a single Norris trophy winner that didn't make the playoffs

Then say just that, instead of saying something completely different. You inferred that there have been a number of defensemen in the history of the Norris trophy that did not win because they played on a non-playoff team. This is fallacious.

The Norris was traditionally awarded to the best defenseman in the game and was the core component to the best defense in the game. Since teams that play good defense and have the top defense in the NHL almost always end up in the post season that is not a stretch. You rarely see a top defenseman on a team that has a minus goal differential, and a minus differential is a pretty good indicator of whether you make the post season. So it only makes sense that the top defenseman would be on the top defensive team and they would always be a playoff team. The only time this could have possibly have changed is when the award started being given to the guy that scores the most point on the blueline, which is a #######ization of the award itself, but even then those players were on top teams headed for the playoffs. So you saying that the Norris is always won by a defenseman on a playoff team is not a revelation in any form. But it is completely different to what you said about the Norris trophy history being littered by defenseman being deserving of the award but being denied because their teams failed to make the playoffs.

[saillias]

We are probably getting shut out of the end of season awards.

A top team's coach will win the Jack Adams. NYI or Nashville, probably.

Gaudreau will have to pass Forsberg in points but even then, the media is pushing the Ekblad story really hard.

Giordano won't win. His name is relatively new to the hockey world, and that will work against him.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Frankly, I hope he doesn't win the Norris. I hope none of our players ever win an individual award, with the exception of the Conn Smythe. I would prefer our players end up contributing to the best team in the NHL that carries the big silver thingy around the ice after the last game is played than have a bunch of guys who get the individual awards and the resulting ridiculous contracts. I like having my unknown players that just go out and win. Edmonton can have the glory whores who seek individual awards. I'll take the character guys who care about one trophy and only one trophy; Lord Stanley's Mug!

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by New Era

Frankly, I hope he doesn't win the Norris. I hope none of our players ever win an individual award, with the exception of the Conn Smythe. I would prefer our players end up contributing to the best team in the NHL that carries the big silver thingy around the ice after the last game is played than have a bunch of guys who get the individual awards and the resulting ridiculous contracts. I like having my unknown players that just go out and win. Edmonton can have the glory whores who seek individual awards. I'll take the character guys who care about one trophy and only one trophy; Lord Stanley's Mug!

While I agree in general, I would like Gio to be recognized and I don't think his play would be affected. His next contract is whatever he wants anyway. I felt the same with Kipper's Vezina.

The ones I really don't care much about at all are the Calder (because a fair number of winners are flash in the pan guys, and because a fair number are older rookies), the Lady Byng (because this is hockey), the Selke (too subjective and I think it's now turned into the "offensive guy who plays good defence" like Datsyuk instead of being for true shutdown forwards like Carbonneau or Gainey) and the Adams (because coaches of very good teams are too often overlooked).

[Locke]

I've always liked the Norris the best out of the regular season trophies.

The rest all have their obvious faults, but the Norris was my favourite.

Unfortunately with winners like Karlsson and Subban a lot of the shine on the trophy has been lost for me.

Its not 'best defenceman' anymore, its 'highest scoring defenceman' and thats just lame.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by New Era

Frankly, I hope he doesn't win the Norris. I hope none of our players ever win an individual award, with the exception of the Conn Smythe. I would prefer our players end up contributing to the best team in the NHL that carries the big silver thingy around the ice after the last game is played than have a bunch of guys who get the individual awards and the resulting ridiculous contracts. I like having my unknown players that just go out and win. Edmonton can have the glory whores who seek individual awards. I'll take the character guys who care about one trophy and only one trophy; Lord Stanley's Mug!

This makes no sense.

You better believe I want a Norris, Vezina, and Art Ross winner on the Flames. The likelihood of the Flames winning the cup with those players in the lineup is greatly improved.

How often do a group of "unkown players" as you call them, win the Stanley cup?

Players get individual awards based on great performances, and those performances generally translate into helping their team win.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Locke

I've always liked the Norris the best out of the regular season trophies.

The rest all have their obvious faults, but the Norris was my favourite.

Unfortunately with winners like Karlsson and Subban a lot of the shine on the trophy has been lost for me.

Its not 'best defenceman' anymore, its 'highest scoring defenceman' and thats just lame.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Igottago

This makes no sense.

You better believe I want a Norris, Vezina, and Art Ross winner on the Flames. The likelihood of the Flames winning the cup with those players in the lineup is greatly improved.

How often do a group of "unkown players" as you call them, win the Stanley cup?

Players get individual awards based on great performances, and those performances generally translate into helping their team win.

I think this makes no sense.

Is Giordano somehow a better player because they anoint him with the Norris? Will Gaudreau have a better career if he wins the Calder?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

That was a legitimate mistake. They thought it was Ray.

It happens.

[GioforPM]

[QUOTE=Enoch Root;5096345]I think this makes no sense.

Is Giordano somehow a better player because they anoint him with the Norris? Will Gaudreau have a better career if he wins the Calder?[/QUOTE]

Sergei Samsonov says no. So do Messrs. Berard, Mason, Myers (so far), Plett, and Jackman (I think I'd rather have Zetterberg or Nash at this point).

[heep223]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Sergei Samsonov says no. So do Messrs. Berard, Mason, Myers (so far), Plett, and Jackman (I think I'd rather have Zetterberg or Nash at this point).

Jackman won the Calder? Good lord....

[codynw]

Originally Posted by heep223

Jackman won the Calder? Good lord....

Barret Jackman, not Tim.

[Five-hole]

Originally Posted by heep223

Jackman won the Calder? Good lord....

Barrett, not Tim. Just in case you were thinking Tim.

Still a questionable call, though.

[Fire]

If Giordano gets ignored by the eastern media and falls out of the top-3 at least it would make contract negotiations slightly easier. If he won the Norris it would be pretty hard to avoid giving him a humongous contract that they might regret in a few years when they are pressed up against the cap.