Why is there so much hate for B.Jones?

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

52 posts in and no one has mentioned that he was a diving bitch 2 years ago. 3 dives in 4 games is Canuck worthy. good riddance.

Very true...I was souring on him for sure during that time...it was brutal. Hopefully that's the issue as Hartley or Iggy or someone called him out for it, that'd be amazing!

[Calgary4LIfe]

I believe that Hartley didn't like his lack of sandpaper before getting demoted. That he was unwilling to fight and mix it up. That is what it sounded like anyways, and a few posters commented on that in that specific thread at the time.

Jones was really decent (outside the diving) during that first season. Last season, he was largely unnoticeable on the ice. He can make it back to the NHL as long as he is committed to playing like Begin. Really up to him. I don't think there is any 'hate' towards him - but keep in mind that Jones has a fairly low ceiling and there are younger options in the system that I would say most fans would want to at least see tried first.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

I think something happened in the dressing room...it all happened so fast, and I recall a mention by Feaster hinting at attitude.

I hope he gets back to his tenacious ways, he's a good 4th C when he plays that way.

I'm pretty sure he had a verbal arguement on the ice durring practice with the coaches. He was asked to get off and was later waived.

Don't know what the fight was about, but my guess is that he questioned "accountability". Seemed like half of our top 6 were doing their own thing and where still getting top ice time.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I'm pretty sure he had a verbal arguement on the ice durring practice with the coaches. He was asked to get off and was later waived.

Don't know what the fight was about, but my guess is that he questioned "accountability". Seemed like half of our top 6 were doing their own thing and where still getting top ice time.

But, what about the meritocracy?

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

Very true...I was souring on him for sure during that time...it was brutal. Hopefully that's the issue as Hartley or Iggy or someone called him out for it, that'd be amazing!

Definitely not Hartley. That happened over 6-7 months before he landed in Hartley's doghouse. I sure hoped Iggy gave him crap for it back then.

[clintb]

It does feel like he just made a big transition around the time of that argument

Attitude changed, performance changed, and very tough for the coaches to deal with that

Jones was one of those "un noticed" guys who only became relevant when he became a problem

I don't think he'll last long, there's a ton of young guys looking for a spot who will work harder and be more interesting for fans

[Wolven]

I am a bit surprised that no one else has mentioned this...

I would put Reinhart above Jones on the list. I appreciate that at this exact moment Reinhart might not be better than B.Jones but I believe Reinhart has a higher ceiling and would be a servicable enough rookie 4th line player to put between Bouma, Jackman and/or McGratton.

I am also of the mindset that Horak could be moved over to RW instead of keeping him a center. So my list would look like this:

Stajan
Backlund
Monahan
Knight
Reinhart
Bouma
B.Jones
Granlund

I threw Granlund on at the end because there is a lot of talk about him making the team and should he succeed in doing so it would likely be at the expense of someone like B.Jones.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by New Era

But, what about the meritocracy?

Probably did not explain myself correctly. Yes you are correct where there is talent there are rewards.

I read an article way back when the arguement happened and the writer seemed convinced it was about Jones sloppy D play at the time. The only thing i could think of was that he did not like getting chewed out, while forwards like Iggy, Tangs, Cammi did very little in the way of getting back and helping in their own zone and probably did not get chewed out for it. Granted throwing your fellow players under the bus is not the way to go.

Again this is just my specualtion and i am more than likely way off base. Maybe he hit on Hartely's wife? The only thing i know, is that on ice arguement was the end for Jones last year.

[ricardodw]

I think that due to the total lack of size and grit on last year's Flames it became really hard for the 3-4 gritty players to carry all the load...

Jackman was forced to fight outside his weight range and was forced to focus on being tough all the time rather than trying to play some hockey shifts like he did in 2010-11.

Begin was brought into play for the Flames despite the fact that he was basically done as an NHL player ( 2 games for Nashville the year before) and was not big enough to have an impact in his 4th line grinder role.

Begin was not nearly as good a hockey player as Kostopolus or even McGrattan.

What was he doing taking up a roster spot and getting an NHL salary? I have my doubts whether Begin has enough left to help out the Heat and will be taking Ice time from Ferland.

It seem he was Hartley's personal buddy.

It would be a point of contention if and when Hartley asked Jones to goon it up when Begin was getting a pass because he was the Coach's ears in the room.

Hartley did not handle or appreciate the grittier players well.... Sarich was not the worst d-man on the roster but was a healthy scratch for most of the year. If Sarich had a contract like Jones he probably would have been sent to the Heat as well.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

In a nutshell. There was a falling out with he and Hartley and I don't know if the fences are mended or if he's good enough to make a roster where some prospects will likely get a chance. I assume he will be an injury call up at the most.

Yeah I don't really care about B Jones one way or another but I got to wonder what he did to PO Hartley so much.

[calumniate]

^^ Ricardo.. first off Begin was coming off an injury that almost threatened his career. I don't know where you get the notion that he wasn't big enough to be a fourth liner. He was our most active fighter last year really, and had the most success as well.

I'm pretty sure Blair Jones can't fight. There'd be no chance he'd take on a guy like Begin. That said I'm excited at the prospect of what Ferland can bring.. having guys that can be gritty and skilled is a huge bonus in this league.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by calumniate

^^ Ricardo.. first off Begin was coming off an injury that almost threatened his career. I don't know where you get the notion that he wasn't big enough to be a fourth liner. He was our most active fighter last year really, and had the most success as well.

I'm pretty sure Blair Jones can't fight. There'd be no chance he'd take on a guy like Begin. That said I'm excited at the prospect of what Ferland can bring.. having guys that can be gritty and skilled is a huge bonus in this league.

stats do get in the way of perceptions: hockey fights com

Begin got beaten by Tootoo 5-9 190

And fought non-fighter Garbutt 6-0 195, small fighter Clune (5-10 188) and Brown from Edmonton to a draw.

0-1-3 in 4 fights.... no memorable game changers, message senders or protection of team-mates.

Did as well as can be expected by a small 35 year old.

PS Jackman was 4-3-1 in his 8 fights.

and McGrattan was 2-0-1 in 19 games

[Resolute 14]

Wait, you're using an internet popularity contest as a "stat"?

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I believe that Hartley didn't like his lack of sandpaper before getting demoted. That he was unwilling to fight and mix it up. That is what it sounded like anyways, and a few posters commented on that in that specific thread at the time.

Jones was really decent (outside the diving) during that first season. Last season, he was largely unnoticeable on the ice. He can make it back to the NHL as long as he is committed to playing like Begin. Really up to him. I don't think there is any 'hate' towards him - but keep in mind that Jones has a fairly low ceiling and there are younger options in the system that I would say most fans would want to at least see tried first.

I was one such poster that made comments in this regard.

It's been a while now, but we were losing by 3 or 4 I think and Jones was playing with Comeau and they were playing quite a bit. I could see Comeau hitting everybody and getting the extra shot in clearly trying to get someone to fight him (although no one bit, it was obvious he was trying), Jones did nothing of the sort, his physical game didn't even ramp up.

Next game rolled around, and Jones was on waivers and Comeau moved up the lineup.

IMO it is clear that he was asked to mix things up and Jones just didn't do it. This was confirmed to me when all Hartley would say about Jones is that certain things can't leave the room.

[moon]

Originally Posted by calumniate

^^ Ricardo.. first off Begin was coming off an injury that almost threatened his career. I don't know where you get the notion that he wasn't big enough to be a fourth liner. He was our most active fighter last year really, and had the most success as well.

I'm pretty sure Blair Jones can't fight. There'd be no chance he'd take on a guy like Begin. That said I'm excited at the prospect of what Ferland can bring.. having guys that can be gritty and skilled is a huge bonus in this league.

Based on last year I am 100% sure that Begin can't fight. He may be willing but when your go to move is to grab on for dear life and hope to tackle the guy it's pretty pointless.

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

I think that due to the total lack of size and grit on last year's Flames it became really hard for the 3-4 gritty players to carry all the load...

It would be a point of contention if and when Hartley asked Jones to goon it up when Begin was getting a pass because he was the Coach's ears in the room.

Hartley did not handle or appreciate the grittier players well.... Sarich was not the worst d-man on the roster but was a healthy scratch for most of the year. If Sarich had a contract like Jones he probably would have been sent to the Heat as well.

Wow do you like to make stuff up. Hartley has always had big aggressive teams, dating back to his Stanley Cup winners in Colorado. He didn't handle his "grittier" players well because he didn't have any last year. Begin isn't a tough guy he was given a tryout to fill the fourth line hard to play against disturber roll. He won a contract in camp and did what was asked of him. Because Brent Sutter gave Jones too many minutes, maybe he got it in HIS head that he was better than he was and refused to do his job. Man you must hate the Flames, no matter what they do or who they draft/sign, or what any member of the management team says, you seem to have a better opinion and it makes it tough to read some of these threads.

[kirant]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I'm pretty sure he had a verbal arguement on the ice durring practice with the coaches. He was asked to get off and was later waived.

I think the shouting match with Gelinas (?) might have been the last straw. He didn't seem to be getting any time before that though.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

We certainly could have used Jones last year. Hell i had to watch Tanguay play center for half a year and even Comeau for a bunch of games. Both were awful. I dont think Jones is anymore than a 4th line/ pressbox guy and for some reason spends a lot of time falling down.

His main downfall was the conversation he had with Hartely that got him kicked off the team. My only guess is that he questioned Hartely's "keeping players accountable" speech. At that point in time half of our top 6 were doing their own thing when they wanted and still got ice time.

He certainly is in Hartely's dog house and i doubt he can get out of it unless he has an "uber-camp". He would have to out play Horak, Reinhart, Knight and Bouma. I could see him outplaying a couple of them,he has experience, but i doubt all of them. I do think Horak is way better than him and i rather have Horak over Jones.

Anyone remember what the incident was that caused Feaster and Hartley to send Jones down without much of an explanation? Wasn't there a disagreement with Glencross or something on the ice before things came to a head? My guess from what I recall was that he wasn't doing what was being asked of him. I remember Jones interviewed saying he would do whatever after he was sent down. I don't really think there is a hate on Jones but Feaster did say recently anyone not meeting the organizations mandate would be on the outside looking in.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

All I know is that Blair Jones didn't look like he belonged in the AHL. He was dominant in almost every period he played in a Heat jersey. In that sense, he's NHL player. However, he's almost in limbo because besides the Sharks game and Coyotes game, he didn't look like a regular NHLer.

IMO, Blair Jones is best served as an occasional substitute. A 13th man. If he doesn't make the Flames, I'll be more than happy to see him back in a Heat jersey. It was always fun to watch him get under the opponents' skin.