[News] Mark Cundari recalled

[MissTeeks]

He really does look like Gio.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

So you're saying being top 20 in scoring among D-men is an average season in your mind?

So you also expected him to lead the Flames with 90 blocked shots or does that surprise you a little bit?

I knew he was known as a shot blocker coming in so the fact he is leading in that regard isn't that much of a surprise.

Wideman is paid to be a top scoring Dman and if he isn't it is a bad season if he was a top 5-10 then I say it is great. Wideman hasn't done anything that I didn't expect. The fact he lived up to the contract in year 1 is good but I am not going to say he did anything above and beyond his pay grade to tout that he had a great year. I expected 40pt pace and for him to be a top scorer on the team. He lived up to those expectations. Average season by his standards he has averaged this pace 5 seasons running.

[$ven27]

He has a bit of that craziness in his eyes..

[Dr. Pepper]

Originally Posted by $ven27

He has a bit of that craziness in his eyes..

Yep - Love it.

So is he playing tonight or not?

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I knew he was known as a shot blocker coming in so the fact he is leading in that regard isn't that much of a surprise.

Wideman is paid to be a top scoring Dman and if he isn't it is a bad season if he was a top 5-10 then I say it is great. Wideman hasn't done anything that I didn't expect. The fact he lived up to the contract in year 1 is good but I am not going to say he did anything above and beyond his pay grade to tout that he had a great year. I expected 40pt pace and for him to be a top scorer on the team. He lived up to those expectations. Average season by his standards he has averaged this pace 5 seasons running.

Ahhh ok, so if he had 2 more points, which would put him in the top 10 then you would say he had a great season.

Thanks for clearing that up.

[cKy]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Wideman is a 2nd pairing d-man, and yes other 2nd pairing d-men make horrible plays.

Whoosh?

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Ahhh ok, so if he had 2 more points, which would put him in the top 10 then you would say he had a great season.

Thanks for clearing that up.

But he is not top 10 so yeah not a great season.

I just don't get how anyone can say Wideman was great this year unless you had low expectations for him in the first place? He is paid to be a top scoring Dman and he is up there so a good year. The thing is he doesn't have 2 more points and is not in the top 10.

It is like saying the Flames had 5 more shootout/OT wins they make the playoffs last year and reach there goals and had a good season. They didn't so they missed the playoffs and the season was a failure by the Flames standards but they were only 5pts out and still had 90pts.

[you got PHANUEFED]

It's nice to see a small sample size of these kids before seasons end.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

But he is not top 10 so yeah not a great season.

I just don't get how anyone can say Wideman was great this year unless you had low expectations for him in the first place? He is paid to be a top scoring Dman and he is up there so a good year. The thing is he doesn't have 2 more points and is not in the top 10.

It is like saying the Flames had 5 more shootout/OT wins they make the playoffs last year and reach there goals and had a good season. They didn't so they missed the playoffs and the season was a failure by the Flames standards but they were only 5pts out and still had 90pts.

Hahaha, ok.

2 points = greatness.

I understand.

[krynski]

If he had 2 pts less, he would still be top 30 and tied for points with veteran and D offensive producer Danny Boyle (6.67 mill/ yr)

D-men he would still be ahead of if he was 2 points less:
Green (over 6 mill/Yr)
Bouwmeester ( 6.68 mill/ yr)
Seabrook (5.8 mill/ yr)
Hedman (4 mill/ yr)
Chara (6.916 mill/ yr)
Gio (4.02 mill/ yr)

Nope, can't complain. He's great. Decent deal.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Hahaha, ok.

2 points = greatness.

I understand.

Do you? 2pts = exceeding expectations therefore having a better season than expected. Even then I expect Wideman to be close to top 10 scoring and shouldn't have said being 10th in scoring is great that was a mistake I sould have said he exceeded expectations and I would agree he had a really good season.

I am done arguing this I am not changing my opinion that Wideman earning his huge payday means he had a great season. HE DID WHAT HE WAS PAID TO DO and NOTHING MORE

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by krynski

If he had 2 pts less, he would still be top 30 and tied for points with veteran and D offensive producer Danny Boyle (6.67 mill/ yr)

D-men he would still be ahead of if he was 2 points less:
Green (over 6 mill/Yr)
Bouwmeester ( 6.68 mill/ yr)
Seabrook (5.8 mill/ yr)
Hedman (4 mill/ yr)
Chara (6.916 mill/ yr)
Gio (4.02 mill/ yr)

Nope, can't complain. He's great. Decent deal.

The 3 bolded are far better all around defensemen. We don't judge Dmen on points scored alone.

[krynski]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Do you? 2pts = exceeding expectations therefore having a better season than expected. Even then I expect Wideman to be close to top 10 scoring and shouldn't have said being 10th in scoring is great but exceeding expectations.

I am done arguing this I am not changing my opinion that Wideman earning his huge payday means he had a great season. HE DID WHAT HE WAS PAID TO DO and NOTHING MORE

Now you're being bitter. Sometimes, it's great to get what you pay for. As Calgary Flames fans, you should all be able to recognize that. We have certainly had our fair share of over-paid players.

You expect to get a top 10 dman for 5.25 mill? Yeah, good luck with that.

It's good that he got paid to perform better than he was expected. You have really high expectations and bang for your dollars.

[Enoch Root]

Wideman had a very good season and was a great addition.

It is too bad that the Flame's D is thin and he therefore was put into defensive situations that his game can't handle. But I don't blame him for that.

Right handed shot and a PP quarterback. Check.

Don't care what he gets paid and the cap will not be an issue for the life of his contract.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by krynski

Now you're being bitter. Sometimes, it's great to get what you pay for. As Calgary Flames fans, you should all be able to recognize that. We have certainly had our fair share of over-paid players.

You expect to get a top 10 dman for 5.25 mill? Yeah, good luck with that.

It's good that he got paid to perform better than he was expected. You have really high expectations and bang for your dollars.

Because he scored in the top 10 doesn't make him a top 10 Dman. I liked the signing when it was made (really hate that NMC though) and thought we were getting a top 4 Dman that was going to get us 40ish points per season and be great at moving the puck up the ice. He has provided that. I am not saying he had a bad season either I think he had a good year and lived up to his billing and his average over the past 4 years.

[krynski]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

The 3 bolded are far better all around defensemen. We don't judge Dmen on points scored alone.

What do you judge d-men on?

He's no.15 in league for TOI. His blocked shots is already mentioned. yeah, okay, +/- isn't that good. But hey, he's playing 25 mins on a team that has the 2nd most goals against. This guy has been nothing but solid.

EDIT: TOI per game

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by krynski

Now you're being bitter. Sometimes, it's great to get what you pay for. As Calgary Flames fans, you should all be able to recognize that. We have certainly had our fair share of over-paid players.

You expect to get a top 10 dman for 5.25 mill? Yeah, good luck with that.

It's good that he got paid to perform better than he was expected. You have really high expectations and bang for your dollars.

Maybe not top 10 d-man, but maybe top 30 dman? (i.e. "top pairing defenseman)

Denis Wideman is 24th highest paid dman (22nd highest cap hit)... I'd argue he's a below average top pairing dman, but excellent 2nd pairing dman. I would pencil his value closer to under $5M.... overpaid? Yes, but most UFA's are. But I wouldn't call him a steal or good value (purely dollar wise, not factoring acquisition cost) or anything.

FWIW I have no problem with Wideman this season, and he was better then I expected.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by krynski

What do you judge d-men on?

He's no.15 in league for TOI. His blocked shots is already mentioned. yeah, okay, +/- isn't that good. But hey, he's playing 25 mins on a team that has the 2nd most goals against. This guy has been nothing but solid.

I judege Dmen on defensive play and being able to shut down offensive players, in addition to their offensive capabilities. I am not even ripping on his +- I don't care for that stat. He is playing top minutes on a team that is horrible defensively it is not on him but he is not exempt. I have derailed this thread way too much already.

I think people are arguing I don't like Wideman or think he is terrible. He has been good and lived up to expectations but hasn't exceeded them in any way so I wouldn't call his year great.

[Anduril]

Seems a bit random to have a Wideman debate.

Poor Cundari, he should just change his name to Gio Jr.

[krynski]

Fair enough. I just don't see how he could have performed any better. I feel he's been stand-out and have really enjoyed watching him play. My expectations were low = exceeded expectations.