Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Go Back   Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community > Main Forums > The Off Topic Forum
Register Forum Rules FAQ Community Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-22-2012, 09:13 PM   #61
VO #23
Scoring Winger
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormius View Post
Well, I was thinking that there is no accountability from a sense that the worst that would happen is they lose their jobs. There is some kind of immunity that lawyers and judges, maybe everybody in the justice system that no other professions are able to escape from. Engineers, doctors, military can all be sued or go to jail for being incompetent or negligent. What are the consequences for those in the legal system?
Well, lawyers can be disbarred or face criminal charges. Canada is the last country in the common law world (I believe, anyways) in which lawyers are self-regulated. Law society discipline is something lawyers fear. As far as judges go, I would imagine they can be removed from the bench somehow but I don't know how egregious their conduct would have to be.

Moreover, do you really want judges making decisions based on what the personal consequences might be, ie if they could attract personal liability? They might refuse to make "tough calls" in order to save their own skin. I don't think it's a system we would want here.
VO #23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2012, 09:26 PM   #62
VO #23
Scoring Winger
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AR_Six View Post
She should absolutely go to prison. The oath doesn't mean very much anymore, practically speaking - most people are not heavily swayed by the fact that they swore on a bible to tell the truth. The deterrence of "if you're lying you rot in jail" is more important than it was.
Agreed, she committed perjury, she should serve jail time IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AR_Six View Post
But the appeal judge cannot overturn the trial judge's findings of fact without palpable and overriding error, so that will be largely useless in cases like these. And most criminal cases, really, I would think.
For the sake of both accuracy and efficiency. The trial judge is leaned on heavily to make findings of fact because they are actually in the courtroom listening to evidence being presented. They are the best authority to make the determinations - a lot of power is vested in them. I don't think it would be a good idea for appellate judges to start making new factual determinations years after the evidence was first introduced.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AR_Six View Post
No physical evidence where the only thing the trier of fact has to go on is a "he said she said" should never result in a conviction. Absent some strange and important context or surrounding circumstance, there is always going to be reasonable doubt where you have two conflicting stories and neither is corroborated.
I don't think it's so cut and dried, especially when dealing with issues of consent. Modifying the law as such would almost be like granting carte blanche to rapists as long as they were careful not to leave evidence (especially in the context of something like a drug-aided date rape). There might not be physical evidence, but that doesn't mean an assault didn't occur. Sexual assaults are already massively unreported, we don't need to empower criminals (and deny victims justice) anymore than already happens.
VO #23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2012, 09:31 AM   #63
Erick Estrada
Franchise Player
 
Erick Estrada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by polak View Post
Clearly the best option when there is a lack of physical evidence is judge both the accused and the complainant on their looks and see if it makes sense.
Essentially this is what the judge admitted which to me is unacceptable.
Erick Estrada is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2012, 09:32 AM   #64
Erick Estrada
Franchise Player
 
Erick Estrada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by VO #23 View Post
Moreover, do you really want judges making decisions based on what the personal consequences might be, ie if they could attract personal liability? They might refuse to make "tough calls" in order to save their own skin. I don't think it's a system we would want here.
Yes this is exactly what I want because if that was the case this man would have never lost 4 years of his life as the judge would have put more thought into the fact that there was reasonable doubt given the lack of evidence. Accountability is never a bad thing.
Erick Estrada is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2012, 10:39 AM   #65
undercoverbrother
Franchise Player
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Sylvan Lake
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erick Estrada View Post
Yes this is exactly what I want because if that was the case this man would have never lost 4 years of his life as the judge would have put more thought into the fact that there was reasonable doubt given the lack of evidence. Accountability is never a bad thing.

Who judges the Judges?
__________________
Captain James P. DeCOSTE, CD, 18 Sep 1993

Corporal Jean-Marc H. BECHARD, 6 Aug 1993
undercoverbrother is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2012, 11:57 AM   #66
Burninator
Franchise Player
 
Burninator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Exp:
Default

Coast Guard?
Burninator is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Burninator For This Useful Post:
Old 11-23-2012, 12:08 PM   #67
SoulOfTheFlame
First Line Centre
 
SoulOfTheFlame's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Hong Kong
Exp:
Default

Give her the chair.
__________________


SoulOfTheFlame is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2012, 12:11 PM   #68
Makarov
Franchise Player
 
Makarov's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Moscow
Exp:
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by undercoverbrother View Post
Who judges the Judges?
The Judicial Council of Canada (well, sort of.) More meaningfully, appellate courts, and ultimately the Supreme Court of Canada.
__________________
"Life of Russian hockey veterans is very hard," said Soviet hockey star Sergei Makarov. "Most of them don't have enough to eat these days. These old players are Russian legends."
Makarov is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:11 AM.

Calgary Flames
2025-26






Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Calgarypuck 2021 | See Our Privacy Policy