Price Is Right gives away Calgary Stampede trip...Bob Barker appalled and disgusted

[krazycanuck]

Originally Posted by Sowa

Mainly they believe that she should be fighting to end factory farming period not just modifying it.

It's things like this why I respect her. She's not pie in the sky, unicorns and pixie dust. her ideas are for reality not utopia.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Oh, that's all?

Eff them then.

Let me clarify. They aren't saying she should be getting rid of the production of meat, but that factory farming in itself is a very cruel practice and she needs to fight to go back to free range farming.

Animal rights activists want no meat, but say if she truly wants to have animals live a life with as little cruelty as possible before they get slaughtered then she should be fighting to do away with factory farms.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Sowa

You don't think the meat industry spends mucho dinero on lobbyists? We can end the discussion right here because obviously you have no idea what you are talking about.

Sure they spend on lobbyists, but that's not what you asserted. You claim that they essentially paid an opposing lobbyist enough money to flip their beliefs. I don't buy that.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by valo403

Sure they spend on lobbyists, but that's not what you asserted. You claim that they essentially paid an opposing lobbyist enough money to flip their beliefs. I don't buy that.

First, I didn't assert anything. I said a lot of animal rights activists claim that. Second, she does get paid by the meat industry. Does that taint her beliefs? I don't know. I don't really care either. Her and I don't have the same endgame.

[CaptainCrunch]

I can't get the thought out of my head about putting an elastic band on a cat's balls and riding it around the room.

If you replace a person riding the cat with a monkey, it could mean billions in terms of internet money. Billions.

While Bob Barker is to be respected for his concern for the welfare of animals, he is symptomatic of the whole Hollywood ideal that they don't have to know anything about or have visited or inspected the events or issues that they're protesting.

As stated in Team America World Police, "We'll read about it in the news paper and convince people that its our idea"

Matt Damon Matt Damon indeed.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

I wasn't really talking about abuse. Even regular acceptable actions.

Right, but drawing the line is the tricky part. For example, tattooing pet's ears, though probably a bit painful, is seen as justifiable. Entering your dog into dog fights is not seen as justifiable.

Originally Posted by You Need a Thneed

It certainly isn't anywhere close to being black and white.

Totally agree. I'm actually quite torn on the issue. If the Stampede was smart (which they aren't), they would pro-actively address this by eliminating the most egregious events and taking extra precautions wherever possible (and perhaps beginning to replace live animals with a fleet of futuristic robot animals, as suggested by troutman), before the government gets involved with more regulation/prohibition.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Sowa

First, I didn't assert anything. I said a lot of animal rights activists claim that. Second, she does get paid by the meat industry. Does that taint her beliefs? I don't know. I don't really care either. Her and I don't have the same endgame.

Perhaps I misinterpreted your post (which you mysteriously deleted for some reason) but your response to Locke didn't exactly give me much reason to engage in a nuanced discussion with you.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Makarov

Right, but drawing the line is the tricky part. For example, tattooing pet's ears, though probably a bit painful, is seen as justifiable. Entering your dog into dog fights is not seen as justifiable.



Totally agree. I'm actually quite torn on the issue. If the Stampede was smart (which they aren't), they would pro-actively address this by eliminating the most egregious events and taking extra precautions wherever possible (and perhaps beginning to replace live animals with a fleet of futuristic robot animals, as suggested by troutman), before the government gets involved with more regulation/prohibition.

The Alberta government? I think they have a good 50+ years before that even becomes a minor threat.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by valo403

Perhaps I misinterpreted your post (which you mysteriously deleted for some reason) but your response to Locke didn't exactly give me much reason to engage in a nuanced discussion with you.

I deleted it because I didn't really have time to get into an in depth convo about this, but it's fully quote in MMFs post.

And his post was that the idea of "Big Meat" is ridiculous. If he does not know that the meat industry has an extremely powerful lobby then he is not well informed on the topic.

[Knalus]

"Big Meat" created the animal rights activists. Once they fixed it so that regular, everyday people believed that all their meat came from the supermarket in plastic wrap and styrofoam trays instead of an actual animal, and that farms were happy little places with a red barn, a cow, three ducks and maybe a pig, they created their own monster. People are so removed from the reality of their own existence regarding food it's disturbing.

Every time you eat meat, something had to die. Either get over that, or go veggie. Either one is fine. My wife couldn't get over it, and is a vegetarian. I could, so I eat meat. But I try not to kid myself into thinking that it's just a nugget.

[zuluking]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Just to be clear...

You realize I was making a joke right? To compare a domestic cat to a rodeo animal is silly.

Good info though.

It isn't silly; it's closer to the truth than you obviously realize. However, the internet allows people to make authoritative comments on topics in which they have no knowledge or experience. I should know - I like bumping the climategate thread!

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by zuluking

It isn't silly; it's closer to the truth than you obviously realize. However, the internet allows people to make authoritative comments on topics in which they have no knowledge or experience. I should know - I like bumping the climategate thread!

I'm not sure what you're getting at here.

What is closer to the truth? Domestic animals = rodeo animals? Please expand as it makes no sense to me. You could conceivably compare dog shows to the rodeo but that's hardly your standard domestic pet.

And who made authoritative comments? The guy who posted the video? The guy I originally quoted? You? Me?

Domestic pet:

Sits around the house, goes for a walk, runs in a field

Rodeo animal:
Travels around the country in a trailer, is ridden by numerous men (hey, maybe they're comparable to fotze's mom!), tries to kill said men in many cases, is tackled by competitors (steer wrestling), is roped by competitors (calf roping), is raced around barrels, is subjected to somewhat dangerous races around a track.

I don't see how you think they are similar. I'm not even against rodeo or think that the animals are necessarily tortured or anything. I just don't see how a domestic animal has any similarities to a rodeo animal. They live totally different lives.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Sowa

I deleted it because I didn't really have time to get into an in depth convo about this, but it's fully quote in MMFs post.

And his post was that the idea of "Big Meat" is ridiculous. If he does not know that the meat industry has an extremely powerful lobby then he is not well informed on the topic.

I'm aware they have a powerful lobby, I was not aware that it included paying Temple Grandin to abandon her beliefs in order to promote them as you insinuated.

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by Locke

I'm aware they have a powerful lobby, I was not aware that it included paying Temple Grandin to abandon her beliefs in order to promote them as you insinuated.

I said that most in the animal rights industry believe that. She is in fact paid by the meat industry, not sure where her beliefs stood before they started paying her so I don't know if her beliefs changed.

[mikey_the_redneck]

I would say there are more incidents of your average pet owner abusing or neglecting their pets than rodeo/farmer types doing it.

To a rodeo team or farmer, the animals represent capital investment.

Clearly, the solution is to end pet ownership and add an equal rights amendment for anmials to the constitution.......

[return to the red]

Living in the Lethbridge area i'm interested to hear how many people have actually been to some of the larger feedlots in the area? How many have been to dairy barns, pork barns or chicken hatcheries?

You would be actually surprised at the sophistication, cleanliness and treatment of the animals in these places. Healthy, Disease free livestock is much more profitable than the other alternative.

Little known to people North of Claresholm is that Fort Macleod has a Horse rendering plant and believe it or not Horse meat, outside of North America, is huge business.

[missdpuck]

I agree, Devil's Advocate. Everyone is a hypocrite in some way. Do you know any perfect people? It's not a perfect world, so you do what you can. I am a vegetarian, and I avoid leather etc as much as possible. It is tough at work because I have uniform requirements. When someone tells me he/she is a complete vegan who uses no animal products, I keep my comments to myself. It may be possible, but not likely. As good as those intentions may be , there are animal and slaughterhouse by-products in so many unlikely things. But keep up the good intentions.

I've been to chicken farms that are far from clean and comfortable for the animals.
Nothing justifies eating veal. Jeez, I haven't had it a long time but it doesn't even taste like anything.

[Knalus]

Originally Posted by missdpuck

I agree DA. Everyone is a hypocrite in some way. Do you know any perfect people? It's not a perfect world, so you do what you can. I am a vegetarian, and I avoid leather etc as much as possible. It is tough at work because I have uniform requirements. When someone tells me he/she is a complete vegan who uses no animal products, I keep my comments to myself. It may be possible, but not likely. As good as those intentions may be , there are animal and slaughterhouse by-products in so many unlikely things. But keep up the good intentions.

Believe it or not, I know of a Vegan who calls himself one, that makes an exception for Turkey. Apparently he can't eat enough of the stuff. "Other than that he's a pure vegan".

[crazy_eoj]

I've never really understood how staunch animal rights activists square their beliefs with the fact that if Rodeo or meat industries didn't exist, it would likely mean the near extinction of many species, and if not than certainly a huge reduction in their populations.

Is it better to live as a meat or rodeo animal, than to never exist at all....?

[Knalus]

Originally Posted by crazy_eoj

I've never really understood how staunch animal rights activists square their beliefs with the fact that if Rodeo or meat industries didn't exist, it would likely mean the near extinction of many species, and if not than certainly a huge reduction in their populations.

Is it better to live as a meat or rodeo animal, than to never exist at all....?

I knew one university professor who claimed that if it wasn't for people, wheat would still be just another grass growing on a few hills in Iraq. People were, according to him, "the evolutionary tool wheat used to conquer the world".