I'd like to be convinced that expensive shoes would be a good investment for me, because I'm really harsh on my soles, so if you can explain it in scientific/economic terms that would be really helpful.
Vibram soles. 1mm thick piece of rubber applied to the bottom of your sole by just about any shoe repair place. Your soles will never wear through. Also makes floors less slippery.
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter12
You also will get Goodyear-welting, a process where the sole is sewn on to the shoe, thus allowing the sole to be replaced. Normally with mid and high-tier shoes, this is all done by hand. Further increasing the quality and detail of the shoe.
Not accurate. Almost no one welts by hand. Vass does, but EG and Lobb? No. I don't even think Gaziano & Girling do this.
Quote:
The best thing about good men's shoes is that - depending on the brand - the more you pay, the more you see in an exponential increase in quality. Edward Greens (retail around $1000) will be far better than $325 Allen Edmonds. I have 5 pairs of AEs, and they are amazing shoes, but I know that a pair of Edward Greens or John Lobbs could be worn 100 times a year for 40 years. 4000 wears for 1000 bucks is a pretty good deal.
Having owned nearly every reputable shoe brand up the chain, I can assure you that this is also not true. Your AEs (or better still, Aldens), especially if made 10 years ago or so, will last at least as long as EG's or Lobbs. The real difference between these kinds of shoes is mainly styling, i.e. the elegance of the lasts, which is generally noticeable. A lot of AE lasts are pretty gunboatish and I personally hate the cap on the Park Avenue which is their flagship shoe. Higher end makers will certainly use better leather, but this is a "diminishing returns" thing, to really notice the difference between the calf Alden uses and a pair of Lobbs is going to take someone who knows their stuff. The finish is a big thing - the attention to really minute detail and craftsmanship you get out of the top makers is really something, and elevates their product to art-form levels. But 99% of the population will not notice, appreciate or care at all about this, so paying 1200 bucks for it is only worth it if you REALLY care.
Quote:
Stay away from fashion brands like Hugo Boss or John Varvatos. Always go for classic over stylish. Start with a pair of brown cap-toes.
This is classic wisdom but actually a lot of Varvatos shoes made in Italy are goodyear welted in, IIRC, the same factory that makes mid-range Ferragamos. Granted, the styling is often gaudy but the quality isn't necessarily poor. Boss, you're less likely to do well with. The other thing is that to the uninitiated, one brown captoe is the same as another. You can easily get ugly brown captoes. You can also end up wearing a really elegant shoe and have it completely fail to work with your preferred cut of suit.
Quote:
Never ever buy a garbage pair of Aldos again. No one should buy a square-toed shoe ever. The least of your worries will be the sneer that flashes across my face when I pass you on the street.
Advice correct, condescending snobby attitude uncalled for. There is always going to be someone who knows so much more than you that it makes you look like the guy wearing the square-toed Aldos. Ron Rider from Rider Boot Company occasionally shows up on web forums for the sole apparent purpose of making everyone feel stupid about their knowledge of shoes.
I should say that if you ARE going to step up into the realm of top-flite dress shoes, a name that gets less recognition than it deserves is Sutor Mantelassi. The shoes are on par with Lobbs but are generally sold under $1000 retail and half that at discount. As far as widely available names are concerned, Ferragamo's "Tramezza" line is extremely well-made and has some really beautiful lasts, though the leather is arguably not quite up to the price point. Also, if you go to Brooks Brothers and look at their shell offerings (the ones that are US-made), those are made by Alden. Their made-in-England offerings are mostly Alfred Sargent, and are pretty decent shoes as well, though the materials are hit-or-miss.
To be perfectly honest, having sampled just about everything at the buffet, for value and quality, I could happily live the rest of my life just wearing Alden footwear.
Last edited by AR_Six; 02-01-2012 at 12:55 PM.
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Vibram soles. 1mm thick piece of rubber applied to the bottom of your sole by just about any shoe repair place. Your soles will never wear through. Also makes floors less slippery.
Hate the look of them, but I understand the utility. I have a pair of Loake chukkas with a vibram sole on them that I use on dry winter days.
Quote:
Not accurate. Almost no one welts by hand. Vass does, but EG and Lobb? No.
I said more hand detailing, I never specifically mentioned the sole, did I? As far as I know, that is correct. EDIT: Nevermind. I do not know what I am talking about.
Quote:
Having owned nearly every reputable shoe brand up the chain, I can assure you that this is also not true. Your AEs (or better still, Aldens), especially if made 10 years ago or so, will last at least as long as EG's or Lobbs. The real difference between these kinds of shoes is mainly styling, i.e. the elegance of the lasts, which is generally noticeable. A lot of AE lasts are pretty gunboatish and I personally hate the cap on the Park Avenue which is their flagship shoe. Higher end makers will certainly use better leather, but this is a "diminishing returns" thing, to really notice the difference between the calf Alden uses and a pair of Lobbs is going to take someone who knows their stuff. The finish is a big thing - the attention to really minute detail and craftsmanship you get out of the top makers is really something, and elevates their product to art-form levels. But 99% of the population will not notice, appreciate or care at all about this, so paying 1200 bucks for it is only worth it if you REALLY care.
I've suspected as much, but I had heard differently from people who have had, say Loakes and Lobbs over the same space of time. Good to know though.
Quote:
This is classic wisdom but actually a lot of Varvatos shoes made in Italy are goodyear welted in, IIRC, the same factory that makes mid-range Ferragamos. Granted, the styling is often gaudy but the quality isn't necessarily poor. Boss, you're less likely to do well with. The other thing is that to the uninitiated, one brown captoe is the same as another. You can easily get ugly brown captoes. You can also end up wearing a really elegant shoe and have it completely fail to work with your preferred cut of suit.
I've heard that almost all the new Varvatos are glued. I assume it is the higher-end, over-priced Varvatos that are good-year welted?
Quote:
Advice correct, condescending snobby attitude uncalled for. There is always going to be someone who knows so much more than you that it makes you look like the guy wearing the square-toed Aldos. Ron Rider from Rider Boot Company occasionally shows up on web forums for the sole apparent purpose of making everyone feel stupid about their knowledge of shoes.
Fair enough but you have to appreciate the irony I was attempting. I don't really care what other people wear, it's just what people seem to expect when anyone makes an argument in favour of wearing a better quality garment or shoe. If you read some of the later posts I make, I am pretty self-deprecating about my ability to afford any sort of high-end shoes.
Quote:
I should say that if you ARE going to step up into the realm of top-flite dress shoes, a name that gets less recognition than it deserves is Sutor Mantelassi. The shoes are on par with Lobbs but are generally sold under $1000 retail and half that at discount. As far as widely available names are concerned, Ferragamo's "Tramezza" line is extremely well-made and has some really beautiful lasts, though the leather is arguably not quite up to the price point. Also, if you go to Brooks Brothers and look at their shell offerings (the ones that are US-made), those are made by Alden. Their made-in-England offerings are mostly Alfred Sargent, and are pretty decent shoes as well, though the materials are hit-or-miss.
Never heard that about Mantelassi. Not a fan of Ferragamo's styling, period.
Quote:
To be perfectly honest, having sampled just about everything at the buffet, for value and quality, I could happily live the rest of my life just wearing Alden footwear.
My Indys are my favourite thing. It's too bad that almost everyone feels the same way and eBay's Alden offerings are basically going for regular market value. I'll stick with AEs from now on. The Strand is a decent shoe, and I don't mind the Park too much myself. My style leans more towards trad American though. It's an easy look to pull off in the university, casual, but a step above your regular prof or grad student, I guess.
This was great, thanks! I really appreciate getting advice like this.
A calculator (can't remember the brand) from ~1980 that I keep in my garage. Still has the original battery! I have to hold the back on when I use it but it still works great. It's at the point now where I think there's no way it can still be giving the right answer so I'll do the calcs by hand and on another calculator and it'll be bang on. I waste a lot of time re-calculating instead of just trusting it...
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Parents bought me a sony ghetto blaster when I was 15. I'm in my 30s now, and that thing still works perfectly. The tape deck works, the CD works. Nothing is broken. The thing has also suffered a ton of abuse. I've taken it fishing, camping, road trips...it's been thrown around, dropped from a few feet up, water splashed on it, and everything still works.
Sony used to make good products.
Likewise, I've got a set of these Sony headphones here at the office that I bought about 10 years ago when I was in college.
I've stepped on em and cracked them in multiple places along the headband portion, and their basically held together with electrical tape at this point. But they still work fine, I use them for 6ish hours a day work listening to music and they still sound great after all these years. The build quality on the plastic parts doesn't appear to be anything special, but the electronic/audio components are all still humming along fine... knock wood.
All this talk about shoes made me wonder what type of shoes my pops gave me for a present a year ago. They are damn near indestructible, and look great (nice brown leather shoes). He said he doesn't wear them anymore and just passed them along. I'd never actually taken a look at the brand before because I know nothing about shoes. Looks like they happen to be Alfred Sargeant good year welded shoes.
Vibram soles. 1mm thick piece of rubber applied to the bottom of your sole by just about any shoe repair place. Your soles will never wear through. Also makes floors less slippery.
Not accurate. Almost no one welts by hand. Vass does, but EG and Lobb? No. I don't even think Gaziano & Girling do this.
Having owned nearly every reputable shoe brand up the chain, I can assure you that this is also not true. Your AEs (or better still, Aldens), especially if made 10 years ago or so, will last at least as long as EG's or Lobbs. The real difference between these kinds of shoes is mainly styling, i.e. the elegance of the lasts, which is generally noticeable. A lot of AE lasts are pretty gunboatish and I personally hate the cap on the Park Avenue which is their flagship shoe. Higher end makers will certainly use better leather, but this is a "diminishing returns" thing, to really notice the difference between the calf Alden uses and a pair of Lobbs is going to take someone who knows their stuff. The finish is a big thing - the attention to really minute detail and craftsmanship you get out of the top makers is really something, and elevates their product to art-form levels. But 99% of the population will not notice, appreciate or care at all about this, so paying 1200 bucks for it is only worth it if you REALLY care.
This is classic wisdom but actually a lot of Varvatos shoes made in Italy are goodyear welted in, IIRC, the same factory that makes mid-range Ferragamos. Granted, the styling is often gaudy but the quality isn't necessarily poor. Boss, you're less likely to do well with. The other thing is that to the uninitiated, one brown captoe is the same as another. You can easily get ugly brown captoes. You can also end up wearing a really elegant shoe and have it completely fail to work with your preferred cut of suit.
Advice correct, condescending snobby attitude uncalled for. There is always going to be someone who knows so much more than you that it makes you look like the guy wearing the square-toed Aldos. Ron Rider from Rider Boot Company occasionally shows up on web forums for the sole apparent purpose of making everyone feel stupid about their knowledge of shoes.
I should say that if you ARE going to step up into the realm of top-flite dress shoes, a name that gets less recognition than it deserves is Sutor Mantelassi. The shoes are on par with Lobbs but are generally sold under $1000 retail and half that at discount. As far as widely available names are concerned, Ferragamo's "Tramezza" line is extremely well-made and has some really beautiful lasts, though the leather is arguably not quite up to the price point. Also, if you go to Brooks Brothers and look at their shell offerings (the ones that are US-made), those are made by Alden. Their made-in-England offerings are mostly Alfred Sargent, and are pretty decent shoes as well, though the materials are hit-or-miss.
To be perfectly honest, having sampled just about everything at the buffet, for value and quality, I could happily live the rest of my life just wearing Alden footwear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by peter12
Hate the look of them, but I understand the utility. I have a pair of Loake chukkas with a vibram sole on them that I use on dry winter days.
I said more hand detailing, I never specifically mentioned the sole, did I? As far as I know, that is correct. EDIT: Nevermind. I do not know what I am talking about.
I've suspected as much, but I had heard differently from people who have had, say Loakes and Lobbs over the same space of time. Good to know though.
I've heard that almost all the new Varvatos are glued. I assume it is the higher-end, over-priced Varvatos that are good-year welted?
Fair enough but you have to appreciate the irony I was attempting. I don't really care what other people wear, it's just what people seem to expect when anyone makes an argument in favour of wearing a better quality garment or shoe. If you read some of the later posts I make, I am pretty self-deprecating about my ability to afford any sort of high-end shoes.
Never heard that about Mantelassi. Not a fan of Ferragamo's styling, period.
My Indys are my favourite thing. It's too bad that almost everyone feels the same way and eBay's Alden offerings are basically going for regular market value. I'll stick with AEs from now on. The Strand is a decent shoe, and I don't mind the Park too much myself. My style leans more towards trad American though. It's an easy look to pull off in the university, casual, but a step above your regular prof or grad student, I guess.
This was great, thanks! I really appreciate getting advice like this.
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I'm honestly asking, because I can never tell anymore if I'm overreacting to something since on one hand people think it's offensive and the other side people yell about being too PC.
__________________ Uncertainty is an uncomfortable position.
But certainty is an absurd one.
If using derogatory slang that obviously refer's to a racial group is inappropriate, which I think it is since at least one of them is filtered, then why wouldn't similar slang that refers to sexual orientation be the same?
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I'm honestly asking, because I can never tell anymore if I'm overreacting to something since on one hand people think it's offensive and the other side people yell about being too PC.
If he's serious I'd say it's inappropriate but, for all his faux pretentiousness, I don't think peter is a homophobe. I'm fairly certain is was tongue-in-cheek.
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My otterbox case for my iPhone has been great. I'm historically clumsy with my phone and it keeps it safe no matter how many times I drop it.
I bought an OtterBox case for my phone when it was new. I took the case off a week ago to clean it, I was in a hurry to leave the house and didn't put the case on. Sure enough, I now have a big scratch on the screen...
I'm honestly asking, because I can never tell anymore if I'm overreacting to something since on one hand people think it's offensive and the other side people yell about being too PC.
Lifeproof case for my iphone. I work a somewhat rough and tumble job at times and the thing takes a beating, been dropped in water, and is all around amazing. Totally blows me away and I wouldn't put my phone in anything else.
