Clergy told to take on the 'new atheists'

[Thor]

Originally Posted by North East Goon

Where do Atheists have there funerals take place - serious question?

Church, funeral homes, pubs, homes, grave yards, beach, boats, etc..

[rubecube]

I think religion has a role to play in society. The problem comes when that role tries to consume intellectual debate and exert itself on other people.

[Thor]

From the article:

It expresses concern that Christians are facing hostility at work and says the Church could lose its place at the centre of public life unless it challenges attempts to marginalise religious belief.

The rallying call comes amid fears that Christians are suffering from an increasing level of discrimination following a series of cases in which they have been punished for sharing their beliefs.

Won't someone please stop this persecution of Christians!

[North East Goon]

Originally Posted by Thor

Church, funeral homes, pubs, homes, grave yards, beach, boats, etc..

Church - really?

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by North East Goon

Church - really?

sure why not...your dead anyways, youll never know.

[Thor]

Yup, in fact its very common in Nordic countries to baptize children, have conformations (big celebration in Iceland, kids love money/gifts) and of course funerals in Churches.

This in nations where its majority non believers.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by North East Goon

Where do Atheists have there funerals take place - serious question?

For me: I want all of my family and friends to meet at a house or hall and have a nice 'ole party to celebrate my life and the memories/stories that we all shared together. I'd like the party to start mid-day sometime and carry on well into the night, although I guess I won't be around to dictate that!

Certainly no point for me to have a service at a church.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by rubecube

I think religion has a role to play in society. The problem comes when that role tries to consume intellectual debate and exert itself on other people.

I think what the world needs now is some kind of new humanistic mysticism. One that respects mythology, but does not focus on literalism. The lessons are true, if the symbols are not. We would be free to study all myths, not just our own.

Some churches have already moved in this direction. It may take a few generations for the majority of the world to get there too.

http://www.context.org/ICLIB/IC12/Campbell.htm

[photon]

Cultural Christians

Sometimes people partake of the social aspects of an institution without having to believe all the claims.

I enjoy the actual music of worship music, even if I don't actually want to worship.

[driveway]

I want the Darth Vader pyre for my Atheist funeral.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by Savvy27

To wrongly label somebody out of ignorance of what they are actually doing, doesn't make the label true.

It all depends on your frame of reference. One man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.

My main point is that Dawkins and his kind aren't the best to actually educate or sway people not already on their side. Tyson or Sagan or... hell... Bill Nye.. or someone with that approach to this type of thing are far more effective at that, IMO.

[PYroMaNiaC]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Trying to compute?
You know God and he isnt part of any religion?
You have a God that noone else knows about?

I can't speak for Vulcan and I really try to stay out of these 'discussions', but I believe that he's trying to tell you that knowledge of God doesn't always come from religion. Religion is like minds gathering to worship a common deity (theology, idealism...whatever) or in your opinion, similarly brainwashed people gathering to worship their invisible leader. But a person can believe in a God that has very few similar characteristics to any of the gods worshiped by masses. So, potentially, yes to both questions.

[theonlywhiteout]

i want my funeral to be like a flames game. when the pallbearers bring me out on roller skates i want navras to play, strobing red lights, and then foo fighters. and maybe the occasional mourner from another funeral stumbling into my funeral by accident and my friends/family can boo them like a hockey fan wearing the wrong jersey at the dome.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Cheese
Trying to compute?
You know God and he isnt part of any religion?
You have a God that noone else knows about?

Originally Posted by PYroMaNiaC

I can't speak for Vulcan and I really try to stay out of these 'discussions', but I believe that he's trying to tell you that knowledge of God doesn't always come from religion. Religion is like minds gathering to worship a common deity (theology, idealism...whatever) or in your opinion, similarly brainwashed people gathering to worship their invisible leader. But a person can believe in a God that has very few similar characteristics to any of the gods worshiped by masses. So, potentially, yes to both questions.

Pretty much, except I'm a little jaded and I was never comfortable with believing in a god but needed the experience.

The confusion came from me trying to convey that it is a personal god, but that doesn't mean no one else knows about this god. From my listening to others and reading some of the enlightened people from the past, many others know this god.

Here's a few sayings from Kabir:

Like the pupil in the eyes
The Lord resides inside
Ignorant do not know this fact
They search Him outside

___________

I laugh when I hear that the fish in the water is thirsty.

You don't grasp the fact that
what is most alive of all

is inside your own house; and so you walk from one holy city to the next
with a confused look!

Kabir will tell you the truth:
go wherever you like, to Calcutta or Tibet;
if you can't find where your soul is hidden,
for you the world will never be real!

I don't know what sort of a God we have been talking about.
The caller calls in a loud voice to the Holy One at dusk.
Why? Surely the Holy One is not deaf.
He hears the delicate anklets that ring on the feet of an insect as it walks.

Go over and over your beads, paint weird designs on your forehead,
wear your hair matted, long, and ostentatious,
but when deep inside you there is a loaded gun,
how can you have God?

________________

O Kabir, He alone the Warrior, who takes on the "mind" head-on
Crushing the shield of the sensual five, all duality is gone

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

Pretty much, except I'm a little jaded and I was never comfortable with believing in a god but needed the experience.

The confusion came from me trying to convey that it is a personal god, but that doesn't mean no one else knows about this god. From my listening to others and reading some of the enlightened people from the past, many others know this god.

Here's a few sayings from Kabir:

Like the pupil in the eyes
The Lord resides inside
Ignorant do not know this fact
They search Him outside

___________

I laugh when I hear that the fish in the water is thirsty.

You don't grasp the fact that
what is most alive of all

is inside your own house; and so you walk from one holy city to the next
with a confused look!

Kabir will tell you the truth:
go wherever you like, to Calcutta or Tibet;
if you can't find where your soul is hidden,
for you the world will never be real!

I don't know what sort of a God we have been talking about.
The caller calls in a loud voice to the Holy One at dusk.
Why? Surely the Holy One is not deaf.
He hears the delicate anklets that ring on the feet of an insect as it walks.

Go over and over your beads, paint weird designs on your forehead,
wear your hair matted, long, and ostentatious,
but when deep inside you there is a loaded gun,
how can you have God?

________________

O Kabir, He alone the Warrior, who takes on the "mind" head-on
Crushing the shield of the sensual five, all duality is gone

Thanks appreciate your input. I think you are trying to tell us you are Muslim.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by Cheese

Thanks appreciate your input. I think you are trying to tell us you are Muslim.

The Muslims and the Hindus both tried to claim Kabir, he was neither and both and so am I.

Here's one of his thoughts on religion.

Ages have passed shaving the head,
yet union with Ram is not here
Recitation of Ram Naam is futile,
when mind is engaged elsewhere

[HeartsOfFire]

Here's a novel idea:

Why not have God himself come down and smack some sense into these 'new atheists?'

[Cheese]

Originally Posted by HeartsOfFire

Here's a novel idea:

Why not have God himself come down and smack some sense into these 'new atheists?'

we are ready for that! Brett The Hitman Hart has been hired to cover that side of things!

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Thor

From the article:




Won't someone please stop this persecution of Christians!

I think that these cartoons are a little unfair, we've seen some pretty militant atheists as well that are equally dis-respectful of peoples beliefs.

I'm not an overly religious guy, I don't go to church, but if one more person decides to debate with me by using the term space alien to describe god, I'm going to run over him with my jeep.

[flamesfever]

I think the low attendance in church these days has more to do with the large amount of time and energy it takes young people to support and raise a family. I believe it's also affecting attendance and participation in the various service clubs, community associations etc.