[Signing] Flames agree to terms with Jaromir "the GOAT" Jagr (1yr, $1 mil + $1 mil bonuses)

[AC]

Sandbox. Because he's gritty.

[Johnny Makarov]

I'm pretty his Goat nickname comes from, when he sacrifices 2 of these in the off-season to the hockey gods.

[ASP#26525]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

I'm pretty his Goat nickname comes from, when he sacrifices 2 of these in the off-season to the hockey gods.

It all makes sense now.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by AC

Sandbox. Because he's gritty.

"it's because he's gritty"

[wretched34]

Can the Jagr experiment be over now?
The so Called "G.O.A.T." may be great, but definitely not at this time.
I don't know why he keeps getting a pass, simply because he's old, and "it'll take time for him to get up to speed". Isn't that a bad thing? Isn't that a detriment to the team?

Flames have played 15 games, and have a record of 8-7-0
Jagr has played in 6 games.
In the 9 games he has missed, the Flames are 6-3-0
In the 6 games he's played in, the Flames are 2-4-0
Obviously not entirely his fault, but it goes to show that we're no better with him in the line-up, and could lead some to believe that his inability to produce, especially on the top line cost us a few opportunities to score goals, that may have lead to a few more wins.

He's had time on the PP, and a few games on the top line, and has produced 2 assists, 1 even strength, and one on the power play.
He's behind the play constantly, and aside from a few strong possession shifts, has done nothing but look slow and out of place.
While his board work is still solid because of his size and IQ, he hasn't been able to drive the play from the boards back into open ice, or find a way to get his stick on the puck while he's in the slot, he just swings it around hoping to hit something.

I know this will be a super unpopular opinion, but it's the one I have.
The bottom 6 needs a shake up, and we have 2 guys in Stockton who are in the top 4 for league scoring, who got there to start the year on Jankowski's wings. It's time to inject some youth, speed and desperation into the line-up. Send Freddie down, and put Jagr in the press box. He's too poor defensively to play on the 4th line, and to slow for the top 6.

[Huntingwhale]

How dare you

[Looch City]

No, we should fire Ken King instead.

[GreenLantern2814]

Hot take.

[jg13]

People have been banned for less.

[Locke]

I still cant believe we signed Jagr.

[rohara66]

So you pull Jagr out of the lineup and move up who exactly?

Brouwer, Lazar, Hamilton, Glass, Versteeg.... none have looked any better then Jagr on the third line. In fact Jagr has generated more chances, looks and offensive zone pressure then all those other hacks combined.

And AHL players do not produce at the same pace when brought up to the NHL typically. I dont think thats the answer either.

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by rohara66

So you pull Jagr out of the lineup and move up who exactly?

Brouwer, Lazar, Hamilton, Glass, Versteeg.... none have looked any better then Jagr on the third line. In fact Jagr has generated more chances, looks and offensive zone pressure then all those other hacks combined.

And AHL players do not produce at the same pace when brought up to the NHL typically. I dont think thats the answer either.

Agree with all of this.

1. Disappointing Jagr missed camp because he took a while to get going. But he definitely isn't any less dangerous than at least 8 of our other forwards. And he wins every board battle. He makes them look easy.

2. Exactly this with AHL guys. No, Bennett and the rest of the bottom 6 aren't producing. I know! Mangiapane or Poirier are the answers to our problems!!!

Just like Jankowski was.....

[wretched34]

Originally Posted by rohara66

So you pull Jagr out of the lineup and move up who exactly?

Brouwer, Lazar, Hamilton, Glass, Versteeg.... none have looked any better then Jagr on the third line. In fact Jagr has generated more chances, looks and offensive zone pressure then all those other hacks combined.

And AHL players do not produce at the same pace when brought up to the NHL typically. I dont think thats the answer either.

You're right, no one has looked better, hence the suggestion to call up a kid who is showing offensive instinct, and scoring touch while lighting up the AHL. They'll come up with confidence, and a lot more drive than anyone currently in the bottom 6. This is why NHL teams have farm systems, to draw good players who are playing well, to replace players who are not playing well.

Do I expect Mangiapane or Hathaway to be PPG or better in the NHL, not at all. Do I expect them to produce more than 0 points in 15 games... Ya. Ya I do.

Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan

Agree with all of this.

1. Disappointing Jagr missed camp because he took a while to get going. But he definitely isn't any less dangerous than at least 8 of our other forwards. And he wins every board battle. He makes them look easy.

2. Exactly this with AHL guys. No, Bennett and the rest of the bottom 6 aren't producing. I know! Mangiapane or Poirier are the answers to our problems!!!

Just like Jankowski was.....

Sure, he missed camp, but that's because no one wanted him.
He's since had plenty of time to get his legs back under him, especially considering he's one of the most active, and in shape guys in the league. Fact is, he's older, and slower now, than he ever has been.
Again, correct, he's not any worse than the other bottom 6 forwards. Point is, he's not defensive enough to be a 4th liner, and not fast enough to be a top 6. So, he's the odd man out.

As for your second point, are you saying because our bottom 6 has been terrible, the developing players in our system, who are being groomed for exactly this reason, definitely won't be either, so no use in trying?
Just leave it as it is, it'll work itself out. Another 15 games should do the trick.

Bennett and Jankowski have started to look a lot better together, and have had their chances. They need confidence, and some passion to push them.

[---Hatrick---]

I thought Jagr was pretty good last night

[colbym72]

Theres no arguing what Jagr lacks in foot speed. But when in the offensive zone, he controls the play as well as anyone on the team outside of 13

[wretched34]

Originally Posted by colbym72

Theres no arguing what Jagr lacks in foot speed. But when in the offensive zone, he controls the play as well as anyone on the team outside of 13

I think possession and play are two totally different things.

Jagr can control possession on the boards better than anyone on the team, but that hasn't amounted to controlling the play yet. Which is why he has 2 points in 6 games. He gets stuck along the boards and while he can keep the puck in the zone, he hasnt been able to get it off the boards well to create any real chances.

[MolsonInBothHands]

His control along the boards led to a couple of nifty passes to the tape of Bennet's stick, which turned decent chances into immediate turnovers.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by wretched34

Can the Jagr experiment be over now?
The so Called "G.O.A.T." may be great, but definitely not at this time.
I don't know why he keeps getting a pass, simply because he's old, and "it'll take time for him to get up to speed". Isn't that a bad thing? Isn't that a detriment to the team?

Flames have played 15 games, and have a record of 8-7-0
Jagr has played in 6 games.
In the 9 games he has missed, the Flames are 6-3-0
In the 6 games he's played in, the Flames are 2-4-0
Obviously not entirely his fault, but it goes to show that we're no better with him in the line-up, and could lead some to believe that his inability to produce, especially on the top line cost us a few opportunities to score goals, that may have lead to a few more wins.

He's had time on the PP, and a few games on the top line, and has produced 2 assists, 1 even strength, and one on the power play.
He's behind the play constantly, and aside from a few strong possession shifts, has done nothing but look slow and out of place.
While his board work is still solid because of his size and IQ, he hasn't been able to drive the play from the boards back into open ice, or find a way to get his stick on the puck while he's in the slot, he just swings it around hoping to hit something.

I know this will be a super unpopular opinion, but it's the one I have.
The bottom 6 needs a shake up, and we have 2 guys in Stockton who are in the top 4 for league scoring, who got there to start the year on Jankowski's wings. It's time to inject some youth, speed and desperation into the line-up. Send Freddie down, and put Jagr in the press box. He's too poor defensively to play on the 4th line, and to slow for the top 6.

Please. Jagr is the least of our worries.

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by wretched34

As for your second point, are you saying because our bottom 6 has been terrible, the developing players in our system, who are being groomed for exactly this reason, definitely won't be either, so no use in trying?
Just leave it as it is, it'll work itself out. Another 15 games should do the trick.

Bennett and Jankowski have started to look a lot better together, and have had their chances. They need confidence, and some passion to push them.

I actually do believe it will work itself out, especially with how Jankowski and Bennett are moving out there. I don't know what everyone else is watching but I think Bennett has been more snakebitten than anything.

I don't believe our AHL players are being groomed to be brought out of an environment they are successfully developing in, to get 8 minutes a night on a stagnant bottom 6 in the NHL.

If the goal is to improve their development, you leave them.

[rohara66]

Originally Posted by wretched34

Do I expect Mangiapane or Hathaway to be PPG or better in the NHL, not at all. Do I expect them to produce more than 0 points in 15 games... Ya. Ya I do.

We've seen Hathaway in the NHL already.... 41 games played, 1 goal and 7 assists.

He is not the answer to any offensive problems (which is what we're talking about) but I do think he is probably more effective in 4th line role then Versteeg, Brouwer or Glass.