2012 Toronto Blue Jays Season Thread - Page 39 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

flambers · 07-20-2012, 09:19 AM

Wow, lots of players.....

New Jays

Brandon Lyon - Right Handed Relief Pitcher
JA Happ - Lefty Starter
David Carpenter - Right Handed Relief Pitcher

Caged Great · 07-20-2012, 09:31 AM

After looking at it more in depth, we lost our 4th best young catcher, and probably our 10th or 12th best pitching prospect for a legit starter and a pair of relievers. The rest of the guys we sent were filler depth

Roof-Daddy · 07-20-2012, 09:43 AM

Lyon, Happ and Carpenter......will any of these guys help the Jays beyond just this season?

KelVarnsen · 07-20-2012, 09:45 AM

See I was right. A trade happened. So happy for Snider, kid deserves the chance.

flambers · 07-20-2012, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Lyon, Happ and Carpenter......will any of these guys help the Jays beyond just this season?

Lyon and Happ I assume are short term help. Carpenter was optioned to AAA and he could have long term value.

Caged Great · 07-20-2012, 10:00 AM

Happ is under control for a few years, and carp is until 2017. Lyon is a free agent but we could likely keep him without issue.

The Big Chill · 07-20-2012, 10:13 AM

Happ should be a nice addition to the back of this rotation. I've read a few Astros fans' opinions who thought that Happ has recently been pitching much better and was starting to look a little bit more like the pitcher he was a couple of years ago.

Caged Great · 07-20-2012, 10:33 AM

From AA: Happ will be a pen arm as well, and will take a spot in the rotation if one of the guys in the rotation faulters.

The guys that we received were for depth purposes.

The guys we moved out were mostly filler anyway and we have enough of that as it is so it's probably the most boring 10 player trade in the history of sports.

SuperMatt18 · 07-20-2012, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caged Great

From AA: Happ will be a pen arm as well, and will take a spot in the rotation if one of the guys in the rotation faulters.

The guys that we received were for depth purposes.

The guys we moved out were mostly filler anyway and we have enough of that as it is so it's probably the most boring 10 player trade in the history of sports.

Not sure why they would acquire Happ to be a pen arm when our rotation is in need of some help.

Happ has been a starter since his rookie season and you think they would at least give him some starts and go from there, especially with the current state of the rotation.

Romero
Alvarez
Villanueva
Laffey
Cecil

Happ has to be an improvement over at least one of those guys.

Ruttiger · 07-20-2012, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KelVarnsen

See I was right. A trade happened. So happy for Snider, kid deserves the chance.

Seriously? Not sure how many more chances he can realistically I expect. I don't think they've been unfair with him at all. Sooner or later someone has to actually seize their chances and take it upon themselves to make it work.

That being said, he's still only 24, but the clock is ticking.....

Where ru Chris O'Sullivan · 07-20-2012, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruttiger

Seriously? Not sure how many more chances he can realistically I expect. I don't think they've been unfair with him at all. Sooner or later someone has to actually seize their chances and take it upon themselves to make it work.

That being said, he's still only 24, but the clock is ticking.....

I'd really like the Jays to plug Snider in 3rd or 5th in the lineup with Bautista out, give him days off vs. lefties and a few of the aces out there.

We need him, but we need him to be a run producer (3,4,5 in the lineup). Hoping he will seize these last 2.5 months of the season.

dustyanddaflames · 07-20-2012, 11:37 AM

Ya I think this is Snider's last real chance within the Blue Jays organization - hoping for the kid to pull through, the club really needs someone to step up and take the RF position from within.

JayP · 07-20-2012, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Where ru Chris O'Sullivan

I'd really like the Jays to plug Snider in 3rd or 5th in the lineup with Bautista out, give him days off vs. lefties and a few of the aces out there.

We need him, but we need him to be a run producer (3,4,5 in the lineup). Hoping he will seize these last 2.5 months of the season.

Snider should play everyday and especially against lefties. How can they expect the kid to learn to hit lefties sitting on the bench? The idiotic Cito strategy set him back years.

JayP · 07-20-2012, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruttiger

Seriously? Not sure how many more chances he can realistically I expect. I don't think they've been unfair with him at all. Sooner or later someone has to actually seize their chances and take it upon themselves to make it work.

Baseball moreso than other sports is a game of failure. This notion of sample sizes, be damned - you gotta produce when you get a chance is ridiculous. Any other player can have a terrible month (Bautista in April anyone?), but when a young player does it it's unacceptable.

In 2009/2010 Snider got around a full season of plate appearances and put up slightly above league average offense. Obviously from a LF you are hoping for more than that in the long run, but there's plenty of corner outfielders who have long careers putting up league average offense and the Jays were getting it from a 21/22 year old (who can play above average defense). Then in 2011 he has a horrible start to the season and he's back in the minors.

Pagal4321 · 07-20-2012, 12:03 PM

Did you really just compare Jose Bautista's struggles in the month of April to Travis Snider's struggles?

So the same amount of lee-way should be given to the reigning HR king and Travis Snider?

I kind of get the point you are trying to make but you really aren't doing a good job with it. Yes, all players should have the same level of accountability on this team, and not only in baseball but in all sports. Unfortunately, the younger kids have the option of being sent back down to "fix things" without any repercussion to the team.

Sylvanfan · 07-20-2012, 12:14 PM

Remember years ago when Halladay was going to be traded to the Phillies, and JA Haap was rumored to be part of the package coming back?

I think he could probably fill in as a bottom of the rotation starter for the Jays, especially with their current injury predicament. He's nothing great, but with the Astros I think he's been forced into a role he's not really suited to. Let him come to spring training as a guy fighting for the 5th spot in the rotation and he might be better off. In the mean time if Cecil continues to get hit around, they can swap him out for Haap and see if he fares any better.

KelVarnsen · 07-20-2012, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruttiger

Seriously? Not sure how many more chances he can realistically I expect. I don't think they've been unfair with him at all. Sooner or later someone has to actually seize their chances and take it upon themselves to make it work.

That being said, he's still only 24, but the clock is ticking.....

I think Snider was rushed to the Jays then struggled and bounced around too much to ever just sit and learn. He has never complained, and been a excellent team guy from what I have read.

Got to root for a guy who lost his mother and grandmother in a short time span as a teenager.

VERVE · 07-20-2012, 01:01 PM

I always liked Happ while he was with the Phillies. Another good deal for AA -anything to get rid of Cordero.

flames_fan_down_under · 07-20-2012, 01:02 PM

Not a terribly exciting deal but a deal that addresses some of the concerns for the Jays. I'm not sad to see Cordero go and Happ is apparently starting to put it together.

Just happy to see Snider up with the big club.

JayP · 07-20-2012, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pagal4321

Did you really just compare Jose Bautista's struggles in the month of April to Travis Snider's struggles?

So the same amount of lee-way should be given to the reigning HR king and Travis Snider?

I kind of get the point you are trying to make but you really aren't doing a good job with it. Yes, all players should have the same level of accountability on this team, and not only in baseball but in all sports. Unfortunately, the younger kids have the option of being sent back down to "fix things" without any repercussion to the team.

It's not about lee-way though - it's about that even some of the best players in the game can have brutal months. That's baseball. These guys aren't robots that put up the same numbers every single month - there's big ups and downs in there and it's really tough to distinguish between bad play and bad luck because it is very, very possible to have a brutal month predicated in large part on factors out of a player's hands.

To judge a young player so quickly into that season was ridiculous. Imagine if we decided to cut bait on Rasmus this year because he struggled through the first 1.5 months of the season.