Concacaf has 3.5 spots. Right now I'd say Mexico, Costa Rica and USA are almost automatic. For the .5 spot that leaves Panama, Honduras, Jamaica, T&T, Canada.
My bet is Panama to take the spot. But can we say we're better or have played better than the other teams? Not really. Also remember that some of these teams have huge home field advantages which we don't also have.
"Could make the World Cup" is a lot more realistic than "should" right now.
With a quality RB... yep I have no issues standing by that. Whether they can execute in Central America finally is another matter, but on paper, one of the top 3.5 teams in concacaf now with that addition? no question.
If you develop (or recruit ha) a really quality RB into the mix, something that is a major gap right now, we are every bit as good as any team outside of Mexico or Canada in CONCACAF on paper with Arfield right now.
I think Hoilett-Hutch-Arfield are three of the best midfielders in concacaf outside of the big two teams and Andy Najar. A midfield rounded out with Will Johnson and Akindele is as good or better than every team in Concacaf outside the big 2. Cavallini and Larin are two of the best forwards in Conacaf if Cavallini comes back. If the backline was a little stronger I have no reservation saying they would be favorites for one of the 1.5 spots. RB is brutal. CB is passable but not great. If Gasparrotto keeps developing so quickly he could be a key piece at CB by next year maybe (there are also two potential "recruits" in Vittoria and Ferreira) but that's no help at RB. Playing Ouimette there didn't look like a long term solution. Aird can play there but I've heard he is more of a RM/RW
The ticos roster was weaker than Canada's in the last round of qualis (and Panama was even worse, they have nobody playing at a decent level in europe anymore), they were mostly players from the Costa Rican domestic league with Ruiz, Campbell and a couple decent export defenders. I don't know what the situation is with some of their foreign players not accepting call ups but they barely beat Haiti at home.
Panama, like Honduras, has declined a lot in quality since the last cycle. I think that if Costa Rica got all their players back, Canada could go toe to toe with them these days.
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With a quality RB... yep I have no issues standing by that. Whether they can execute in Central America finally is another matter, but on paper, one of the top 3.5 teams in concacaf now with that addition? no question.
If you develop (or recruit ha) a really quality RB into the mix, something that is a major gap right now, we are every bit as good as any team outside of Mexico or Canada in CONCACAF on paper with Arfield right now.
I think Hoilett-Hutch-Arfield are three of the best midfielders in concacaf outside of the big two teams and Andy Najar. A midfield rounded out with Will Johnson and Akindele is as good or better than every team in Concacaf outside the big 2. Cavallini and Larin are two of the best forwards in Conacaf if Cavallini comes back. If the backline was a little stronger I have no reservation saying they would be favorites for one of the 1.5 spots. RB is brutal. CB is passable but not great. If Gasparrotto keeps developing so quickly he could be a key piece at CB by next year maybe (there are also two potential "recruits" in Vittoria and Ferreira) but that's no help at RB. Playing Ouimette there didn't look like a long term solution. Aird can play there but I've heard he is more of a RM/RW
The ticos roster was weaker than Canada's in the last round of qualis (and Panama was even worse, they have nobody playing at a decent level in europe anymore), they were mostly players from the Costa Rican domestic league with Ruiz, Campbell and a couple decent export defenders. I don't know what the situation is with some of their foreign players not accepting call ups but they barely beat Haiti at home.
Panama, like Honduras, has declined a lot in quality since the last cycle. I think that if Costa Rica got all their players back, Canada could go toe to toe with them these days.
We will agree to disagree. Costa Rica, U.S and Mexico all have stronger pools than us. Look at how many players Costa Rica have playing in top tier European leagues. Kendell Watson isn't even a starter for them at CB, that's crazy!
Larin and Cavillini are not great forwards. Larin hasn't shown he can get it done for Canada yet, he had chances to win the El Salvador game, but didn't. He's good, but not elite, even by Concacaf standards.
We still haven't won in Central American in forever. Costa Rica barely beating Haiti at home isn't a slight, Haiti are much improved, have some really good players and are athletic as hell. Panama has never had many players in Europe, doesn't mean they aren't good. They've always primarily been domestic and Central American based. Many play in Colombia too.
Again, I don't see why we should be favoured over any of these countries, even if we got a new RB. At best it's a coin toss, at worst, they're better (T&T have beaten Panama away and drawn Mexico twice this year!, twice!, I'd love to see us do that!)
Last edited by Johnny199r; 01-04-2016 at 11:14 PM.
Yeah fair enough that we disagree... I just think this is a completely different team to a year ago that doesn't get enough respect. I'm not disparaging costa rica, they are ok and one of the better teams in the federation.... But nowhere on the level of the big 2 and i think canada is a couple players away from being on their level. They only had 3 or 4 players from top euro leagues in their last squad, and I think Canada can run with them, except for our backline as mentioned.
Larin is 20 and scored about as many goals as guys like David Villa and Robbie Keane last year. He's learning the concacaf game, but he'd be in any squad in concacaf and Cavallini is one of the top scorers in uruguay which is a stronger league than any in central america imo. There are not many other forwards in concacaf who scored goals at similar clips in quality leagues last year.
I'm pretty excited about the front 6 for Canada for the first time a long while. Wish there was a little more depth and a decent RB though.
Panama was pretty bad before this recent golden generation lifted them up over the last 10 years or so. Baseball was the more popular sport and they have not had a strong league historically. Now many of the main guys from that 2000s team are aging or retired, and it will be interesting to see if they fall off as they are mostly rocking a domestic league team. I know they have a much improved league but curious to see if their new blood will be on the same level.
Also... I think the Usa's pool is definately not stronger than ours, that's a terrible group. Trinis basically got handed a spot in the hex, maybe jack warner still has some influence after all!
Since I know people want to watch this (shut up, you do), we'll have a watch party going at Barcelona Tavern. Facebook event is here, if you're supporting Canada, you're welcome to join:
Dammit! Flames conflict. I haven't been able to find a time for this yet, do you know?
It looks like 8:15pm MT kickoff. Flames game starts at 8. I think I'll be PVR-ing one of these and watching immediately after the other. I'd like to watch both in full.
Also, today Simeon Jackson signed with Blackburn for the remainder of the season. I have always had a soft spot for Simeon as I'm a Norwich and Canada supporter, and I hope that he does well there.
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Yup, the Jackson signing was a pleasant surprise, especially considering his poor form in League One the last 2 seasons. The Paul Lambert connection helping out there.
Also, there's some chatter that Karl Ouimette may have been traded to the Whitecaps based on a Craigslist ad and some rumours that the Caps have traded for a RB. What a world we live in!
I dunno, the roster for this camp is much, much better than it was in 2013. And that's without the majority of the European based players.
I would have also liked to see Caniggia Elva, but since the 3 Liga's season starts back up tomorrow, no dice. Also, there's confusion over whether he is actually eligible for Canada or not at the moment. Another player I would like by the end of 2016 is Dario Zanatta, an 18 year old forward for Hearts. Apparently he is impressing over there.
With the 3 GKs called I have no idea who will get the start. I'm going to guess Crepeau since he's the most experienced with the national team of the 3.
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So Jonathan Osorio officially had relations with Floro's wife. If he can't get called up when all the Euros are unavailable... yikes! Great to see Henry back in the fold.
Floro seems to have no use for an AMC, as his system is designed on DMCs (DeGuzman) and at the very least, two way, box to box CMs (Will Johnson, Atiba Hutchinson) The wingers are encouraged to get forward and be the offence, along with the CF. Floro won't budge from tactics, and he probably (rightly) feels Osorio has 0 defence in his game, and he's not going to stick him on the wing like at TFC, because he's too slow. Floro demands defensive shape. No CM is exempt from that.
Based on skill, should Osorio be involved in the program? Absolutely. But Floro's system has no place for a slower, AMC who plays no defence.
Kevin Aleman deserves to be involved in the program too, but doesn't fit Floro's tactics either.
Last edited by Johnny199r; 01-25-2016 at 03:14 PM.
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Floro seems to have no use for an AMC, as his system is designed on DMCs (DeGuzman) and at the very least, two way, box to box CMs (Will Johnson, Atiba Hutchinson) The wingers are encouraged to get forward and be the offence, along with the CF. Floro won't budge from tactics, and he probably (rightly) feels Osorio has 0 defence in his game, and he's not going to stick him on the wing like at TFC, because he's too slow. Floro demands defensive shape. No CM is exempt from that.
Based on skill, should Osorio be involved in the program? Absolutely. But Floro's system has no place for a slower, AMC who plays no defence.
Kevin Aleman deserves to be involved in the program too, but doesn't fit Floro's tactics either.
Not saying this is the case here, because I'm nowhere near an expert, but I hate when coaches are married to a formation at all costs. If the 4-5-1 is what is best for Canada and the available players, great.
If Floro loves a 4-5-1 so we end up with a bunch of guys playing out of position or being completely left out of our national program for less talented individuals, that sucks.
Not saying this is the case here, because I'm nowhere near an expert, but I hate when coaches are married to a formation at all costs. If the 4-5-1 is what is best for Canada and the available players, great.
If Floro loves a 4-5-1 so we end up with a bunch of guys playing out of position or being completely left out of our national program for less talented individuals, that sucks.
Floro is the definition of married to the formation.
This summer at the gold cup, when we needed a goal, he subbed on CB Andre Hainault at CM.
Time will tell if he is right. He will be judged primarily on whether we advance to the hex or not. We beat Honuras and Cyle Larin blew some good chances in El Salvador, so he's put them in a good position to win.
IMO we have no choice but to play this way vs Mexico who could whoop us 5-0 in an open game. I think Canada would be wise to stick with this formation in Honduras, no doubt when it's +40 during their game in the middle of the day.
Last edited by Johnny199r; 01-26-2016 at 06:33 PM.
This summer at the gold cup, when we needed a goal, he subbed on CB Andre Hainault at CM.
I was watching and swearing at the TV myself.
I agree with you, if this is all preparation to get a point or 2 off Mexico and it pays off, then great.
I do worry that we spend so much time training for our defensive shell that we miss out on opportunities (I felt El Salvador was a should, nearing a must win game for this stage given the mess their team was in and the lack of crowd).
I agree with you, if this is all preparation to get a point or 2 off Mexico and it pays off, then great.
I do worry that we spend so much time training for our defensive shell that we miss out on opportunities (I felt El Salvador was a should, nearing a must win game for this stage given the mess their team was in and the lack of crowd).
I really hated Floro at the gold cup, but I've come around to him. The players had chances to win in El Salvador (Cyle Larin) and they blew it. During the gold cup, there was no reason not to progress from the group stage. Cyle Larin missed an open net against El Salvador and the team missed a ton of chances against Costa Rica.
If you play a more offensive system, who plays? Cyle Larin was our only decent forward on the roster vs Honduras and El Salvador with Lucas Cavallini out injured. I don't see what Floro can do about that. Tesho Akindele is the only decent winger/goal scoring threat we have in the bench.
I think he's playing to our strengths. Make it tough for the opposition to score and hope to nick a goal. Luckily Junior Hoilett and (hopefully) Scott Arfield now gives us a spark.
If we had more depth and talent, I'd be mad, but we don't.
And I agree, we blew it in El Salvador. We win that game and we advance. Now I have big doubts.
Last edited by Johnny199r; 01-26-2016 at 08:04 PM.
Some more recently added vintage footage. 1982 WCQ.
Steve Armitage and Leggat on the call, from Toronto. I played on that sort of turf early in the career...but imagine WCQ's on the concrete turf? The bounce of the ball, the slipping as you can see in the video happened regularly. Certianly was an advantage to Canada, with NASL players.
Vancouver as a venue was no better, played at Empire Stadium, also on turf. Its early in that video.
Here's the return leg a couple months later. Good footage from the Azteca. Somehow Canada blew qualification after being in the driver seat, and Honduras went through, but the Canadian goal in a draw in Mexico by Gray is here. It's on a 1986 video from earlier in the thread, but this is from the other angle. The guy running over the ball just touches it back (easier seen in other video), as it was an indirect kick, and an mint chip into the top corner...clearly the Canadians saw the goalie coming off the line on free kicks earlier in the game or other games, and just a brilliantly executed goal...look for giving the fans the one arm salute by one of the Canadians too.
Last edited by browna; 02-13-2016 at 12:38 PM.
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