Russia invades Ukraine

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by sharkov

It would be rich for Ukraine to call Russia a terrorist state while committing terrorist attacks of its own

There should be a caveat when it comes to taking out people who publicly promote Nazi ideology. One more Nazi off Earth is a gift for everyone.

[sharkov]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

There should be a caveat when it comes to taking out people who publicly promote Nazi ideology. One more Nazi off Earth is a gift for everyone.

So we should endorse acts of terrorism against everyone who holds views that you may find disgusting? My biggest problem is that the western world has spent the last 20 years figthing people who have the same thinking that its ok to attack civilians targets only to endorse governments who have the same mentality

[burn_this_city]

Not sure anyone should instantly conclude it was the Ukrainians in a country that suicides influential people all the time.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by sharkov

So we should endorse acts of terrorism against everyone who holds views that you may find disgusting? My biggest problem is that the western world has spent the last 20 years figthing people who have the same thinking that its ok to attack civilians targets only to endorse governments who have the same mentality

It's not that I may find the view disgusting, as if it is just my opinion. She said that Ukrainians are not humans to justify genocide. Her father wrote a Nazi inspired manifesto and she promoted it. These are views that any rational person should find objectively disgusting. Erasing the existence of these people should be celebrated. It's only terrorism if you sympathize with those views. It's justice for anyone else.

As a side note, I agree with the above that it probably wasn't even a Ukrainian endeavor that caused this. Whoever did it, did the world a favour though.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by sharkov

Going after military targets I understand but attacking civilians like Dugin would be a terrorist action

Killing civilians is fine under the Geneva Convention, you just have to have done it 'by accident' when you thought you were blowing up something else, we have killed millions of civilians in the last 60 years, her father is enough of a part of the Duma and Kremlin to be a legitimate military target, she got killed by a bomb meant for him then its all good

[sharkov]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Killing civilians is fine under the Geneva Convention, you just have to have done it 'by accident' when you thought you were blowing up something else, we have killed millions of civilians in the last 60 years, her father is enough of a part of the Duma and Kremlin to be a legitimate military target, she got killed by a bomb meant for him then its all good

Bin laden dehad a similar train of thought when he targeted the world trade centres and pentagons in response to U.S. sanctions on Iraq that killed thousands of iraqis

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by sharkov

It would be rich for Ukraine to call Russia a terrorist state while committing terrorist attacks of its own

if the USA invaded Canada unprovoked, pick a reason (lets go with water in 30 years) and I was alive, and, during this invasion the American press called Canada a non country, and we all were criminals and rednecks, and, American troops were raping our women to death in front of our kids? I couldn't wait to commit "terrorism" to drive the Americans out. At that point you're fighting for your existence and not to be ethnically cleansed. How can we call this terrorism?

[sharkov]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

if the USA invaded Canada unprovoked, pick a reason (lets go with water in 30 years) and I was alive, and, during this invasion the American press called Canada a non country, and we all were criminals and rednecks, and, American troops were raping our women to death in front of our kids? I couldn't wait to commit "terrorism" to drive the Americans out. At that point you're fighting for your existence and not to be ethnically cleansed. How can we call this terrorism?

All acts of terrorism should be condemned. Can’t just pick and choose when to endorse and when to condemn even if it’s against enemies

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

if the USA invaded Canada unprovoked, pick a reason (lets go with water in 30 years) and I was alive, and, during this invasion the American press called Canada a non country, and we all were criminals and rednecks, and, American troops were raping our women to death in front of our kids? I couldn't wait to commit "terrorism" to drive the Americans out. At that point you're fighting for your existence and not to be ethnically cleansed. How can we call this terrorism?

I agree with the example, but just have to say that Americans would never do that to Canada. I've been as critical of American foreign policy as anyone, but I couldn't fathom a future where a scenario like that would play out.

I appreciate that this was just a creative way to illustrate a point though.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by sharkov

All acts of terrorism should be condemned. Can’t just pick and choose when to endorse and when to condemn even if it’s against enemies

So are you saying that you condemn any acts of "terrorism" that Jews committed against Nazis to try and save themselves?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by sharkov

Bin laden dehad a similar train of thought when he targeted the world trade centres and pentagons in response to U.S. sanctions on Iraq that killed thousands of iraqis

I never really had a problem with 9/11 really, the idea that its fine for countries to kill and bomb but the moment anyone else does it its terrorism always struck me as asinine

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

I never really had a problem with 9/11 really, the idea that its fine for countries to kill and bomb but the moment anyone else does it its terrorism always struck me as asinine

Are you missing green text?

#### its 3am? Jesus I need to go to bed,

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Are you missing green text?

#### its 3am? Jesus I need to go to bed,

I aint saying I thought it was a good thing, I just saw it like the blitz in the war, the idea that there are these rules that make it fine for the US to bomb the tar out of Baghdad or Hanoi but if someone bombs them its some how morally worse always struck me as absurd, we in the west have spent over a century treating the 3rd world in general as our economic plaything, we stole their resources and inflicted brutal CIA backed dictatorships on them, I dont think you can get all pissed off when they hit back once in a while

Again I am not saying I was happy or applauded the attack I just never understood the outrage, I always understood why the IRA bombed London, I got knocked on my arse and covered with glass when a car bomb went off in Earls Ct, I was evacuated from stores with bombs in and lost a mate in N Ireland from a bomb, it was a war, the IRA were fighting for what they believed in

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Mull

That might not even be a Putin purge, just one well connected family member of a lost loved one. Putin would probably just charge the dude and have a fake trail

It is believed that they targeted her father. Allegedly he was supposed to be in that car, but "changed his mind in the last moment". Russian media sells it as Ukrainian/Western attack. The purpose is a little unclear though. Her father was more of a man who was writing what Putin wanted to read rather than influencing Putin with his philosophy. His "thinking" was focused on how to stay relevant and popular rather than how to make this world better. An avid promoter of Russian values, greatness and exceptionalism he apparently had no problem driving around in Toyota, rather than some Russian car. His first wife is actually a Russian LGBT activist. Daria was a daughter of his second wife. The very picture of the man screams fraud and populism rather than some deep thinking mind

https://img.gazeta.ru/files3/704/153...x600-84707.jpg

How to judge this largely depends on whether you hold it against progressive western standards or against what Russians are doing in Ukraine. It is, at very best, a murder without trial, and there's no way she would be sentenced to death for whatever views she had in any kind of trial. Yet, what Russians are doing in Ukraine is way worse.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

So are you saying that you condemn any acts of "terrorism" that Jews committed against Nazis to try and save themselves?

Being half-jewish I can tell that acts of terrorism are acts of terrorism no matter who commit these and why. Whether to condemn these is a different question altogether. I for one do not condemn anti-Nazi Jewish terrorism at all, because it's Them vs Us, Black vs White to me. Yet it's still terrorism, in that it's an act of killing innocent (i.e. not guilty enough to be shot) person for the sake of terrifying people.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It's not that I may find the view disgusting, as if it is just my opinion. She said that Ukrainians are not humans to justify genocide. Her father wrote a Nazi inspired manifesto and she promoted it. These are views that any rational person should find objectively disgusting. Erasing the existence of these people should be celebrated. It's only terrorism if you sympathize with those views. It's justice for anyone else.

As a side note, I agree with the above that it probably wasn't even a Ukrainian endeavor that caused this. Whoever did it, did the world a favour though.

If you trial her, what sentence would you give her?

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

There should be a caveat when it comes to taking out people who publicly promote Nazi ideology. One more Nazi off Earth is a gift for everyone.

His views, which I completely disregard as populistic and hollow, are way closer to "American exceptionalism" ideology than to Nazi ideology.

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Here she is spouting off on Ukraine, just like the tweet title says. Don't believe what is posted online that it was an innocent victim who died. Rather she was radical just like her father. She was on the list of sanctioned individuals.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1561131023168987136

BTW her father is the author of The Foundation of Geopolitics. You reap what you sow.

She was on sanctions list because her newspaper suggested that Ukraine would perish if it joins NATO. Which is far cry from calling Ukranians subhumans or calling for genocide. She sure did support a horrible war, but so did many Americans 20 years ago. The only way to justify it that I can think of is that this killing will somehow help defeat Russian invasion and thus save lives and generally make this world a better place. Then you could make an argument that ends justify means. Otherwise there's nothing she did to deserve death.

https://www.opensanctions.org/entiti...Gs73hALhtnefM/

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

if the USA invaded Canada unprovoked, pick a reason (lets go with water in 30 years) and I was alive, and, during this invasion the American press called Canada a non country, and we all were criminals and rednecks, and, American troops were raping our women to death in front of our kids? I couldn't wait to commit "terrorism" to drive the Americans out. At that point you're fighting for your existence and not to be ethnically cleansed. How can we call this terrorism?

Even Ukrainians themselves said that they have nothing to do with it as they are not a terrorist state. Thus implying that the explosion actually was a terrorist attack. Again, to condemn it or not is a different debate altogether within a context of invasion and horrible crimes of Russians. But it was an act of terrorism, no doubt about it.



A senior Ukrainian official denied responsibility for the attack.

“Ukraine certainly had nothing to do with yesterday’s explosion,” Mykhailo Podolyak, an adviser to Ukraine’s president, said in televised comments on Sunday morning. “We are not a criminal state like the Russian Federation, much less a terrorist one.”

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2022/08...key-putin-ally

[Mull]

I can’t believe anyone rational jumps to the Ukraine making this killing

I mean is it feasible? Oh for sure

Is it the obvious answer or likely? Not to me.