[News] LeBrun/Dreger - Flames open for Business

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Sec214

Close? Not that close … just lots of teams are interested in the flames group. We have players who are pending UFAs, we have salary retention spots, we have a few players on good deals with term.

I got some organization information but I’ve been told to zip it. Sorry brothers and sisters.

Without a giff this will be hard to solve. I’ll go with new design of jerseys and they are the most butt ugly design you have ever seen

[just_tim]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

For example, he did everything humanly possible to keep the Flames in the NSH game yesterday, but he still got scored on 4 times.

This. When a goalie lets in 4 and his save percentage for the night is .911 it’s not on the goalie.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

This season Markstrom gives the Flames a chance to win every night. He did the same 2 years ago.

Well, he did until the oilers playoff series. Then he gave them absolutely no chance to win. He was somehow the worst goalie in a series that also featured Kostinen and an 80 year old Mike Smith.

[CliffFletcher]

The Athletic recently ranked the Flames goaltending duo 17th in the NHL. They remarked that’s probably high, but they were giving the Markstrom the benefit of the doubt that he could return to his form of a couple seasons ago.

https://theathletic.com/5042528/2023...ower-rankings/

Markstrom is not a bad goalie, but he’s not great either. He’s average. And you can bet NHL GMs aren’t going to forget about his total collapse the last time he was in the playoffs.

An average, 33 year old goalie with two more seasons left at $6 mil just doesn’t have a lot of value on the trade market. And goalies are rarely moved mid-season because the team on the other end has to a move a goalie themselves to make it work.

[HighLifeMan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

You wouldn't spend $6M in cap-space over the next two seasons for Turcotte? That's crazy to me. I'd do that every day. Copley is just to give Calgary a meh goalie for the remainder of this season so Vladar could run with it. Turcotte for $6M is like buying a 1st round pick, but a few years down the path in development. With him being healthy now? I think he's a great target.

I doubt any organization in the league values Turcotte as anywhere near a 1st rounder. He's soon to be 23 years old with an extensive injury history and middling production as a pro. At some point pedigree stops playing a factor, and I'd suggest that ship has long since sailed. For some perspective, a guy like Rory Kerins is a year younger than Turcotte and has 8 points in 10 AHL games, yet I would wager he'd have virtually zero trade value league wide.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

I doubt any organization in the league values Turcotte as anywhere near a 1st rounder. He's soon to be 23 years old with an extensive injury history and middling production as a pro. At some point pedigree stops playing a factor, and I'd suggest that ship has long since sailed. For some perspective, a guy like Rory Kerins is a year younger than Turcotte and has 8 points in 10 AHL games, yet I would wager he'd have virtually zero trade value league wide.

Zary is 22, and has 100 points in 140 AHL games.

Turcotte is 7 months older, and has 71 points in 106 AHL games.

I think you're judging Turcotte too harshly. If the injuries are behind him, and taken care of - then I think there's reason to go after him, especially if this a "get younger on the go" re-tool rather than a rebuild. Turcotte has the upside.

[Knut]

Turcotte's dad is a giant nose picker. PASS!

[ForeverFlameFan]

Turcotte is not a bad pickup, as long as you’re not thinking of him as a future first line center. Those days are gone. IIRC he was compared to Bergeron in his draft year. Or maybe that was Hayton.

Anyway, I think he could still carve out a ceiling of Danault/Backlund career, with a Bonino-like floor.

He’s not a bad pick up when we will need centers of all kind (roster/AHL/junior) when Lindholm is gone.

[HighLifeMan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Zary is 22, and has 100 points in 140 AHL games.

Turcotte is 7 months older, and has 71 points in 106 AHL games.

I think you're judging Turcotte too harshly. If the injuries are behind him, and taken care of - then I think there's reason to go after him, especially if this a "get younger on the go" re-tool rather than a rebuild. Turcotte has the upside.

I don't think our evaluation of the players ability differs all that much, just his current value. I certainly wouldn't mind taking a chance on this kid either, but he simply has too many question marks surrounding him at this time to hold the value you are suggesting.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Mitch

Imo people are going to be disappointed in what the return on some of our players will be based on some of trade proposals in here. Hope I'm wrong

There are always people around here who are disappointed by everything. This is not news.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Sec214

Close? Not that close … just lots of teams are interested in the flames group. We have players who are pending UFAs, we have salary retention spots, we have a few players on good deals with term.

I got some organization information but I’ve been told to zip it. Sorry brothers and sisters.

What does "organization information" mean?

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I would argue Markstrom is overrated by Flames fans. He's a career .909 goaltender which teters on good backup/mediocre starter...

Wrong. Among goalies with a minimum of 8 starts this season that ranks Markstrom 10th in SP.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Wrong. Among goalies with a minimum of 8 starts this season that ranks Markstrom 10th in SP.

He said that Cam Talbot has had a more steady and consistent career.
Is he wrong?

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Zary is 22, and has 100 points in 140 AHL games.

Turcotte is 7 months older, and has 71 points in 106 AHL games.

I think you're judging Turcotte too harshly. If the injuries are behind him, and taken care of - then I think there's reason to go after him, especially if this a "get younger on the go" re-tool rather than a rebuild. Turcotte has the upside.

Before this season, Zary was not considered an elite prospect. A good one yes, but not elite.

Turcotte is not likely to have the current Zary success, but of course, neither was Zary.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Before this season, Zary was not considered an elite prospect. A good one yes, but not elite.

Turcotte is not likely to have the current Zary success, but of course, neither was Zary.

We're not going to get an elite prospect for Markstrom though.

Turcotte could be something. There's upside there where he could become something more (if the injury issues are behind him). Turcotte is a big swing. You have to take some big swings if you want to find great players in situations where you normally don't get them (like trading a goalie).

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

We're not going to get an elite prospect for Markstrom though.

Turcotte could be something. There's upside there where he could become something more (if the injury issues are behind him). Turcotte is a big swing. You have to take some big swings if you want to find great players in situations where you normally don't get them (like trading a goalie).

If Marky is at half cap?

Although I doubt the Kings are that interested in Marky.

[timun]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Now do every other starter on in the league over three years and it is going to look similar. I think people overestimate how good goaltending is on other teams


Look at Binnington who was brought up as a comparable:
.901
.894
.912

As I'm the one who brought up Binnington, I think I need to clarify. I posited a scenario that Markstrom be traded to St. Louis for Binnington because both Markstrom and Binnington had bad years last year, are having better years this year, and make the exact same amount of money (AAV).

My overarching point was that if one would not trade Markstrom straight up for Binnington, one-for-one, then one has to concede no other team would acquire Markstrom without salary retention. Binnington is four years younger and, although he had a bad year last year, he was better than Markstrom, and is better than Markstrom this year too. If any Flames fan wouldn't immediately agree to a Markstrom-for-Binnington trade, they're dreaming if they thing the Flames wouldn't have to retain some of Markstrom's salary to trade him elsewhere.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Counterpoint: imagine you trade with your arch rivals, and it propels you to winning the cup

LOL - not this year it won't.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by just_tim

This. When a goalie lets in 4 and his save percentage for the night is .911 it’s not on the goalie.

and one shouldn't have counted

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

You wouldn't spend $6M in cap-space over the next two seasons for Turcotte? That's crazy to me. I'd do that every day. Copley is just to give Calgary a meh goalie for the remainder of this season so Vladar could run with it. Turcotte for $6M is like buying a 1st round pick, but a few years down the path in development. With him being healthy now? I think he's a great target.

I'm not sure I would. I can't recall a top 5 pick that showed as little as he has post draft that ended up being an impact player.

I would take him as a buy low candidate, but not as the centrepiece in a deal for Markstrom with $3M retained. Think I'd rather just have the 1st.