[Rumour] Giordano Extension. Kypreos: Starting point is $72 million over 8 years

[Dr. Doom]

Exactly Hesla.

7m for 4 or 5 years is the number everyone seems is fair... except apparently the Gio camp.

If in fact they are digging heels in at more term and 1-2 more mil I can't see us doing it,

And unfortunately that's where things can get ugly and we have to bring up things like age, consistent output, other comparable contracts, etc.

Queue noses out of joint which may or may not have already happened we are really in the dark guessing.

I do know this - if indeed the subject of this thread is correct, that to me would be a threatening starting point. How does our management try to haggle down from that?

Either silence. Press ignore button and hope they are bluff.

Or start pulling out the arguments for why he's not worth that.

Both not good IMO...

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I think shot across the bow is the wrong terminology, but it certainly removes a TON of leverage from the Giordano camp.

Calgary went out and grabbed a young top pairing defender. Now that they have Brodie AND Hamilton, their need for top pairing defenders is significantly reduced.

Calgary has also set the rate for their top pairing players: Under 6 million for both Hamilton and Brodie, inspite of their term.

If Giordano is looking for 25% more cash, well, he'd better be 25% better of a player.

Make no mistake about it, Calgary acquired Hamilton because guys like that just aren't available very often, but they also acquired him they are less dependent on Giordano now and in the future.

Oh I totally get that for sure, it was a huge signing in regards to our options with Gio. I was just pointing out, like you said, it's not a shot across the bow, because the phrase 'shot across the bow' is what it is.

Dougie Hamilton is a nice back up piece for a possible Giordano departure, but I look at this way; If Gio had already been locked up to a reasonable contract before July 1st, Treliving would have still gone hard after Hamilton and got him. So in that respect I don't see any ties to us getting Hamilton and it being leverage or being a replacement for Gio.

It was simply a case of a franchise D-man coming available and the Flames taking advantage.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Oh I totally get that for sure, it was a huge signing in regards to our options with Gio. I was just pointing out, like you said, it's not a shot across the bow, because the phrase 'shot across the bow' is what it is.

Dougie Hamilton is a nice back up piece for a possible Giordano departure, but I look at this way; If Gio had already been locked up to a reasonable contract before July 1st, Treliving would have still gone hard after Hamilton and got him. So in that respect I don't see any ties to us getting Hamilton and it being leverage or being a replacement for Gio.

It was simply a case of a franchise D-man coming available and the Flames taking advantage.

If you play out that hypothetical situation though, it doesn't look for keeping Gio either.

You have brodie signed at what, 4.5? Giordano at 7.5.

You trade a 1st and 2 x 2nds for Hamilton and sign him to 5.75.

Looking at that roster, who is the odd man out?

For me, it's the 32/33 year old guy making almost 2 million dollars more than guys a decade younger playing the same role.

Short of an outrageously-low-for-the-expectations-contract, the more I think about it, the more I have trouble figuring how or where Giordano fits that doesn't see him leave the club like Patrick Sharp just did, with a top prospect tied around his waist.

I don't want to see that.

[Hugh Jahrmes]

Has anyone ever calculated what some of the top agents make? Must be insane given the contracts thrown around and you always hear of a few guys representing a handful of high profile stars


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Murph]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

If you play out that hypothetical situation though, it doesn't look for keeping Gio either.

You have brodie signed at what, 4.5? Giordano at 7.5.

You trade a 1st and 2 x 2nds for Hamilton and sign him to 5.75.

Looking at that roster, who is the odd man out?

For me, it's the 32/33 year old guy making almost 2 million dollars more than guys a decade younger playing the same role.

Short of an outrageously-low-for-the-expectations-contract, the more I think about it, the more I have trouble figuring how or where Giordano fits that doesn't see him leave the club like Patrick Sharp just did, with a top prospect tied around his waist.

I don't want to see that.

Playing the same role, except for the fact that one of those guys is the captain, and by all accounts is one of best in the game.

[Yoho]

I'm hoping Gio sees beyond the $, the chance to be the captain of this up and coming team and franchise figure head should be just as tempting for still amazing money (7mil 4-5yrs). Hopefully this years free agency and the few "crazy" deals is sobering for not just Glencross.

At any rate I'm glad BT is in charge if this comes down to a staring contest. Previous poster is right, tie goes to the 20 something top line pairing if the conversation switches to "who we keep?"

[heep223]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Exactly Hesla.

7m for 4 or 5 years is the number everyone seems is fair... except apparently the Gio camp.

If we're approaching September with nothing done, I'll start getting worried. Right now I don't think we should be wringing our hands over a Kypreos tweet, much less claiming to know what the Gio camp wants or doesn't want.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Murph

Playing the same role, except for the fact that one of those guys is the captain, and by all accounts is one of best in the game.

Oh Christ almighty!

Calgary has had 'one of the best in the game' in the captain position for over a decade.

At this point I'd be ok with going with one of the lesser captains in the game if it means more WINS.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Murph

Playing the same role, except for the fact that one of those guys is the captain, and by all accounts is one of best in the game.

True but you have to weigh the pros and cons. If Gio's long term cap hit becomes a boat anchor in 3 years and prevents us from signing young stars then the downside starts to outweigh the benefit. Anywhere even remotely close to 9M x 8yrs would cripple this franchise unless Gio suddenly morphs into Chelios in his late 30's. 3-5 year term or trade him for a huge return.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Yoho

I'm hoping Gio sees beyond the $, the chance to be the captain of this up and coming team and franchise figure head should be just as tempting for still amazing money (7mil 4-5yrs). Hopefully this years free agency and the few "crazy" deals is sobering for not just Glencross.

At any rate I'm glad BT is in charge if this comes down to a staring contest. Previous poster is right, tie goes to the 20 something top line pairing if the conversation switches to "who we keep?"

This.

There are quite a few things that have transpired this past season to greatly weaken Gio's bargaining position. First off are the injuries; he's been out for a quarter of the season 3 of the last 4 seasons. Second, the team did splendidly without him in the stretch drive, making it into the playoffs and getting past a round. Third is the acquisition of Hamilton.

Make no mistake...while Gio happily welcomed Hamilton to Calgary, his agent on the other hand was probably cursing a bunch in his office. Getting a top pairing defenceman (!!) will significantly reduce Gio's "need" in Calgary - this along with the injury bug dogging him and the team's reasonably excellent performance without him will have Ritch Winter's hands tied right off the bat.

Now with these circumstances already favoring the Flames organization, you still have Brad Treliving to deal with. And from what he's demonstrated so far, he has nerves of steel and a razor sharp mind. Brad will not be the one to back down first, even if Ritch Winter talks hardball.

[nik-]

I mean straight up, if these numbers are even near what he needs to sign, unfortunately he can't be in the plan. As has been stated over and over in this thread, we're going to potentially have three star forwards to build this team around and we just can't afford that kind on contract for someone on the back end of his career. We'd get three more years of prime and then 3+ of downslope at a huge hit

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

Brad will not be the one to back down first, even if Ritch Winter talks hardball.

I think so as well. Gio says he wants to be signed before training camp. It doesn't benefit him to see what happens this season. His value/asking price can't get any higher than it actually is. When he starts playing hockey again, he could start scoring less, we could start winning less, or he could get hurt again.

[shotinthebacklund]

Why does everyone continue to assume he is on a decline in say 3 yrs? it is possible he continues to perform at a very strong level well into his age.

as far as gio goes there is definitely guys with much more grueling minutes and years attached to their names then gio. I am nor worried at all about the direction of this team and will not fret the signing with whatever it may be.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by saillias

I think so as well. Gio says he wants to be signed before training camp. It doesn't benefit him to see what happens this season. His value/asking price can't get any higher than it actually is. When he starts playing hockey again, he could start scoring less, we could start winning less, or he could get hurt again.

And even if he doesn't he's probably getting paid double or close too so that definitely brings his value down.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

Why does everyone continue to assume he is on a decline in say 3 yrs? it is possible he continues to perform at a very strong level well into his age.

Because he will be 33 when his extension kicks in and most player see a decline in their play in their mid-late 30's. Gio might be an exception but that isn't probable and his injury history isn't great.

[Mr.Coffee]

The risk with Giordano is injury.

The more I think about it, the more it might make more sense to do something ridiculous like 10-11MM over 1 or 2 seasons. It pays him over and above, but eliminates a bit of that injury risk. If he continues to perform, after those seasons, he can sign another big deal and likely will have made more money in the long run.

But if I'm Giordano, I'm sticking to asking for 8-9MM / season, as that is honestly what I think his market value is if you look at Subban or Weber or others, and yes, Giordano is in that ballpark.

Some of you are hoping 7MM for a Norris caliber defencemen? A bit delusional if you ask me, this guy is always so underrated, and his intangibles are what turned this team around when it needed it the most. Some of you say 'well we made playoffs without him'... more like he turned the culture and team around for 60+% of the season, which brought a lot of intangible characteristics that teammates bought into, not to mention if he wasn't around for those games we definitely would NOT have made playoffs, not to mention if he WAS around for the playoffs- we probably could have taken Anaheim or at least made a contest out of it.

We need Giordano to be a legitimate cup contender.

[Dr. Doom]

Norris caliber
Not Norris winner

And you yourself mentioned his age

I love him but he's a 7 million guy right now

The two million differential is because of:

Hasn't won the Norris
And his age

It sucks for him but it's true

[blender]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

If you play out that hypothetical situation though, it doesn't look for keeping Gio either.

You have brodie signed at what, 4.5? Giordano at 7.5.

You trade a 1st and 2 x 2nds for Hamilton and sign him to 5.75.

Looking at that roster, who is the odd man out?

For me, it's the 32/33 year old guy making almost 2 million dollars more than guys a decade younger playing the same role.

Short of an outrageously-low-for-the-expectations-contract, the more I think about it, the more I have trouble figuring how or where Giordano fits that doesn't see him leave the club like Patrick Sharp just did, with a top prospect tied around his waist.

I don't want to see that.

Won't need to sweeten the deal to take Gio. He will be bringing a top prospect or high pick(s) back in any deal. Flames have all the leverage IMO.

[Mr.Coffee]

If Giordano plays like he did last season and is healthy, he wins the Norris.

If Giordano goes to free agency, he's signing for 9-10MM / season. No question. Also he's 31, not 65.

[Yoho]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

If Giordano plays like he did last season and is healthy, he wins the Norris.

If Giordano goes to free agency, he's signing for 9-10MM / season. No question. Also he's 33, not 65.

Then let some other team pay it if it includes term.

Ask Vancouver if they are glad they didn't sign Biesksa long term, or Boston fans if they wish they didn't sign Chara till he's 41.

This is a very unusual situation and there is no absolutes.