[GT] US election - It's 2020, what could possibly go wrong?

[Tron_fdc]

So how much longer until he goes full nutbar and tries to use the military?

[MoneyGuy]

I’d expect the military would tell him to pound sand.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

I’d expect the military would tell him to pound sand.

[hummdeedoo]

Originally Posted by Poster

From the article

After the meeting, Trump called one of the two GOP members, Monica Palmer. Palmer said that Trump did not pressure her to change her vote.
“His concern was about my safety, and that was really touching. He is a really busy guy, and to have his concern about my safety was appreciated,” she told The Post.
“It was not pressure. It was genuine concern for my safety,” Palmer said.


What’s scarier, the President using mafia intimidation tactics or that she is willfully oblivious to it?

Sounds like he used the power of the Force. Which we know only works on the weak minded.

...He is a really busy guy, and to have his concern about my safety was appreciated...

LOL!
He doesn't give a s@%t about her safety - there are no feelings of empathy whatsoever in that bloated orange carcass.

[troutman]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1329521812951142400

[JohnnyB]

A couple of concerning points to note. People don't generally have specific targets to fight against when democracy breaks down, so taking to the streets is the means of showing discontent. Trump may not have military support, but he has a lot of support from police across the country and has already been doing the groundwork to label protesters as anarchists and justify violent police crackdowns.

Do people who support Biden end up at war with the police in their cities? What about the national guard and DHS?

What do local government administrators end up in this? Which pressures are they most influenced by?

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

So how much longer until he goes full nutbar and tries to use the military?

Depends how you interpret this.

https://heathercoxrichardson.substac...vember-18-2020

Acting Defense Secretary Chris Miller announced today that the civilian leaders from Special Operations Command will report directly to him, rather than through the normal chain of command. Special Operations includes about 70,000 troops that undertake unconventional military operations like raids, reconnaissance, search and rescue, and psychological operations. This was a change permitted by a 2017 law, and puts Special Operations at the same level as the other military departments. Lawmakers from both sides of the aisle say this elevation of Special Operations is overdue.

But the timing of this move raises questions, since the officials now overseeing Special Operations are the ones installed since Trump’s purge, none of whom has been approved by the Senate. The acting assistant secretary of defense for special operations—the one who will now report directly to newly-installed acting Defense Secretary Miller-- is Ezra Cohen-Watnick, originally elevated to a prominent position by Flynn. Cohen-Watnick is an obscure figure who was not removed from his job at the National Security Council when Flynn resigned, apparently because he was personally protected by Jared Kushner. This was unusual: he was very young and inexperienced. He is fiercely loyal to Trump.

Like the other new hires at the Defense Department, Cohen-Watnick is known to be eager to hit at Iran, with whom simmering conflict continues. A week ago, inspectors reported that Iran has many times the uranium stockpile it would have been permitted under the Iran deal Trump pulled the U.S. out of, and that it would take less than a year for Iran to develop a nuclear weapon (something its leaders deny they have any interest in doing). The following day, Trump asked his top aides if he could launch a military strike against Iran’s biggest nuclear facility. They talked him out of it, noting that such a strike could lead to a larger war.

Today, Trump imposed sweeping new sanctions on Iran. Henry Rome, an Iran analyst with Eurasia Group, consultants who analyze political risk, told Reuters: “The administration is clearly, and I think transparently, trying to raise the political cost for Biden to re-engage with Iran and lift the nuclear deal sanctions.”

[Fuzz]

Oh look, the ol' "Iran is a year away from a nuclear weapon" story. When have I heard that before?

[greyshep]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

A couple of concerning points to note. People don't generally have specific targets to fight against when democracy breaks down, so taking to the streets is the means of showing discontent. Trump may not have military support, but he has a lot of support from police across the country and has already been doing the groundwork to label protesters as anarchists and justify violent police crackdowns.

Do people who support Biden end up at war with the police in their cities? What about the national guard and DHS?

What do local government administrators end up in this? Which pressures are they most influenced by?

I think the specific target in this case is the White House. I'm sure Trump would be hiding in his bunker at that point but it seems like a pretty specific target to me.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by greyshep

I think the specific target in this case is the White House. I'm sure Trump would be hiding in his bunker at that point but it seems like a pretty specific target to me.

Not really a viable target for most people across the country though, especially during a rising pandemic that makes travel dangerous.

If Trump ever succeeds in this, I would not be surprised to see the “Winter White House” end up being the seat of presidential power. Who needs to be close to congress anyways if they don't matter anymore.

Florida is just a natural home for this type of madness anyways.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Oh look, the ol' "Iran is a year away from a nuclear weapon" story. When have I heard that before?

Yeah, I was more curious about the 70 k special ops and how they could be deployed

Is it crazy to ask about an end run around the system to do something in Iran, or even worse, deployed domestically?

[direwolf]

Three more lawsuits thrown out of court today in three different states. There are no more legal paths to victory for the orange s***stain. It's over. His only chance now is to try and bully, intimidate, or bribe the GOP legislatures in the swing states. Hopefully the representatives in these states will do the right thing and tell him to go f*** himself.

I still think his attempted coup will ultimately fail, Trump will leave (or be dragged out by Secret Service), and Biden will be rightfully sworn in as the next Prez. But the fact that we're even talking about the remote possibility of Trump pulling something like this off is incredibly scary. The U.S. needs to seriously look at making some changes to their electoral college system to prevent this kind of insane bulls*** in the future.

And yea, I know the chances of that happening are next to nil. But hey, one can dream.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/19/polit...den/index.html

State judges in Arizona and Pennsylvania and a federal judge in Georgia rejected election-related lawsuits Thursday from Republicans and the Trump campaign.The hat trick of losses were the latest round of defeats for the Trump campaign in its long-shot and increasingly far-fetched bid to block President-elect Joe Biden's win before the Electoral College certifies him as the next president.

One of the judges, a Trump appointee in Georgia, called the attempt by Republican-allied lawyers to block election results "quite striking," refusing their attempt to stop Biden's win there.

In Arizona, a state judge declined to audit votes in the state and delay the finalization of results, saying the lawsuit couldn't be retooled and brought again. And in Pennsylvania, a state judge ordered the counting of more than absentee 2,000 ballots the Trump campaign wanted to exclude.

The rulings came with only a few hours between them on Thursday.

In a brief order, Judge John Hannah dismissed the lawsuit with prejudice and denied the party's request for an injunction to block Maricopa County, home of Phoenix and the most populous county in the state, from certifying its election results.

A state judge in Pennsylvania rejected an attempt by the Trump campaign to throw out more than 2,000 absentee ballots for technical reasons.

The Trump campaign has made several attempts to throw out absentee ballots in Pennsylvania courts, and Judge Robert Baldi of the Bucks County Court of Common Pleas on Thursday ruled that throwing out the absentee ballots would disenfranchise voters.

The case was not among those where the Trump campaign has alleged fraud. Instead, the campaign had argued the state should enforce rules about when absentee ballots should or should not be counted, taking issue with 2,177 ballots in Bucks County that were in an unsealed privacy envelope or lacked handwritten dates, names or addresses on their outer envelopes.

Those ballots will be counted, Baldi ordered.

A federal judge in Georgia rejected an election lawsuit brought by a Republican elector, Lin Wood, who had alleged in court constitutional violations, perceived fraud in the presidential election and sought to block the certification of election results.

"There's no doubt an individual's right to vote is sacrosanct," Judge Steven Grimberg in the Northern District of Georgia said Thursday evening. But, that "does not mean individual voters have the right to dictate" how votes are cast or decided to be counted.
"It's not for the courts to meddle with" processes set by the states, he added.

Wood's attorney indicated earlier on Thursday that he may want to try for a second round before the judge, representing the Trump campaign as it seeks to block a Biden win. But Grimberg's ruling on Thursday, spoken from the bench, shuts down new rounds of lawsuits in multiple ways.

Grimberg decided that the elector in Georgia didn't have the ability to show he could bring a case, didn't have an avenue in court under the law and had sued far too late to affect the election.

"I didn't hear any justification for why the plaintiff delayed bringing this claim until two weeks after this election and on the cusp of these election results being certified," Grimberg, a Trump appointee, said. Absentee ballot counting in Georgia, which Republicans were challenging in the lawsuit, started months ago, he noted.

[JohnnyB]

That was most remarkable press conference I have ever watched on behalf of a ruling Western government. They seriously turned it up to 11 in that one. Wow!

[FurnaceFace]

Georgia recount still with Biden...though Cheeto picked up 1700 more votes which he can claim as proof/victory as he bumbles out in Jan.

[Lumby Lager]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Depends how you interpret this.

https://heathercoxrichardson.substac...vember-18-2020

You asked a few days ago about her. I have been following for over 2 years now, as do quite a few people I know in the newspaper business. She has a distinctive left leaning stance but very knowledgeable and always great reads.

[Dion]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1329597906714849280

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Lumby Lager

You asked a few days ago about her. I have been following for over 2 years now, as do quite a few people I know in the newspaper business. She has a distinctive left leaning stance but very knowledgeable and always great reads.

Yes, I did ask who else here reads her letters, and agree.

Thing I was pointing out today was the change in special ops reporting. I hadn’t seen it reported elsewhere (but haven’t had a ton of time to catch up on the news, outside of a couple of my go to sources)

[burn_this_city]

The Americans are adding roughly the same number of cases to their total every 36 hours, that Canada has had in the entire pandemic. 9 times the population, 6 times the daily case rate per capita right now.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by MBates

Sorry, at risk of a bit of a derail, I have to disagree here.

First, it is superficial to say there is a committee and its got independent people on it so we are in great shape. At the end of the day the appointments are made by cabinet.

The politicization of judicial appointments is a live controversy in Canada:

Liberals under fire for partisan involvement in judicial appointments

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/poli...l-appointment/



I mean a sitting judge just got rebuked for inappropriate involvement in influencing new appointments together with her MP husband:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/cana...t-on-judicial/

Second, your statement that the Provincial Court doesn't make significant decisions is wrong in my view.

The vast majority of criminal prosecutions are run in the Provincial Court. As such, massive amounts of Charter litigation occurs there. In fact, people are often amazed to learn how many of their rights are argued by underfunded lawyers being paid by legal aid making arguments on behalf of alleged and actual criminals.

Of course the trial court is subject to federally appointed appeal courts, yes, but the standard of review is such that if you can win factual arguments in support of your legal argument, the appeal courts may have no choice but to affirm the discretionary decisions of the trial judge.

There is also huge discretion in criminal sentencing which I assure you the public cares about.

As to whether there would be an electoral response to a major slate of apparently partisan UCP judicial appointees? Can we be sure it wouldn't be a majority positive response? Is it inconceivable we may get a chance to see?

Alberta purges judicial vetting committee for former Tory cabinet ministers, political supporters

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmon...ourt-1.5605547



Back to my first point. Don't like the make-up of the committee that vets nominations? Delete them all and then go recruit people who didn't apply but who you want to be on the committee for some specific reason...

I am not impugning anyone currently on the committee, but rather, pointing out that our system is arguably just as vulnerable if someone wanting to take a Trump-like approach comes along.

Anyway, to tie this back to the topic, elections have consequences and we should not miss out on the lessons that are being learned in the US right now. Democratic institutions can be dismantled very quickly by someone who just decides not to follow established norms and protocols.

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

In some cases you seem to like arguing for the sake of it, which, fine, but come on. .

I think MBates could be described as anything but arguing for the sake of arguing on CP. His contribution has been absolutely incredible for the board. I'm so happy he's decided to give his legal input here, he's been by far one of our greatest contributors, imo.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

Worked for the Vietnamese... might still work.

Haha.
The Vietcong were a disciplined and battle tested guerilla force.
The militant Tumpers are fat and lazy and entitled. The only thing that they have in their favour is the abjectly terrible optics of the military killing US citizens, but if it came to it the military could mop the floor with them.