Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[redforever]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Didn't they make changes in 2011 and the West still wasn't happy about it? It's a thing they'll always dangle because it fires up the base, but they're never going to actually make meaningful changes because they know it won't win them an election if they piss off Quebec.

No, there was a temporary change to the Total Transfer plan but that was rescinded later on because of objections from Ontario.

No province should be happy with the current plan, not until all provinces report revenues from their natural resources in the same way.

[SebC]

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/ukrain...line-1.5981741

Natural Services Canada Minister Jonathan Wilkinson announced on social media Saturday that turbines from the Nord Stream 1 pipeline--which supplies natural gas from Russia to Germany -- that had been sent to Montreal for scheduled repairs would be allowed to be returned.

If only there were some other country that could supply Germany with natural gas so we wouldn't have to gut our own sanctions.

[Azure]

Isn't it rich?

We have basically shuttered LNG development in Canada, and have come so far that we are now going to tip toe around sanctions to help make sure Germany can keep paying Russians for their gas, so they in turn can use that money to keep killing Ukrainians.

What a time to be a Canadian.

[opendoor]

LNG isn't going to end reliance on Nord Stream anytime soon. Germany doesn't even have the capability to import any LNG at all at this point, and likely won't until 2023, at which point they could replace about 7 of the 55 bcm they get from Nord Stream. There's a reason that most of the deals they're signing for LNG supply are generally starting in 2025 or 2026.

[TorqueDog]

opendoor you're clearly overthinking this, a country like Germany can totally switch LNG providers the same way someone switches from ATCO to Enmax. It totally wouldn't be kicking one of our allies in the proverbial groin to not fix the turbines that supply Germany with LNG.

[Azure]

Sarcasm aside, if a country like Canada would have gotten their #### together, and had LNG available for export, Germany would have been one of the first countries to line up to sign long-term deals.

Obviously at this point you can't expect Germany to do anything other than be beholden to Russian gas, because other countries with massive reserves can't supply them with they need, and everything from residential heating to manufacturing capacity is at risk if they can't get stable gas supply.

What is sad is that if you go back 5-10 or 15 years, Canada has been in the unique position to help avoid much of what is happening right now, but instead of doing that, we are now at the point where we help dodge sanctions and are playing a part in helping Russia fund the war machine that will continue to kill Ukrainians.

From a political standpoint it is an unmitigated disaster. and SHOULD be political disaster, but probably won't. From an ethical standpoint our country is an embarrassment.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Azure

Sarcasm aside, if a country like Canada would have gotten their #### together, and had LNG available for export, Germany would have been one of the first countries to line up to sign long-term deals.

Obviously at this point you can't expect Germany to do anything other than be beholden to Russian gas, because other countries with massive reserves can't supply them with they need, and everything from residential heating to manufacturing capacity is at risk if they can't get stable gas supply.

What is sad is that if you go back 5-10 or 15 years, Canada has been in the unique position to help avoid much of what is happening right now, but instead of doing that, we are now at the point where we help dodge sanctions and are playing a part in helping Russia fund the war machine that will continue to kill Ukrainians.

From a political standpoint it is an unmitigated disaster. and SHOULD be political disaster, but probably won't. From an ethical standpoint our country is an embarrassment.

Serious question, why do you live here?

You have the Canadian Flag as your avatar but I honestly don't think I've ever heard you say anything positive about this country. If i hated this country as much as you appear to I don't think I would stay just to bad mouth it if I thought things would be better living elsewhere.

[Red Slinger]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Serious question, why do you live here?

You have the Canadian Flag as your avatar but I honestly don't think I've ever heard you say anything positive about this country. If i hated this country as much as you appear to I don't think I would stay just to bad mouth it if I thought things would be better living elsewhere.

I really dislike the "love or leave it" mentality. People complain about their country and it's leaders, usually because they care about the well-being of the nation and want it to be better.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Red Slinger

I really dislike the "love or leave it" mentality. People complain about their country and it's leaders, usually because they care about the well-being of the nation and want it to be better.

I don’t disagree but when a person doesn’t ever have anything good to say, putting the question of why they stay to them usually helps them remember the positives.

We’ve all got our gripes but at some point it stops being about trying to make things better and becomes complaining for the sake of complaining.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I don’t disagree but when a person doesn’t ever have anything good to say, putting the question of why they stay to them usually helps them remember the positives.

We’ve all got our gripes but at some point it stops being about trying to make things better and becomes complaining for the sake of complaining.

There are many people on here that fit your comments with regards to complaining about Alberta, the politics here and the redneck culture. They should all shut the hell up or leave, right?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

There are many people on here that fit your comments with regards to complaining about Alberta, the politics here and the redneck culture. They should all shut the hell up or leave, right?

I’m not sure I understand where you’re coming from with this, when have I told anyone to shut up or leave?

However if someone only ever spoke of Alberta negatively I would probably ask them what is keeping them here. I don’t think that’s an unreasonable thing to ask someone.

You’re welcome to disagree with that but whether it’s intentional or not I don’t see what you have to gain with your attempt to twist my words.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Serious question, why do you live here?

You have the Canadian Flag as your avatar but I honestly don't think I've ever heard you say anything positive about this country. If i hated this country as much as you appear to I don't think I would stay just to bad mouth it if I thought things would be better living elsewhere.

Lots of things to love about our country, but when we make decisions where we fund the killing of innocent people, all those other things get put on the back seat.

Do you not have a problem that our country is helping the Russians kill innocent Ukrainians? Should we not being holding our government accountable for putting us in that position?

What a stupid post.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

I’m not sure I understand where you’re coming from with this, when have I told anyone to shut up or leave?

However if someone only ever spoke of Alberta negatively I would probably ask them what is keeping them here. I don’t think that’s an unreasonable thing to ask someone.

You’re welcome to disagree with that but whether it’s intentional or not I don’t see what you have to gain with your attempt to twist my words.

Dissent & criticism of government is an important foundation of any democratic society.

If you think the criticism of the Liberals is louder than usual, I would agree, it probably is. And why shouldn't it be? They have been in power for close to 10 years and as the ruling party have made decisions that have led to our country being in a position that is unethical and embarrassing. Why would anyone NOT be critical of that?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Azure

Dissent & criticism of government is an important foundation of any democratic society.

If you think the criticism of the Liberals is louder than usual, I would agree, it probably is. And why shouldn't it be? They have been in power for close to 10 years and as the ruling party have made decisions that have led to our country being in a position that is unethical and embarrassing. Why would anyone NOT be critical of that?

I’m already well aware of your stance on our current government but I don’t consider it relevant to my question. I also don’t think you’re any louder than usual as you’ve consistently maintained your position of blaming and criticizing the liberals for pretty much everything and anything, often using blatantly one sided arguments to the point where I find it difficult to take much of anything you say seriously so there’s no change there.

It’s a shame though because I think you’re smarter than that.

Bonus internet message board points for calling just under 7 years in government(almost 3 of which now were as a minority government) almost 10 years as the ruling party to really drive home the point.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Azure

Lots of things to love about our country, but when we make decisions where we fund the killing of innocent people, all those other things get put on the back seat.

Do you not have a problem that our country is helping the Russians kill innocent Ukrainians? Should we not being holding our government accountable for putting us in that position?

I have a problem with any time our country contributes to the killing of innocent people. But I’m not about to use it as a platform to grandstand for my own self interests using revisionist history that ignores all the reasons why what you wanted both our past and present governments to have done wouldn’t have been possible anyways.

What a stupid post.

Your disapproval of my post unfortunately doesn’t carry as much weight with me as you’re probably hoping it does.

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Azure

Sarcasm aside, if a country like Canada would have gotten their #### together, and had LNG available for export, Germany would have been one of the first countries to line up to sign long-term deals.

Aren't basically all large LNG importers countries that can't be (are aren't currently) adequately supplied by pipelines (e.g. Japan, South Korea, China, etc)? Why would Germany have spent billions of dollars on gasification plants just to pay a higher price for gas than what they get through pipelines (Gazprom has historically priced its gas to Europe to undercut LNG). Sure there are geopolitical reasons why that would have made sense, but would it actually have happened? I seriously doubt it. The US has had significant LNG to export for 5-6 years now, but Germany never signed any deals to import it from them until the war in Ukraine. So why would they have been beating down Canada's door?

[calculoso]

It appears the conservatives are as messed up as they appear

https://twitter.com/user/status/1546654610034769920

https://twitter.com/user/status/1546654611406192641

https://twitter.com/user/status/1546654612748472321

[Fuzz]

I guess they learned well from the UCP. You can be dirty, and the RCMP investigation will last so long it won't matter.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Aren't basically all large LNG importers countries that can't be (are aren't currently) adequately supplied by pipelines (e.g. Japan, South Korea, China, etc)? Why would Germany have spent billions of dollars on gasification plants just to pay a higher price for gas than what they get through pipelines (Gazprom has historically priced its gas to Europe to undercut LNG). Sure there are geopolitical reasons why that would have made sense, but would it actually have happened? I seriously doubt it. The US has had significant LNG to export for 5-6 years now, but Germany never signed any deals to import it from them until the war in Ukraine. So why would they have been beating down Canada's door?

Obviously talking with the benefit of hindsight here, but there's a lesson in this situation from Germany too. Canada could've had export capacity in place, and Germany could've still not had the infrastructure in place to import. And Germany could've had the import capacity, and Canada still not had the export capacity. Germany's share of the blame doesn't absolve Canada for not doing its part nor vice-versa.

[1991 Canadian]

Originally Posted by Azure

Sarcasm aside, if a country like Canada would have gotten their #### together, and had LNG available for export, Germany would have been one of the first countries to line up to sign long-term deals.

Obviously at this point you can't expect Germany to do anything other than be beholden to Russian gas, because other countries with massive reserves can't supply them with they need, and everything from residential heating to manufacturing capacity is at risk if they can't get stable gas supply.

What is sad is that if you go back 5-10 or 15 years, Canada has been in the unique position to help avoid much of what is happening right now, but instead of doing that, we are now at the point where we help dodge sanctions and are playing a part in helping Russia fund the war machine that will continue to kill Ukrainians.

From a political standpoint it is an unmitigated disaster. and SHOULD be political disaster, but probably won't. From an ethical standpoint our country is an embarrassment.

This isn't on Canada.

Sending LNG gas to EU is not an economical decision for either side. It never has been. It never will be. It's a political, moral and environmental decision. So if Canadians and/or Europeans want this done, it has to be paid for by the average citizen in the form of taxes or higher gas costs.

5,10,15 years ago, try and make this argument as politician/business leader and not get laughed out a room.

Ok guys, my name is Azure. The year is *insert year between 2000 and 2020*. I'm a Canadian politician / energy CEO. We need to supply the EU/Germany with LNG because Russia is becoming increasingly unstable and hostile. To do this, we need to:

-Twin the existing TC Energy natural gas mainline and expand it to the coast. This will cost $12 billion*
-Build a brand new LNG Export Facility in East Coast Canada. This will cost $10 billion*
-Build new LNG Import Facilities in Germany. This will cost $2 billion*
-Convince the EU/Germany to pay for all this + market natural gas price + transport
-Convince German voters that paying 40 percent* more for natural gas is worth it to buy it from friendly Canada
-Convince the USA that it is in their best interest that Canada diversify their natural gas trading partners (and in theory raise prices for them)
-Convince Russia / Putin not to have sour grapes over losing their largest export market and source of revenue

Who's with me?

*Someone please correct me if these costs are wildly out of line.