[Rumour] Flames aggressively trying to move up. UPD: Treliving and Kekelainen meeting on floor

[Toonage]

What happened here? What does Nichushkin have to do with moving up in the draft?

[skudr248]

Originally Posted by _Q_

I see this type of comment all the time around here and it's such a weird way of thinking. With young players or prospects in general, you're supposed to go after them before they prove anything because the acquisition costs are sky high after they become all stars. Look at Shinkaruk for example. We got him for fairly cheap. He went on to do reasonably well after being put in a position to succeed. Now his value is higher. If he has a break out season next year, nothing short of a top 5 pick and a blue chip prospect will look appealing to Brad in a trade scenario.

I'm not specifically directing this at you, but the general notion that "I don't want player X because they haven't proven anything".

As much as I love Nichushkin (was actually hoping in 2013 we were going to draft him instead of Monahan) he hasn't proven anything. I've watched him play quite a bit, just not that impressed anymore. Shinkaruk was doing fantastic in the AHL before his call up.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

Please just do a deal for Nichuskin and draft the best defenseman at 6.

Kylington & 54 for Nichuskin, RW solved, Dallas gets defense depth and pairs Oliver with his buddy Oduya.

Pick Juolevi at 6 if Tkachuk or Dubois don't fall to us
Sign Reimer at free agency or MAF for our 2 seconds (35 & 56)

Gives us unreal prospect depth at Defense if we pick Juolevi, great size/compete level if we pick one of the forwards at 6.

I don't know about Nichuskin specifically but I like this line of thinking. If the BPA at 6 is arguably a D and we already have a good stable of D prospects then they become currency. The Flames get the F they need without depleting their prospect base. In fact, getting an older F in exchange for drafting a younger D lines up better with the Flames' demographic needs.

[BrownDrake]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Trading Kylington and drafting Jeolevi does not give us unreal prospect depth at defense - it keeps us pretty much even.

As of right now we have too many D prospects that won't play for us in 2 to 5 years. We have one top 4 spot available in 2017/18, possibly one 5/6 spot in 18/19

Andersson is better than Kylington IMO
Wotherspoon, Hickey, Morrisson, Gilmour, Kulak, Culkin, Pick at 6 maybe

Maybe Andersson or Juolevi slides into the 4 spot in 2 years, several prospects that likely can slot into 5/6 spots as turnover occurs.

We do have organizational depth at defense, that is where we likely deal from to address an area of weakness.

[Incogneto]

I have shared my spreadsheet in the past, just as a running Salary Cap study. I have added a tab called 'Running Numbers' that I am constantly messing around with. Right now, I have it so we can trade for Hartnell, #3, AAAAAND MAF, but we would have to shed Wideman and Raymond....somehow.....

Anyways, its for your interest if you want to take a look at what things look like with assumed costs in there:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1769600760

I am sure there are some mistakes as well...It's just for fun.

ETA: For clarity, the 2016-2017 tab is our current roster with some assumed costs. The 'Running Numbers' tab is me messing around with fun stuff.

I think there is a site that does all of this....what is it called?

[Poe969]

I'd see what the flames had in Prbyl before going anything up for nisch

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Where does this number come from? The figures I get from the usual sources are:

Hockeybuzz = $47,917,067 for 14 players, which does not include Mason Raymond ($2.2 m)
CapFriendly = $49,767,067 for 16 players, with Bennett, Shinkaruk, and Kyllington on 2-way deals.
General Fanager = $50,636,231 for 17 players, with Bennett, Shinkaruk, and Seiloff(?) on 2-way deals.

Besides, your original typically melodramatic complaint was:


How does this make any sense when (1) Brody is untouchable for another full year after the expiration of Bobrovsky's contract, and (2) the Flames are shedding +$17 m of cap space in the same year in which Bennett will be extended.

Got my numbers directly off hockey buzz. When I get to a computer this evening I'll address the budget clearer. It is hard to do from a phone. Least to say that the long term structure is tight, especially if Bennett continues to develop as he is (better than Monahan). Your point on Brodie's contract does change things. I thought Brodie's contract was one year shorter and abob's contract ran through 2020. That does help a bit in that regard.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by BrownDrake

He's 21, playing 3rd line minutes, has scored 14 goals.

You don't think in a couple of years playing 20 minutes a night with Gaudreau/Monahan or 17 to 18 minutes a night with Bennett/Shinkaruk he can put up 30 goals?

he also did that in his rookie season and has been trending down ever since.

That's not a promising trajectory for any player.

[FlameZilla]

If Bobrovsky's groin is fully healed I would be more than happy with him between the pipes. If he's going to be out injured as much as he has been for the last 2 years then that cap hit is really painful.

From a Blue Jacket's perspective, who replaces Bob in net? Korpisalo? McBackup?

[Iniggywetrust]

I see some pretty substantial pieces going the other way in any trade that gets the Flames into the top 3.5 and I'm not sure it's worth it.

I just look back to 2013 when we heard all three 1st for 1st overall. I wouldn't trade Monahan for Mackinnon straight up right now.

We get so caught up in the hype of the draft and "tiers" and "top 3s" that we forget this is a educated crap shoot. The player at 6 could be better than anyone around them in 5 years. Damn, one of the second round picks could be the best player in the draft.

I say make the picks and see how it unfolds.

[StrykerSteve]

I'd take Nichushkin on my team in a heartbeat.

[jmac98]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

he also did that in his rookie season and has been trending down ever since.

That's not a promising trajectory for any player.

He's played 2 seasons. Not a big sample pool to forecast their trajectory between them.

[Par]

I don't think trades can be made, today, the NHL does not want to over shadow their Vegas party.

[Poe969]

I just have a really strong feeling that the Flames will make the trade up to 3rd overall. It just seems like the perfect year for it to happen. At this point, I don't see any trade happening today and this deal will be announced at the draft right before the pick is used (but the deal will have already been done, they'll just announce it at the last second for the drama)

[Vinny01]

Saw a real ugly teade on HF that had the flames taking on Bob and Hartnell while sending Bennett and 6.

There is quite the gap between what our fanbase and theirs suspects. If the deal goes down it will be interesting to see which fanbase is pumped and which is pissed

[Drak]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Saw a real ugly teade on HF that had the flames taking on Bob and Hartnell while sending Bennett and 6.

There is quite the gap between what our fanbase and theirs suspects. If the deal goes down it will be interesting to see which fanbase is pumped and which is pissed

I wouldn't understand trading Bennett as part for their unproven 3rd. That would cause me to riot in my home.

[Benched]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Saw a real ugly teade on HF that had the flames taking on Bob and Hartnell while sending Bennett and 6.

There is quite the gap between what our fanbase and theirs suspects. If the deal goes down it will be interesting to see which fanbase is pumped and which is pissed

Boston fans also thought we were giving up Johnny at the least for Hamilton...

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Benched

Boston fans also thought we were giving up Johnny at the least for Hamilton...

Exactly. Rarely is a team coming out as the winner if a cap dump is involved. Flames send a couple draft picks and eat the Hartnell contract to move up 3 spots. Bar-Down posted what I thought was a realistic trade last night

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Benched

Boston fans also thought we were giving up Johnny at the least for Hamilton...

To be fair I think we were all worried that was happening too.

[Robo]

Bennett alone should be enough to get the #3 Never mind having to throw in #6 but still I would keep bennett