How is everyone dealing with their finances in this economy?

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Mine are 18/20

It isn't easier or better or harder or worse when they are older.

It is different.

It is still a challenge at time they are just different challenges.

Great point. For us the early years (pre school) were the easy years. Then it was just busy. Not stressful but busy. Grade 12 and university were the hardest years mentally for us hands down. Not even close in our case, those later years were absolutely the hardest to get through.

[Old Yeller]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

those later years were absolutely the hardest to get through.

From a financial standpoint or in just general busyness?

I'm an older dad and we've only got one and he's almost 4 years old so I'm just curious why you found the older years the hardest.. I mean I'll probably be retired by the time my kid goes to university... if he goes to university.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Mine are 18/20

It isn't easier or better or harder or worse when they are older.

It is different.

It is still a challenge at time they are just different challenges.

I'm at 18/14. Oh ya its different, costs certainly go up though.

I actually found the first months/year of having kids to be wholly un-fun. Did not enjoy pretty much every second of it. Once they become self-aware, then the fun starts.

I definitely realize that you somehow do a better job on the second one (at least I did). The 18 year old can't figure out how to unload the dishwasher.

The 14 year old I can drop in the middle of Tokyo and I would find him a day later at YYC having a meal and a limo waiting for him outside to take him back home.

[Russic]

It is important to note that no two experiences will ever be the same (hence why my advice would be to myself). I'm with Fotze... I didn't really like the early years. I was full of self-doubt and concern. It felt like I was watching over my drunk university buddies again and I always hated that.

Now that mine are older and my role has shifted away from caretaker to life coach, I'm far more comfortable. That said, I talk to people all the time who had the complete opposite experience.

There's so many intangibles that it becomes impossible to forecast. Maybe your kids become super cool, adopt your hobbies, develop brutal learning disabilities, get into drugs, or you're hit with serious illness.

As for the costs, I think it's probably very much like this thread in that it depends. There's factors of decision and factors of chance. Does your kid fall in love with hockey or band? That's gonna change your financial trajectory real quick. My kid likes writing, so if I can keep him stocked with Moleskine notebooks, I'm good. So compared to having them both in $1000/month daycare, things got better for us. This isn't the case for everyone.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Russic

It is important to note that no two experiences will ever be the same (hence why my advice would be to myself). I'm with Fotze... I didn't really like the early years. I was full of self-doubt and concern. It felt like I was watching over my drunk university buddies again and I always hated that.

Now that mine are older and my role has shifted away from caretaker to life coach, I'm far more comfortable. That said, I talk to people all the time who had the complete opposite experience.

There's so many intangibles that it becomes impossible to forecast. Maybe your kids become super cool, adopt your hobbies, develop brutal learning disabilities, get into drugs, or you're hit with serious illness.

As for the costs, I think it's probably very much like this thread in that it depends. There's factors of decision and factors of chance. Does your kid fall in love with hockey or band? That's gonna change your financial trajectory real quick. My kid likes writing, so if I can keep him stocked with Moleskine notebooks, I'm good. So compared to having them both in $1000/month daycare, things got better for us. This isn't the case for everyone.

I think was was pretty much asexual for 6 months after seeing the first birth, god that was traumatic (for me, not her obviously).

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

Anybody else get to their late 30's/early 40's with an idea that they were just going to keep hopping up the corporate ladder as they get older, only to realize that the demands/politics/life balance trade off just isn't worth it with small kids?

Not exactly where I would want to be financially at this point in my life, but understand I'll never get these years back with my kids.

I see people go both ways.
Some keep working a ton and don't spend too much time with their kids. Maybe they have a spouse who does or a nanny/grandparents etc.
On the surface, they might end up looking very successful and maybe they are in their own sense.

Then you see people who take their foot off the gas, become more family oriented and chill out on the hustle.
I don't think there's really a right or wrong in that, got to figure out your own balance.

The difficult thing with modern economic times is it's very difficult to financially relax when most people around 40 are still trying to buy a house, pay off a big mortgage, pay off debt, save for kids educations etc.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Russic

As somebody with slightly older kids (14/12), if I could give 10-years-ago me one bit of advice, it would probably be to realize that the feeling of running on empty–while uncomfortable–is precisely what it's supposed to feel like. Little kids are very difficult. Even if you're having a great time, they demand an inordinate amount of time, attention, and energy. On top of that you have to balance a marriage that has most certainly changed because nobody has kids without changing.

I'm watching a buddy of mine now try to spin up a business and have little kids at the same time and it makes me sad. He feels like a failure on all fronts when truthfully there's almost no reality where he can be a 100% father, business owner, husband, and take care of himself all at the same time.

It all comes in waves. Maybe this is your time to make money, or maybe this is your time to be a parent, but it's probably not your time to do both. It feels like it'll last forever because that's what our brains do when things are hard.

Yeah. My kids are 8/10, and 6-8 years ago I was basically 100% on what I would call the "basics".

They're still work now (making them school lunches, buying them stuff, whatever) but a lot of the time I spend with them is really fun (playing catch, riding bikes, playing cards, reading, whatever) whereas changing diapers and cleaning up food you threw on the floor wasn't exactly life-giving, and since they couldn't do anything themselves took a lot more time.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Mine are 18/20

It isn't easier or better or harder or worse when they are older.

It is different.

It is still a challenge at time they are just different challenges.

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Great point. For us the early years (pre school) were the easy years. Then it was just busy. Not stressful but busy. Grade 12 and university were the hardest years mentally for us hands down. Not even close in our case, those later years were absolutely the hardest to get through.

Mine are 18/16 right now. I think it's a million, trillion, billion times easier now. Stakes are higher with parties, drinking, driving (not drinking and driving, of course), them out late is unsettling versus everyone tucked in their beds, etc., so I'm not saying it's a breeze, but it is vastly easier and it's so much nicer having a lot of experiences that are peer-like versus just running around after small kids.

When kids are babies/toddlers, literally every single time they have to go to the bathroom, eat, bathe...do anything...it's your problem and you're involved. You sure you don't have some sort of amnesia about how much tiring work was involved in having small kids? Every activity you had to drive them to. Every time they wanted to hang with a friend you were involved. Getting dressed, doing their laundry, cooking for them, cleaning up after them, etc. Everything you did was because of some effort on your part. Did you maybe have a SAHW that did the lion's share of the work or maybe you had super involved parents that assisted with the little kid stuff?

I would honestly jump off a bridge if I had to go back to small kids. I literally couldn't do it - there's no gas left in the tank for all that fkn around.

Now at 16/18 my kids rule. My daughter even came to wing night with my posse the other week. We had so much fun (she's known them forever and interacts with them in a super cool way). My son and I go to car meets, car shows and he's enjoying detailing cars so much he's started a little business with his buddy. This is all rad stuff. Oh plus my son is getting big (he's probably about 6' now) and it's his goal to kick my ass. I horse around with him a bit and have some fun, but every once in a while I have to old-man strength him to show him who's the boss and it's hilarious. This weekend he was trying to get me to "hold his pocket" and was taking swipes at me while I was laying on the couch. I finally jumped up and was charlie horsing him until he yelled out to his mom to say "I'm a bitch." Fk yeah. Good luck doing that with your seven year old and not ending up in an uncomfortable meeting somewhere.

The other perk is all their friends are super cool and fun. I love the energy and vibe of young people. Obviously I stay out of their way for the most part as I don't want to be the 'hey fellow kids' dude, but I do get to spend some time with them and it's always great. Late- and mid-teen people get along super well with Gen X compared to the more hierarchical relationship Boomers and Gen X had in the 90s IMO. Like, I'm not saying my friends and I are so cool or anything, but the kids totally accept us and enjoy our company in a peerish way (in the right contexts) that is awesome.

All experiences are different based on personalities, family dynamics, external stresses, etc. and something could change in my house that turns all this on its head in a heartbeat, but in general older kids are so much easier, more fun and better than young kids that there isn't even a comparison.

Plus, mine are still snuggly sometimes. Best of all worlds. I'll be a disaster when they leave...I love having them around soooooo much.

[Slava]

^ I'm at the same ages and with you on that stuff Sliver. I do love having my kids around, but I also recognize that my job as a parent is to make myself obsolete. My daughter is away this summer and it's both awesome for her, and weird.

But as my kids age, we're more friends than dealing with everything for them and that is so nice.

[Old Yeller]

Originally Posted by Sliver

The other perk is all their friends are super cool and fun. I love the energy and vibe of young people. Obviously I stay out of their way for the most part as I don't want to be the 'hey fellow kids' dude, but I do get to spend some time with them and it's always great. Late- and mid-teen people get along super well with Gen X compared to the more hierarchical relationship Boomers and Gen X had in the 90s IMO. Like, I'm not saying my friends and I are so cool or anything, but the kids totally accept us and enjoy our company in a peerish way (in the right contexts) that is awesome.

That is super interesting and I know exactly what you're talking about in the GenX/Boomer dynamic from "back in the day".

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Mine are 18/16 right now. I think it's a million, trillion, billion times easier now. Stakes are higher with parties, drinking, driving (not drinking and driving, of course), them out late is unsettling versus everyone tucked in their beds, etc., so I'm not saying it's a breeze, but it is vastly easier and it's so much nicer having a lot of experiences that are peer-like versus just running around after small kids.

When kids are babies/toddlers, literally every single time they have to go to the bathroom, eat, bathe...do anything...it's your problem and you're involved. You sure you don't have some sort of amnesia about how much tiring work was involved in having small kids? Every activity you had to drive them to. Every time they wanted to hang with a friend you were involved. Getting dressed, doing their laundry, cooking for them, cleaning up after them, etc. Everything you did was because of some effort on your part. Did you maybe have a SAHW that did the lion's share of the work or maybe you had super involved parents that assisted with the little kid stuff?

I would honestly jump off a bridge if I had to go back to small kids. I literally couldn't do it - there's no gas left in the tank for all that fkn around.

Now at 16/18 my kids rule. My daughter even came to wing night with my posse the other week. We had so much fun (she's known them forever and interacts with them in a super cool way). My son and I go to car meets, car shows and he's enjoying detailing cars so much he's started a little business with his buddy. This is all rad stuff. Oh plus my son is getting big (he's probably about 6' now) and it's his goal to kick my ass. I horse around with him a bit and have some fun, but every once in a while I have to old-man strength him to show him who's the boss and it's hilarious. This weekend he was trying to get me to "hold his pocket" and was taking swipes at me while I was laying on the couch. I finally jumped up and was charlie horsing him until he yelled out to his mom to say "I'm a bitch." Fk yeah. Good luck doing that with your seven year old and not ending up in an uncomfortable meeting somewhere.

The other perk is all their friends are super cool and fun. I love the energy and vibe of young people. Obviously I stay out of their way for the most part as I don't want to be the 'hey fellow kids' dude, but I do get to spend some time with them and it's always great. Late- and mid-teen people get along super well with Gen X compared to the more hierarchical relationship Boomers and Gen X had in the 90s IMO. Like, I'm not saying my friends and I are so cool or anything, but the kids totally accept us and enjoy our company in a peerish way (in the right contexts) that is awesome.

All experiences are different based on personalities, family dynamics, external stresses, etc. and something could change in my house that turns all this on its head in a heartbeat, but in general older kids are so much easier, more fun and better than young kids that there isn't even a comparison.

Plus, mine are still snuggly sometimes. Best of all worlds. I'll be a disaster when they leave...I love having them around soooooo much.

Every experience is different.

For us, 18/20 year olds bring a whole new set of challenges.

Watching you son struggle with life choices to the point of being crippled with fear of making the wrong choice is really tuff.

I can love & coach & guide all I want, but 18 can be a tuff time for some.

I'm lucky both boy and the girl still hang with me.

My "ski squad" is my 20 yr old daughter and her 21 yr old BFF (who we seem to have adopted).

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Plus, mine are still snuggly sometimes. Best of all worlds. I'll be a disaster when they leave...I love having them around soooooo much.

Ya, wife, younger and older all left on the same day in September. First time I've ever lived on my own in my life. Definitely not the best of times.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

Anybody else get to their late 30's/early 40's with an idea that they were just going to keep hopping up the corporate ladder as they get older, only to realize that the demands/politics/life balance trade off just isn't worth it with small kids?

Not exactly where I would want to be financially at this point in my life, but understand I'll never get these years back with my kids.

This is kind of where I'm at.

I had a shot at a more senior role and really didn't put my all into making it happen and it passed me by. Then I watch the expectations of that role - travelling 2 weeks out of every month, working more weekends that I could fathom, and it would've been too much. I wouldn't do it with my current 2.5 year old and a 5 month old.

I keep thinking to myself when I'll restart the hustle, and thoughts of whether this is the best I can do start to creep in and is very demoralizing.

Now don't get me wrong, our family is extremely comfortable so really the choices are not going to be life changing either way, but thinking about it creeps in to my day to day all the time.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by fotze2

Ya, wife, younger and older all left on the same day in September. First time I've ever lived on my own in my life. Definitely not the best of times.

Like, left left, or are on an adventure somewhere and will be back sometime? (if too personal no need to reply)

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Like, left left, or are on an adventure somewhere and will be back sometime? (if too personal no need to reply)

I read it as they went for a trip.


I hope I am right..

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Like, left left, or are on an adventure somewhere and will be back sometime? (if too personal no need to reply)

No, left for the kid to play hockey, back in a bit. But that didn't stop me from posting vague updates on Facebook (that my wife doesn't use) so that she gets texts from friends asking if we split up (just to piss her off of course).

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

I read it as they went for a trip.


I hope I am right..

I'm pretty sure he said in another thread his family moved somewhere for one of his kids to play hockey for awhile.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Old Yeller

That is super interesting and I know exactly what you're talking about in the GenX/Boomer dynamic from "back in the day".

I just feel like there was a strong hierarchical delineation between our parents' generation and the kids. Some of my friends' boomer parents even went by the formal Mrs. X and Mr. X, which always blew me away even at the time (my parents always went by their first name with my friends). I just think it was a way of artificially commanding respect and putting younger people in their place as lesser-thans. I remember my friends mom correcting me to use Mrs when I called her by her first name when I was in, like, grade 5. To this day I think she's a bitch because of that.

I don't think any of my kids' friends go by Mr or Mrs anything. First-name basis all the way. I think that would be such a sign of a no-fun loser parent if they went by formal titles in 2024 and I really wouldn't appreciate them slotting my kid as beneath them on the "respect scale" due to their age.

If Boomer parents were driving around GenXer kids somewhere, you sort of had to be quiet and respectful in their car. Now I'll let my kids or their friends crank their favourite tune and we'll joke around and laugh and just have a normal human interaction when together versus a upstairs/downstairs dynamic.

I also don't think Zoomers need to be as secretive around GenXers compared to how GenXers had to be around Boomers because - at least for myself and my peers - we remember what growing up was like and respect that experimentation and shenanigans are a part of adolescence. For example, my daughter doesn't have to hide from me if she'll be drinking or taking cannabis gummies or whatever. I'll make sure she has a full belly before heading out, I remind her about reasonable quantities to not become a disaster, let her know that 90% of people are just out for fun, but there is a subset of predators out there and to have her friends' backs and be mindful for herself, too. When I was young the Boomer parents knew we were drinking for sure, but they wouldn't help or guide us or support our fun - we all just pretended nobody knew.

I think it boils down to hierarchy again. Myself and my GenX friends just do not elevate ourselves above Zoomers. We treat them and talk to them like equals because we truly believe they are equals. Just younger ones with less experience, but equals nonetheless. I didn't get that vibe from Boomers when we were kids. Boomers seemed to want to be in a class above us.

Generalizing a lot here, btw. Exceptions for every generation.

[sketchyt]

Since this thread is about finances but we're talking about kids, here's some of what I learned financially with my child in the early years. YMMV:

• Start that RESP ASAP. Put in the max if you can. I look now at what it has accrued and it's going to be a lifesaver for my wallet.
• Buy as little baby clothes as possible. You'll either get them as gifts or hand me downs. This kid will exit bodily fluids through all holes. Use the hand me downs and toss them when they get too soiled.
• If you can, wait for diapers to go on sale then stock up.
• Did you really need that $1000 stroller? The answer is always no.
• Never shop at a place like West Coast Kids with your significant other. Just... never shop there at all if you like your money.
• The expensive toys that says they will make your kid smarter is all mostly BS. Just go outside with them.
• New car, couches, flooring, etc...? Don't bother until the kid is older. It's gonna get destroyed.
• When/if daycare hits and you're feeling that hit, always remember, yes this sucks but it's a temporary expense.
• Most importantly, Use some sort of a cashflow spreadsheet to see where your money is going now, where it will be going in the next couple years, how much income you will be bringing in (you'll likely be making less with mat leave) and where/how you might need to bridge the gap.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by Old Yeller

From a financial standpoint or in just general busyness?

I'm an older dad and we've only got one and he's almost 4 years old so I'm just curious why you found the older years the hardest.. I mean I'll probably be retired by the time my kid goes to university... if he goes to university.

Everyone is different. For us it wasn't financial at all, it was the stress of high school and university that almost took things over the top. We're fortunate, both my kids excelled academically and never got into trouble socially but the stress still took a massive toll on all of us. Sounds like first world problems now that I read what I wrote but for us that was the experience.