YYCVotes: Ward 12 Discussion

[Tyler]

Great comment about the BRT having too many stops.

As someone who tried moving from taking the LRT to the BRT, I can't tell you how frustrating stopping every 3-5 minutes on the way from McKenzie Towne to the DT is.

Not very "rapid" at all.

[psicodude]

Wow, you must really hate signs not on your property huh?

[celly]

Copied to post below. Tried to delete.

[celly]

Originally Posted by Tyler

Great comment about the BRT having too many stops.

As someone who tried moving from taking the LRT to the BRT, I can't tell you how frustrating stopping every 3-5 minutes on the way from McKenzie Towne to the DT is.

Not very "rapid" at all.

I live minutes from work (down 52nd St to 114th and almost there). I don't deal with transportation issues as much and others, but I see the point being made. My neighbour from two doors down thought BRT was a good idea and gave it a go. It took him 90 minutes to get to work in downtown. He's pretty environmentally conscious, but resorted to his car again.

As some of the candidates have said, it makes no sense to have those huge buses run empty for much of the day. They're definitely going to have to rethink the logistics of these buses. Hopefully whomever wins next Monday can have some real influence in making it happen.

The Herald ran an article today on this very subject right here.

Originally Posted by psicodude

Wow, you must really hate signs not on your property huh?

Yeah, I don't much care for them. Does it show?

I do have two political signs on my lawn right now for the first time in my life.

[fundmark19]

No way does it take 90 mins on the bus. 60 mins at most. But there is no point to have 3 "express" busses leave from the area and yet all 3 follow the same route and stop at practicly all the same stops between mckenzie towne and dt. Only 2 busses I believe 117 and new brighton express go deerfoot for 2 routes but those buses are always packed. Why does every other community get actual express buses that dont stop 50 times on the way down town. It frustrates me to no end. Keep BRT as it is cuz I like it. Less stops would be fine but if not who cares and make the "Express" buses express! once they leave 130th there should be no stops till down town. If you want off earlier take the BRT.

Sorry end rant!

[Tyler]

An express bus is exactly what I'm pining for from 130th/McKenzie Towne.

Will probably cut the 55 minute commute down to 45ish minutes and make the entire trip worthwhile.

[celly]

I'm just basing my comments on what my neighbour told me. Granted, he took it for the first week when it became available and maybe there were some delays for other reasons.

I agree that "express" should mean "express" (limited stops). I remember getting on an express subway train in NYC once and I sure paid the price for the oversight considering I only wanted to go one or two stops and ended up a LONG way from my destination.

[celly]

And the trolls come out in support of Browne.

Article/comments here.

[Kjesse]

Originally Posted by celly

And the trolls come out in support of Browne.

Article/comments here.

They disagree with you and call you thin-skinned, therefore they're trolls? Give me a break. You flood every herald article there is with vitriol against Browne. I get he called you fat, and I believe you that he did that and don't think he should have done that, but wow, you really have it out for the guy.

[celly]

Originally Posted by Delgar

They disagree with you and call you thin-skinned, therefore they're trolls? Give me a break. You flood every herald article there is with vitriol against Browne. I get he called you fat, and I believe you that he did that and don't think he should have done that, but wow, you really have it out for the guy.

Delgar, you and Al are buddies. I get that. I don't expect you to try and be open minded. If you read the Beacon article, you'd know the "fat" thing wasn't an issue. Anyone who knows me knows I have fun with it but it's different with friends. You, like Al are really trying to deflect what really happened.

The issue I have with Al Browne is his "People like you" don't vote comment. When I tried to nail him down to what he meant by that, then he started in on the fat comments. Classic "bully" mentality. Avoid the issue and make threats and name call.

It's the "people like you" comment that has most people I've spoken with (and there have been lots) that are disgusted with Al Browne. What is I had a little rainbow sticker on my car, or I wore a Star of David or I was a member of another visible minority.

Al wouldn't answer the "people like you" comment because whatever he saw in me (and I have my theories what he was getting at) shows a degree of intolerance that I understand comes out in different ways when Al tries to get what he wants. I've met many people who know Al Browne very well from dealings with him on many levels and they tell me he likes things his own way and will use intimidation tactics and will belittle people to get his point across. I think even you could see him being capable of that since you admit to being his friend.

The issue here isn't about me being called fat. Even the email header I use to send the Calgary Beacon article around (and there are lots of people who have read the article both inside and outside the ward) is entitled "no fat jokes" People see the humour in how I'm presenting it. It's the bullying approach and the implied intolerance that sets Al Browne apart from the other four candidates in Ward 12.

Al has a history of foot in mouth disease. Ask him to tell you about how he sunk his chances of running for the Provincial legislature. Al Browne is his own worst enemy and the last thing a dysfunctional City Council needs is someone who cannot build consensus. He's a loose cannon that needs to stick to Hooters. I truly don't believe he cares about the community. He cares about himself.

Spend a few minutes speaking with Shane Keating and you'll see that he's running for all the right reasons.

[Kjesse]

Originally Posted by celly

Delgar, you and Al are buddies. I get that. I don't expect you to try and be open minded.

I'm not a "buddy" of Al's. I know Al. I've dealt with him on a professional level a couple of times, and know him as a nice guy. If I saw him in public I'd say hi but we probably wouldn't stop to chat. This doesn't make me close minded any more than someone posting at the Herald that they support him becomes an automatic troll. You have a tendency to overreact.


And I'm not defending what he did, but I do get a kick out of how he's turned you into his enemy and you're now a sudden online activist tearing up the internets in a one man mission to make sure Al loses the election because he improperly put a sign up and then made fun of you when you took it down.

I don't actually really care if Al wins or loses as on a personal level, it will not make any difference to me, I just think he'd make a really good Alderman, and know for certain has strong business smarts. Especially if Nenshi wins the mayor's chair (which I hope he does) you need people like Al to serve as a guardian of the public purse-- Nenshi's desire for large public works is great but kind of scares me.

It would appear Al picked the wrong man's public lawn to put a sign on. It cracks me up that you actually had the bylaw before the election started. Every person has to be passionate about a few things, and one of yours is signs on the public lawn in front of your house... another is trying to make sure Al loses. One of my best friends goes apeshiat every time someone parks in front of his house. He's still a great friend but I laugh every time he gets mad about it.

But if someone disagrees with you that Al is bad candidate, and posts it on the Herald's comment section, you think that makes them a troll. In other words, you're out to lunch and blinded by your anger. You have such anger over one incident that you can't possibly believe that some people actually think he's the best choice in that ward. Well, lots of people think that, he polls strong. He might win, he might lose, either way, this whole incident is an interesting little footnote.

[celly]

Delgar:

First of all, I became familiar with the bylaw because 1-800 Junk kept putting up their trashy signs (pardon the pun) there all the time, followed by other businesses. Not only do they get in the way of my weekly lawn cut, but they look like hell, IMHO. It's a residential neighbourhood. I could care less about the signs on the entrance to the community along McKenzie Towne Blvd and 52nd St (most of them illegally placed), but it's a different story when they're adjacent to my home. My wife and I simply don't like them and my neighbours applaud me for getting rid of them. As Bill Bruce told me recently, it's actually the City's duty to take them down, but I think our tax dollars are better spent elsewhere. I take them down, and if a phone # is on the sign, I contact the business in question and ask them not to place signs. Just about every business I've dealt with this way has been gracious about it. Even Bill Bruce appreciates that I help them out by opening up dialog with the business in question. He also agreed that Mr. Browne was in the wrong for the way he approached it.

Browne was in clear violation of two of the main bylaw rules. (2 meters from curb and well under 30 meters from an intersection). There isn't another visible sign in any direction outside of signs that people want there. The City put the "common courtesy" clause into the rule so that ANY person wishing to place a sign on adjacent property would at least ask the homeowner first. When my wife asked nicely (and she's nowhere near as "aggressive" as I am), Browne should have just heeded her wishes. Instead, he said "in your face" and placed many more and waited for me to come home so he could catch me in the act of taking these down. Remember, he called Keating and tried to get him to "pile on" on me. He sold it to Keating as some "vandal" who was trashing signs and wanted Keating to join in so they could report to me Bill Bruce and get me "charged" with something. He called Keating within minutes of the incident and insisted on speaking with Keating (who had better things to do at the time).

In other words, this wasn't just some minor incident. Browne was looking for a fight because that's the way Browne is. I don't want a bully representing me at City Hall. Love him or hate him, I like McIver's approach and I like what he stands for. Ric has always been willing to do what's right. I agree that Nenshi is an intruiging candidate, but I like Ric's experience and style. Browne's style is not my cup of tea, and as I've learned, it runs counter to what a lot of people feel as well. I can't expect everyone to agree with me. That's the beauty of living in a free society.

Yes, Browne pissed off the wrong person. Anyone I've talked to about the issue is shocked that a political figure would behave in such a way. If he's such a great businessman, then her certainly doesn't subscribe to the "Customer is always right" mantra. In politics, EVERY vote counts and you should never take any one vote for granted. I can say with certainty that this one vote has turned into countless others. The link to the Calgary Beacon has been circulated countless times and not just by me.

All Browne needed to do was take the high road and this situation would have been over. I did not "vandalize" the signs. I took them all out of the ground and placed them there. Next step was to contact BOTH Browne and Keating's campaign workers and let them know they could come get their signs. Would I have voted for Browne anyhow?

Unlikely.

I got a bad vibe from the guy when I scored a pizza from Papa John's and it was plastered with his stickers. His gaudy signs all over the riding really annoyed me too. In all honesty, I thought Browne was running for mayor when he told me who he was. I didn't put 2+2 together that he was the guy from the pizza box until later. You never get a second chance to make a first impression. Despite what Browne thought, I had every intention of voting in this election because it's the most interesting campaign since Klein won for the first time way back when. I can honestly say, I didn't know about about the aldermanic candidates until this past Saturday so I count this incident as a blessing in disguise, because it got me involved in the process.

We live in a democracy and I'm glad we can try to make a difference in any way possible. My "cause" is this one. Of course I want people to know what happened. I don't think he's the right candidate because he's a bully and in this day and age, people don't care for bullies more than ever. I saw his real personality up close and realized this was not the guy I'd ever vote for.

It was the way he aggressively tried to provoke me that started all this. Many people may have cowered. I know of someone who said they would have popped Browne in the chops for those remarks. I don't condone violence but it does demonstrate how Browne's actions has hit a nerve with a lot more than just one guy who likes to keep his property free of clutter. I also pick up trash on not only my property and adjacent, but across the street near the mailboxes too. My wife, son and I always volunteer for the McKenzie Towne community cleanup every year as well.

So if it's a bad thing to take pride in one's community, have at it. I won't bite.

Browne made his bed, pissed all over it and he's got to live with his actions. Will it impact the final outcome? I hope so, but Browne is banking on the Tory establishment to carry him to victory and in Alberta, that may just work in his favour. It would be a travesty if it did, but only time will tell what happens now.

[celly]

The truth certainly does get stranger than fiction with Al Browne enters the ring and this time I think he topped himself.

Who here really LOATHES auto-dialers? (of course, we all do).

Mr. Browne's handlers send a bot message claiming endorsements that don't exist to none other than Shane Keating himself.

Al Browne is more dense that I thought.



Desperate times call for desperate measures.

See Keating's blog here.

I've also learned that Al Browne has acknowledged this "oversight" to Vote Calgary and apologized for this latest gaffe is in checkered "political career". He agreed to cease the messages immediately.

WOW

This communique was posted on the Vote Calgary site, obviously in response to Browne's cluelessness.

[celly]

Cow Patty



Couldn't have said it better myself.

[ken0042]

celly- I hope you realize that with your rantings here; if anything you have convinced me further to vote for Browne. You strike me as somebody with an agenda here; possibly running for this position. But coming across as hiding who you really are, makes me want to make sure I don't vote for you.

So for me it's a matter of either you are running and doing yourself a disservice; or you are thinking you are trying to help somebody else and doing that person a disservice.

[celly]

Originally Posted by ken0042

celly- I hope you realize that with your rantings here; if anything you have convinced me further to vote for Browne. You strike me as somebody with an agenda here; possibly running for this position. But coming across as hiding who you really are, makes me want to make sure I don't vote for you.

So for me it's a matter of either you are running and doing yourself a disservice; or you are thinking you are trying to help somebody else and doing that person a disservice.

"Running for this position"? Now that's a new one. I hardly even knew who was running for the position a week ago at this time. I think it's fairly obvious to anyone has followed this story since it broke exactly one week ago that I am NOT running for public office.

That's the beauty of democracy. We have the right to be heard. You don't have to agree with me, but I can you that a lot of people have the "anyone but Browne" message and agree with me.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by ken0042

celly- I hope you realize that with your rantings here; if anything you have convinced me further to vote for Browne. You strike me as somebody with an agenda here; possibly running for this position. But coming across as hiding who you really are, makes me want to make sure I don't vote for you.

So for me it's a matter of either you are running and doing yourself a disservice; or you are thinking you are trying to help somebody else and doing that person a disservice.

This is my exact impression.

I had narrowed the field down to Browne and Keating as my personal options. Your ranting style biased posts only drive me closer to Browne. It is clear you have an agenda which is not driven by logic but personal vendetta. It reaks of the Hawk-bots on twitter spewing lies and misinformation on thier "know Nenshi" campaign of idiocy.

I don't think any candidate themselves would stoop to this level personally, but the fact that you seem to be pushing Keating means that there is certainly a chance you are involved in his campaign. This chance means I won't be voting for Keating, because I don't support those tactics.

[celly]

Like I said, it's a democracy. Vote for who you want.

Involved with Keating's campaign? A week ago I didn't know Keating from Browne from Crowe from Sim from Roztoll. A week ago at around 6:30 PM, I was upset with both Browne and Keating. Neither had my vote. Browne gave me the motivation to learn more is all. I've got him to thank for getting me engaged in the process.

You're reading far too much into it. My opinions are my own. Agree or disagree. It's your choice. At least we have choices.

[Rathji]

Originally Posted by celly

Like I said, it's a democracy. Vote for who you want.

Involved with Keating's campaign? A week ago I didn't know Keating from Browne from Crowe from Sim from Roztoll. A week ago at around 6:30 PM, I was upset with both Browne and Keating. Neither had my vote. Browne gave me the motivation to learn more is all. I've got him to thank for getting me engaged in the process.

You're reading far too much into it. My opinions are my own. Agree or disagree. It's your choice. At least we have choices.

We see people who sign up for the forums to promote their own cause all the time. Almost 90% of your 20 posts since you have joined have hammered on this cause. This gives us the impression that your posts are closer to candidate sponsored spam rather than coming from a fellow Flames fan and voter. Even if you don't intend it to be that way.

[celly]

Originally Posted by Rathji

We see people who sign up for the forums to promote their own cause all the time. Almost 90% of your 20 posts since you have joined have hammered on this cause. This gives us the impression that your posts are closer to candidate sponsored spam rather than coming from a fellow Flames fan and voter. Even if you don't intend it to be that way.

Dude, I admitted already that I stumbled across this thread during a Google search and it motivated me to join the site once and for all. I've lurked here for years and am a HUGE Flames fan and have been ever since Skalbania moved them here from Atlanta and my dad got season's tickets in the Corral. I was at Game 7 in the Canucks Series in 1989. Sat right behind Vernon in overtime as he made save after save before Otto scored the big goal by the seat of his pants....literally. May 25, 1989 still ranks up there as one of my most memorable days rivaled only by the birth of my son and marriage to my wife. Incidentally, I was wearing a Flames t-shirt as I held my son for the first time. I wasn't allowed to wear one to the wedding.

I do plan to be involved with this site because it is the best Flames resource anywhere. I am no stranger to discussion boards and plan to be an active participant. I know I'm a noob and old timers on any site (myself included) often look at noobs with suspicion.

Frankly, the boys haven't given me a lot to talk about lately at this early stage of the season. It will come as the season goes on. I have this bad habit of wanting to read everything Flames when things are going great and bury my head in the sand when they're not. What have we had to cheer for so far? Two goals in three games if you don't count Hagman's empty netter against the Kings. It's looking like a lot of the same we put up with last year and it saddens me, especially that the evil team from up the QE2 is locked and loaded for success down the road.

I'm not going away. This whole Al Browne thing left me with a bitter taste in my mouth. He's not a nice man. I met him face to face and he's simply not my cup of tea. The fact he pulled his crap within plain site of my five year old son still has me pissed off. Call it a hidden agenda if you wish because it's not hidden. I want enough people to know what kind of a person Browne really is. If you support people who have a history of antagonizing behaviour and a condescending approach to getting things done, then so be it.

Seems pretty contradictory to me be voting for Nenshi who is at the polar opposite of the politcal spectrum to Al Browne. Nenshi is apparently a quality person as well. I don't want to get into a Liberal vs Conservative debate either. I'm as centrist as they come and see grey areas better than most. I can see the charm and allure of Nenshi and I only wish he was more proven as a public servant. I see so much flash and little substance whenever he opens his mouth. I appreciate that he's engaged so many Calgarians and made the vote interesting. Calgary has a LONG history of lobsided mayoral races and finally we have a dogfight. If he wins on Monday, I definitely won't feel the sky is falling either. Between Nenshi and Higgins as being the new kid on the block with no experience, Nenshi definitely seems more capable.

Calgary is also notorious for voting in incumbents at the aldermanic level which is why I find the Ward 12 election so interesting. Whomever fills McIver's shoes does have huge shoes to fill. I have yet to see any reason why Al Browne is the man to pick up where McIver left off. He hides from his Hooter's ownership, name drops incessantly and as this latest incident shows, he's dishonest. OK, in a cynical world, society accepts dishonesty from their politicians, but I'm not going to. His "honesty is the best policy" point in the Calgary Sun survey is in itself a big lie, so how can anyone trust this guy?

I've been in touch with McIver's office in the past. His staff are cheerful and helpful. No way in a million years would McIver willingly talk down to a constituent or a potential voter. Call it a vendetta if you wish, but it's like the bully kicking sand in the guy's face on the beach. Browne didn't think the "people like me" would vote, let alone rise up like I did. Once again, the beauty of democracy.

Will the incident of last Saturday and my response to it sway the results of the election? Unlikely. But Browne has lost a lot more votes than just one and that's all I hoped for. I know of many friends and colleagues that did the advance vote since last Saturday, I'm pleased with the results of my little "last minute campaign" to educate people. This riding is wide open with a huge undecided vote. So many people don't have a clue about the candidates because they're too busy watching the McIver/Higgins/Nenshi dogfight.

If you choose to vote for Browne simply because you don't like my posting style, than that's your choice (and not a great one in my opinion). Sorry for the book. Yes, I've been fired up and can't wait for the election to end so I can get back to a normal existence.

See you on the forums....

Go Flames Go. I don't think I can stomach another spanking at the hands of the Oilers tonight but I sense it will result in something better because Iggy will lead the way and Jokinen owes us a good game for the Sutter lifeline. If we get another stinker like the season opener, I may be wearing a to the polling station on Monday.