EA adding codes for console sports games for online play - Page 3 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

GreenTeaFrapp · 05-12-2010, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esoteric

And piracy and second hand market are related; both are a means of playing a game a company creates, and causes the company to recognize no profit because of it.

That's a ridiculously simplistic way of looking at it. Without the second hand market many people would buy far fewer games because they tend to buy, play through and then trade in for newer games.

With the rise of eBay, every non-perishable good has a second hand market. Why are game makers special when it comes to this?

QuadCityImages · 05-12-2010, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esoteric

Since pirated copies can be played over Xbox Live, those who pirate the game and want to play online will have to purchase a $10 activation code. It's tackling both sides to an extent; really, it's hard to eliminate piracy, so this $10 can grab funds they wouldn't receive in the first place.

This implies that the pirates won't easily get around this system just like they do with most copy protection. As usual, it will only end up harming people who do everything legally.

valo403 · 05-12-2010, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esoteric

Since pirated copies can be played over Xbox Live, those who pirate the game and want to play online will have to purchase a $10 activation code. It's tackling both sides to an extent; really, it's hard to eliminate piracy, so this $10 can grab funds they wouldn't receive in the first place.

And piracy and second hand market are related; both are a means of playing a game a company creates, and causes the company to recognize no profit because of it.

Piracy is illegal. Second hand sales are not. They are not related in terms of what the issue is here, not even close. Instead of pursuing means of eliminating piracy EA's going after a legitimate market? Sorry, I don't buy that as a legit rationale. If x causes you a money loss it's not a reason to go after y, at least not as an acceptable rationale in terms of justifying it to the public.

Esoteric · 05-12-2010, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenTeaFrapp

With the rise of eBay, every non-perishable good has a second hand market. Why are game makers special when it comes to this?

I'd argue it's because they still are still providing services for the second hand market, when they haven't received money from these sales.

But I'm going to Europe today, so I'll see how this pans out and continue arguing next month. It's been fun

GreenTeaFrapp · 05-12-2010, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Esoteric

I'd argue it's because they still are still providing services for the second hand market, when they haven't received money from these sales.

They are not providing services to the second hand market. They are providing the functionality that they sold their customers. They sold their games on the promise that they could be played online.

Whether it is player A playing for the next year or if it is player B playing for a month then player C playing for 11 months, it shouldn't make a difference. It is not causing the company to have to provide additional resources than what they should have projected based upon the number of games sold.

Hack&Lube · 05-12-2010, 12:35 PM

I believe that piracy is overstated. You cannot consider every pirated copy to be a lost sale.

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2...t-business.ars

Yamer · 05-12-2010, 06:39 PM

"Capitalism.....made it this way....."

Roast Beef · 05-13-2010, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by valo403

Piracy is illegal. Second hand sales are not. They are not related in terms of what the issue is here, not even close. Instead of pursuing means of eliminating piracy EA's going after a legitimate market? Sorry, I don't buy that as a legit rationale. If x causes you a money loss it's not a reason to go after y, at least not as an acceptable rationale in terms of justifying it to the public.

Secondhand sales are a bigger threat to game studios than piracy. EA is trying to kill both with one stone. PS3 has yet to be cracked to run pirated games. Microsoft does a sweep every now and then to permaban chipped consoles from playing online. I don't know about Wii piracy and online gaming though. The PC does not matter because that is a fraction of the market of consoles. Secondhand gaming is a problem for them though. Game stores charge 5-10 bucks less for a newly released used game than a brand new shrinkwrapped copy that puts some cash in the studios pocket. They are unwilling to support gamers who have not contributed to their bottom line. Simple as that. If you bought the game secondhand and play online then you are using their resources without paying them for it. If you don't want to play online then you have no need of their resources and they have no need of your cash. They already made the money off of the inital sale. If you want to use the assets that they continually spend money on to keep running then you had better pony up.

The pirates will have to pony up as well and still have the risk of a console permaban if they are playing online on the Xbox. The 5-10 dollar difference between newly released new and used games will hopefully go the way of the dodo and make used game prices lower. I just see this as an evolution of the "get free content codes in the box" that are a part of many games now.

SoulOfTheFlame · 05-13-2010, 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenTeaFrapp

Yes, because there is still only one disc in use at a time. What does it matter if it is on the first owner or the hundredth owner?

I didn't think it was that hard to understand but I guess it is.

When you buy the game the price of that game is factored in to supporting you for the time you play the game multiplayer. It's not factored in for any other people who buy the game you re-sell.

If you'd rather games cost more in the beginning to support your ability to re-sell and make EBGAMES, etc. money... then that's up to you

GreenTeaFrapp · 05-13-2010, 05:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoulOfTheFlame

I didn't think it was that hard to understand but I guess it is.

Does this mean I have to explain it even further to you?

Quote:

When you buy the game the price of that game is factored in to supporting you for the time you play the game multiplayer. It's not factored in for any other people who buy the game you re-sell.

Have you ever taken economics because this is just completely ######ed? The game is priced to maximize profit for the company that created it. The costs incurred from the game are irrelevant for setting the price of it.

There are no costs factored in to the price. The price is based upon the demand for the game.

Quote:

If you'd rather games cost more in the beginning to support your ability to re-sell and make EBGAMES, etc. money... then that's up to you

Games aren't going to cost more in the beginning. Anyone who claims that is either lying or stupid. This is purely a cash grab by EA because they think they can get away with it.

SoulOfTheFlame · 05-13-2010, 07:03 AM

Rather than continuing the argument (and I do apologize for the rather trite tone of my last response)... I'll simply say that I believe we as consumers are SPOILED by the incredible amount of entertainment provided to us by Games Developers for the price. Most games usually give you at least 10-20 hours of entertainment, while still others give you dozens, or even hundreds of hours. All for a measly 50-60$.

You probably spend around 20$ going to the movies for 2 hours or less worth of entertainment...

I personally don't mind the ACTUAL developer recouping at least a portion of that money back from 2nd-hand buyers rather than just EB Games, etc. making bucket-loads of money off of it.

tripin_billie · 05-15-2010, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

When you buy a piece of software, even a game, you don't really own it. There's an end user liscensing agreement. You basically liscense the right to play the game and have access to online services which is also stated to be an experience that may change at any time.

That depends though, as there is case law showing decisions in both directions. However, I think that the current precedent is that in relation to First Sale, licensing software = sale.

I'm guessing someone will try taking this as a case.

LockedOut · 05-15-2010, 10:25 PM

"Studio Chief Says Used Games are Worse than Piracy, Urges Ban"
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=18386

I don't like not being able to resell a game I spent $60 if I'm done with it within a week cause there is no replay value or the game is just a piece of crap. IMO not letting people resell games will actually hurt new game sales as people will be more hesistant to spend $60 on an unknown quantity, games that are mediocre or short and have no replay value and be stuck with it no more matter what and can't resell it to recoup some of your cost.

SebC · 05-15-2010, 10:51 PM

^ Yep, that's why new game prices might have to come down to make this work.

flamesfan6 · 05-15-2010, 11:04 PM

how would this system work if your xbox died and needed to transfer the game to the new xbox?

SoulOfTheFlame · 05-15-2010, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flamesfan6

how would this system work if your xbox died and needed to transfer the game to the new xbox?

The code would be associated with your gamertag which you can keep between Xboxes I believe.

FlamesKickAss · 05-16-2010, 10:59 AM

wiuldnt it be based on the HD anyways? and you dont send that back do you?

Joborule · 05-16-2010, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LockedOut

"Studio Chief Says Used Games are Worse than Piracy, Urges Ban"
http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=18386

I don't like not being able to resell a game I spent $60 if I'm done with it within a week cause there is no replay value or the game is just a piece of crap. IMO not letting people resell games will actually hurt new game sales as people will be more hesistant to spend $60 on an unknown quantity, games that are mediocre or short and have no replay value and be stuck with it no more matter what and can't resell it to recoup some of your cost.

Shouldn't people be renting then ahead of purchasing a game if it's going to be a game they don't want to play after a week? Therefore you don't spend too much money on a game you didn't end up enjoying much.

GreenTeaFrapp · 05-16-2010, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joborule

Shouldn't people be renting then ahead of purchasing a game if it's going to be a game they don't want to play after a week? Therefore you don't spend too much money on a game you didn't end up enjoying much.

Renting? That's as evil as the resale market. You're supposed to buy all your games at full price and hold on to them until you die at which time they are burned to a crisp instead of being bequeathed to your heirs in your will.

wooohooo · 05-16-2010, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joborule

Shouldn't people be renting then ahead of purchasing a game if it's going to be a game they don't want to play after a week? Therefore you don't spend too much money on a game you didn't end up enjoying much.

I only play my xbox once every few weeks, but it's enough that it's worth owning the game. There are so many games out there that I don't think I could afford to buy them all new.

A lot of the times I'll borrow my friends games for a few weeks and if I like it enough, I'll buy it so I can play online with them. This anti-used thing is stupid. Not all of us are cash cows, some of us are poor starving students! Won't somebody think of the students????