GM is burying Pontiac

[FurnaceFace]

Agreed 4X4. I was recently talking about this very thing. GM nearly has the same number of cars the "big 3" Japanese makers have:

Buick 3
Cadillac 12
Chevy 17
GMC 8
Hummer 4
Pontaic 7
Saab 3
Saturn 5
Total ~59

Honda/Acura 16
Toyota/Lexus 27
Nissan/Infiniti 22
Total ~65

In the above counts I tried to exclude the variations of models that have sedan, coupe, convertible of the Saab 93, hybrid models of the cars, or 3 flavours of Sierra truck so depending on how you slice it your numbers might be higher, for example you could get GMC up to 17. That also doesn't include the other GM brands like Daewoo, Holden, or Opel sold outside of NA. Similarily the Japanese models don't include those models sold in Japan.

Sort of brings the point home that GM has gotten to the point it's too large to ensure a level of quality which people are expecting. Plus the various product lines have to be adding a certain level of confusion in the marketplace and a certain amount of canibalization amongst the divisions.

I'm all for them reducing their lines down to something more manageable...they've already nuked Oldsmobile so they might as well continue. Sad to see Pontiac go though as they were my Dad's model of choice so I grew up driving them and feel a bit nostalgic about the model...obviously not too nostalgic though since I own a Subaru.

They should just rebadge everything to "GM" and cherry pick the 20 or so most popular models from all the lines and focus on making them better. They could then augment those with the "specialty" cars like Corvette or Hummer and some luxury models which they know will sell well.

[Dion]

BUT most importantly, GM just doesn't make very good cars and trucks. In Consumer Reports' latest scorecard on automaker performance, the automaker ranked 14th out of 15, or next to last. Only Chrysler scored worse.

It is true that GM gets pulled down by some of its older models, Consumer Reports points out. But it's been making cars for 101 years. Shouldn't all its models be at least competitive?

No other car company that I know of expects to get a pass by brushing off its mistakes the way GM does. Can you imagine Toyota dissing its old Camrys and Corollas, and saying, "Wait until you see next year's model?"

For another thing, GM has also been pursuing a disastrously wrong-headed development policy on hybrids. While the automaker was working on systems for low-volume trucks and buses with no consumer visibility, Toyota and Honda were building popular-priced hybrids that average people could actually buy.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/03/11/auto...tune/index.htm

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by 4X4

Ditto Chrysler. Why do they sell all their Chrysler cars and minivans with two different names (Dodge)? They could just keep Dodge as their truck line, Chrysler as their car line and Jeep as their niche line.

Probably for the same reason why Best Buy and Future Shop are so close together. They want you comparison shopping between both of their products.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

http://www.canadatrader.com/result/d...calgaryalberta

20 grand. Righteous wheels.

LOL miled out and claiming to have a 400 BB (big block) even though the 400 was a small block V8.

[T@T]

Originally Posted by Table 5

still the best car graphics ever.

I owned that exact car, 1977 400-4sp, I even tried to grow the Burt mustache but I was too young Oh the memory's.

[Table 5]

Too bad they don't make t-tops on cars anymore. My brother had a great early 80's 280zx with t-tops, man was that a fun car. Why exactly did car makers take fun out of equation again?

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Too bad they don't make t-tops on cars anymore. My brother had a great early 80's 280zx with t-tops, man was that a fun car. Why did car makers take fun out of equation again?

T-Tops had a nasty habit of leaking.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by Dion

T-Tops had a nasty habit of leaking.

small price to pay for being awesome.

[RougeUnderoos]

http://www.canadatrader.com/result/d...calgaryalberta

What the hell? 69 Camaro for $4900. I don't mean to derail, but this thread got me on that autotrader site and here I am.

[habernac]

maybe they missed a zero? Or she's pissed at her hubby and is selling his car.

[Regulator75]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

http://www.canadatrader.com/result/d...calgaryalberta

What the hell? 69 Camaro for $4900. I don't mean to derail, but this thread got me on that autotrader site and here I am.

Probably has 1,800,000 Miles on it.

Or it's stolen.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Regulator75

Probably has 1,800,000 Miles on it.

Or it's stolen.

My bet it's a typo error and the price should have read $49,000.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by habernac

maybe they missed a zero? Or she's pissed at her hubby and is selling his car.

Ha, yeah, I thought of both of those things. There is another '69 there for 52 grand. But there's also a '68 for $5800.

There appear to be a lot of people in Alberta getting out of the vintage Camaro game.

[Kjesse]

It had to go. I loved Pontiac at one time (my first car was my then dream car, a new 1988 Pontiac Firebird Formula, just like the one below). But damn, that car developed a lot of problems fast, and was worth very little even 4 years after purchase. In fact, even off the lot it had deficiencies I didn't notice until a week later, and the car kept going back for fixes (i.e. the center console lights weren't plugged in). Still, love it for the memories:

[Buzzard]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

LOL miled out and claiming to have a 400 BB (big block) even though the 400 was a small block V8.

100,000 original miles for a 32 year old car is miled out?

Here was my first pontiac. What a sweet car it was. Damn I wish I was 20 again...but RESPONSIBLE this time!!

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I never understood why car companies want so many different brand names anyway.

Capture more market share, me thinks. Some people who didn't do their due dilligence might go "I hateeeeeeeeeee GM, but looooooooove Pontiac."

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Why exactly did car makers take fun out of equation again?

Not all cars have lost their fun component...

[Ironhorse]

Originally Posted by Table 5

still the best car graphics ever.

You forgot this one:

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Capture more market share, me thinks. Some people who didn't do their due dilligence might go "I hateeeeeeeeeee GM, but looooooooove Pontiac."

There was a chick last summer that told me almost that exact line, except she loved Saturn but would never ever buy a GM. Me and my buddy, who sells GM's, had a laugh.

[mikey_the_redneck]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

http://www.canadatrader.com/result/d...calgaryalberta

What the hell? 69 Camaro for $4900. I don't mean to derail, but this thread got me on that autotrader site and here I am.

On the right hand side of the page, it looks like more than $4900 is under the hood alone........