My first time to Europe - looking for some advice

[joe_mullen]

like everyone else has said, skip frankfurt at all costs...nothing there besides a massive airport.

as for spain, i would probably skip madrid unless you're going to see real madrid play, otherwise add some time to barcelona or go to sevilla instead.

agree with skipping milan altogether. venice can be done in 1 day, it is mass tourism at its worst but still worth seeing. florence and rome are both absolute musts. also, you can go to verona/assisi/siena as day trips from florence and pompei from rome.

also, i was personally somewhat disappointed with munich, i would recommend some combination of krakow/prague/budapest instead.

[csnarpy]

If your still going to Naples, then grab a hoverboat from the marina and go to the Island of Capri, this is an amazing "greekish" italian island with great food and history on both sides of the island. Go there, grab a scooter and venture the entire island for 4-6 hours.

Munich is incredibly amazing, even when its not oktoberfest. There is so much history in this city.

Barcelona is still one of my favorite city's overall and unlike most of spain, it is quite historical with amazing sites/sights.

You may also consider the south coast of France. Marseille is another great historical city and Nice is just a great little town. If you do goto Nice, go 20 minutes down the road to Monaco and see just how sickly rich some people can be. The cars alone there blow me away.

I lived in the Black Forest (Germany) for 3 years and I say, don't bother with Frankfurt unless your plane lands there. Nurnburg, Stuttgart and Dusseldorf are my favorites (albeit the are pretty far apart).

If you want to get into some good Canadian WW2 history then Nijmegan (Holland) is one of the best hands down.

One other little pointer, you want to see the most a country? then get a europass and hop on a train. It is by far the best way to explore europe, you can get off and on them at anytime and it doesn't take long to get from one country to another.

Hope you have fun!

[jammies]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

Again I will add in. I heard of this somewhere in Italy and when I went back to Paris someone actually tried to do it to me. So WATCH OUT!

Is it just me, or does this scam not make any sense? First of all, who keeps their fingers still while someone is trying to tie a string to them; secondly, why would I pay someone money because they can't untie said string?

I know it probably doesn't matter, but could one of you explain it a little better, 'cause right now it sounds like it'd be right up there in the Unsuccessful Scams Hall of Fame.

[Nancy]

Originally Posted by jammies

Is it just me, or does this scam not make any sense? First of all, who keeps their fingers still while someone is trying to try a string to them; secondly, why would I pay someone money because they can't untie said string?

I know it probably doesn't matter, but could one of you explain it a little better, 'cause right now it sounds like it'd be right up there in the Unsuccessful Scams Hall of Fame.

I'll admit, on paper, it sounds incredibly rediculous. But, when you are standing there, and your fingers are tied together and turning purple because the string has cut off your circulation, and someone is tickling you with a feather, I bet you'd cry "uncle" too. Of course, the stupid part was that I couldn't take my wallet out to pay the guy because my fingers were tied together, so when I told him to just take my wallet out of my pocket and help himself to the cash, the guy just totally lost it and started yelling me in french something about "what do you think I am, a pick-pocket?!?!" So, he just stormed off in a snit, leaving me sitting on the street corner begging people for help until some Australian backpacker chick finally stopped to help me. Worst night of my life.

[FurnaceFace]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Paris- It's awesome, but the hostels suck.

I'm surprised at this. I don't recall exactly which hostel we stayed in - and I freely admit this was 15 years ago - but it was pretty good. Super clean. It was near The Louvre as I remember going back to our (private) room and having a nap at lunch after a morning of Louvre-ing and then going back for the rest of the day. A great day in Paris that was.

It might have been this one http://www.bvj-hotel.com/youth_hostels_paris_france.htm which is also has a hostel in a great location in the Latin Quarter.

[redforever]

Originally Posted by kipperfan

I should clarify for all that I am spending 3 nights in Venice and only going to Milan as part of a day trip, I am not spending much time there at all.

If you are spending that amount of time in Venice, take a boat ride over to the island of Burano.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

I suggest checking out Munich. Awesome city, check out the Hofbräuhaus if you go.

Or go to Augustiner if you want better beer and to check out a place where the German's actually go

[Aeneas]

Seems like many people are attacking Milano and Frankfurt, thought I'd defend one. Frankfurt agreed, nothing to see compared with what else is available. Go to Heidleberg instead.

Don't know why you are going to Milan for the day trip but if you are going to see The Last Supper by Da Vinci, add to that a tour of the Duomo, followed by a walk through the Galleria Vittorio Emanuele then it is worth it.

That's what I did in a half day stop in Milan on my way from Lake Como to Cinque Terra. The Duomo can seat some 60000, but the most interesting part for me is that you can go up on the roof. That was very cool. I think we only spent 3 minutes inside as I knew going in that we were to see much more interesting cathedrals or churches in Venice Rome Florence and Siena. But how many marvelous Gothic Cathedrals can you walk out on the roof. Not just one small platform either. It was well worth it.

We even had time to see the Castle Sforza before we left. Don't know how far out of your way Milan is, but it was on my route and I did really want to see the Da Vinci work. I have seen a great deal of wonderful works of art but standing in front of The Last Supper was a special feeling.

The Galleria is a shopping mall essentially, but you'll not see a more beautiful one. Wouldn't go to Milan just to see it, however it is right next to the Duomo.

As a last note, I am glad you are sticking with Venice. Others may not like it, but I think it is outstanding. Be sure to just wander around. Of course tour the Doge's palace the artwork is fantastic. See the Duomo. Walk up the campanile (if its standing). Take boat rides. Walk the streets in the evening when few are about. If you like taking photos there will be interesting views constantly.

My apologies to those who suggest visiting a replica in China or Vegas...that's an awful idea. You would lose the reality, the history, the uniqueness (is that a word?) May work for some people, but I would not be interested in a fake. Like going to Disneyland to see castles instead of Bavaria.

My last two visits I have stayed at Lido di Jesolo, and then taken a boat to Venice. Though you can drive, take a train or bus there, I think it is magical to arrive by sea. Takes 45 mins or so from Lido di Jesolo (maybe more) but the beaches at Jesolo are terrific, and there are all kinds of restaurants, attractions accomodations stretching for some 26 kims along the adriatic north of the Venice lagoon.

[shermanator]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Or go to Augustiner if you want better beer and to check out a place where the German's actually go

Augustiner (the beer) is the best beer I've ever had.

[Howie_16]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Or go to Augustiner if you want better beer and to check out a place where the German's actually go

So true! I went to the Hofbräuhaus this summer with my wife and a German couple who had never been there. The girl working in the souvenier shop near the entrance was shocked to hear someone speaking German!

[evilcougar]

i've been to europe 3 times and have friends scattered around in a couple different countries. i agree with all italy comments. milan is boring. however, i HAVE been to venice, its pretty amazing. i have also seen the duomo in florence and st peters basilica in rome (climbed to the very top peak of that-amazing view of all of rome) however, i have to say that st. marks cathedral is absolutley beautiful as well. the really cool thing about venice is that its made up of thousands of tiny little islands which are bound together by bridges of all sizes, some bridges would be about the size of a coffee table. it's pretty awesome. obviously theres no such thing as motorized traffic, however, they still have "traffic rules" for walkers. its pretty much the same as driving. also, some of their streets are no wider than your shoulders. everywhere you look there are signs pointing to either piazza san marco (st marks square) or rialto bridge. a map in venice is pretty much a waste of time. you will get lost. but thats why theres signs pointing to st marks and rialto bridge. it's pretty awesome.
as for rome, I LOVE ROME. i had 3 of my family members live in rome for long periods of time and visited all of them when they were there in their different time frames...i still have not seen it all. it's an amazing city. the more time you can spend there the better.
also, i have climbed mount vesuvius. i gotta say, pompeii and mt vesuvius were the PERFECT day trip. you only need one day and it's not even a whole day. it was amazing. you can get guided tours as well if you want, and they will show you around pompeii and tell you what everything is and what it all means. and climbing that volcano that killed pompeii was so cool. you can look right into the crater and see hot spots etc.. still. it's pretty awesome and the view from the top of that volcano is absolutely gorgeous.
and i agree about naples. dirty, waste of time, armpit of italy. however, naples IS the place where i had the best pizza out of everywhere i've been in italy.
paris-gorgeous. i love that city as well. the hop on hop off buses in italy and paris might be useful to you if you're only there for a few days. someone said earlier, you could be there for 2 weeks and still not see everything. they're not lying.
also, barcelona is gorgeous. i was only there for a day when i was catching my cruise out of there, so, i unfortunatley didnt' get to see alot of it, but what i did see was awesome. the pickpocketers are brutal tho.
versailles is cool but as a day thing. not much to do there besides look around for a while. it is very beautiful tho.

[burn_baby_burn]

I was in Belgium and Holland last month with a day trip to Vimy Ridge. If your into war history Vimy Ridge is obviously a must. Very, very, moving and impressive. Not too far from Vimy Ridge is Ypres in Belgium with a very good WWI museum. Close to Ypres is the Canadian monument at St. Julien, Tyne Cot cemetery, Essex Farm (where John MacRae wrote, In Flanders Fields..) and numerous other memorials that I didn't get a chance to see.

Amsterdam was very cool. Unfortunately I only had one day there. Watch out for the bikes.

If your driving anywhere I would highly recommend GPS. The roads are not on a grid system like Western Canada. Where I was in Belgium and Holland was as flat as Saskatchewan. To make matters worse the sun never shines, or at least it didn't when I was there. So knowing which direction your going can be very challenging without good old GPS.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Aeneas

but the most interesting part for me is that you can go up on the roof. That was very cool. I think we only spent 3 minutes inside as I knew going in that we were to see much more interesting cathedrals or churches in Venice Rome Florence and Siena. But how many marvelous Gothic Cathedrals can you walk out on the roof. Not just one small platform either. It was well worth it.

I found that you can go up on the roof or up to the top of the spire/bell tower in pretty much every major religious building in Europe, so you might as well do it somewhere with an interesting view.

Agreed with the comments about getting lost in Venice. Usually all you can see is the buildings on the street you are walking on, and absolutely nothing in the distance so you are pretty guaranteed to get lost as the street gradually curves without you noticing.

[Aeneas]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

I found that you can go up on the roof or up to the top of the spire/bell tower in pretty much every major religious building in Europe, so you might as well do it somewhere with an interesting view.

Agreed with the comments about getting lost in Venice. Usually all you can see is the buildings on the street you are walking on, and absolutely nothing in the distance so you are pretty guaranteed to get lost as the street gradually curves without you noticing.

I know what you are saying, but I am not sure you know what I am saying.
I, too, have probably climbed up over 100 major religious or secular buildings in Europe for the view. Church spires, cathedral domes, bell towers, clock towers, castle turrets, keep towers, what have you.

Unless I was missing something, the only time I have ever been able to walk out onto the roof of something not flat like a keep tower, was in Milan. Not just climb up high to a small observation area, or to the highest but still roofed place, but wander over a great expanse to look at the architechtural features up close. Whether you find the view of Milan from there gratifying or not, the perspective offered is unique.

For photographs having that interesting gargoyle in the foreground for a change was interesting for me. That is the sole reason I decided to add Milan cathedral to my itinerary, because I had never heard of wandering around on a roof. Been to dozens of more interesting cathedrals in Europe, but not once was I let onto the roof.

It is a much different shape than say the Dom in Koln/Cologne. I think it would be very difficult to get about on the roof of that Dom. I climbed as high as you are allowed in Koln. While exhilerating and awesome in it's height; it is still not the same as being on the roof. Milan's cathdral is wide and long, leaving considerable "flat" area up top, behind the grand facade for the most part. So many nooks and crannies up there to entice the curious.

Maybe it is only interesting to me, but if the OP is going to Milan anyway, I just thought I'd give a few reasons to justify it.

[burn_baby_burn]

kipperfan, here is a thread I started about visiting Vimy Ridge before I headed there last month. Lots of good information about it and other WWI and WWII sites in France and Belgium from numerous posters here at CP.

http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=65345

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Aeneas

I know what you are saying, but I am not sure you know what I am saying.
I, too, have probably climbed up over 100 major religious or secular buildings in Europe for the view. Church spires, cathedral domes, bell towers, clock towers, castle turrets, keep towers, what have you.

Unless I was missing something, the only time I have ever been able to walk out onto the roof of something not flat like a keep tower, was in Milan. Not just climb up high to a small observation area, or to the highest but still roofed place, but wander over a great expanse to look at the architechtural features up close. Whether you find the view of Milan from there gratifying or not, the perspective offered is unique.

For photographs having that interesting gargoyle in the foreground for a change was interesting for me. That is the sole reason I decided to add Milan cathedral to my itinerary, because I had never heard of wandering around on a roof. Been to dozens of more interesting cathedrals in Europe, but not once was I let onto the roof.

It is a much different shape than say the Dom in Koln/Cologne. I think it would be very difficult to get about on the roof of that Dom. I climbed as high as you are allowed in Koln. While exhilerating and awesome in it's height; it is still not the same as being on the roof. Milan's cathdral is wide and long, leaving considerable "flat" area up top, behind the grand facade for the most part. So many nooks and crannies up there to entice the curious.

Maybe it is only interesting to me, but if the OP is going to Milan anyway, I just thought I'd give a few reasons to justify it.

Ahh, I see what you're saying. The only place I went that was like that was in Lisbon, and it was a pretty cool experience, although you wonder how long the roof something that old should hold up for when you're wandering around on it.

[Aeneas]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Ahh, I see what you're saying. The only place I went that was like that was in Lisbon, and it was a pretty cool experience, although you wonder how long the roof something that old should hold up for when you're wandering around on it.

You just have to trust arches and vaulting. I wasn't worried. Although I did wait until the tour bus of Sumo wrestlers walked about first.
Come to think of it, I think my friend made me walk in front everywhere...

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

Agreed. I think Rome, Florence, Pompeii/Hercalanium (sp?) are a must. My favourite part of Italy was Almafi Coast, but I don't know if that would be the same for everyone else.

Venice - I stopped by Venice and few months ago in between destinations, and it was a zoo. Packed, dirty, and quite possibly over 30 tour groups packed in one square. I remember staying at a sketchy hotel/hostel where the adjacent rooms had prostitutes entertaining clients and a new guy walking into their room every 30 minutes. Skip Venice, even the Venetien in Las Vegas or Macau will give you your fill if you need it. A more exotic Venice is Gongzhao in China, IMO.

Disagree on Venice... you don't need to spend more than a day there, but you should spend a day there. No need to stay at a hostel in Venice proper though. I stayed at a "campsite" in Mestre and it was awesome.

Naples, I think is getting beaten up on a bit too much as well. I didn't even go into the city proper other than the train station, but there's so much to do in the area. I spent four nights at a pretty good hostel called Fabric in a suburb called Portici. There were piles of rubble on the street, but I never felt threatened. There was plenty to do in the area over three days: Amalfi Coast (1 day), Capri (1 day), Pompeii/Ercolaneum (1 day combined). Cinque Terre (near Genoa) is a must though, and my personal opinion (though I know Phanuthier will probably disagree ) is that you can skip the Amalfi Coast if you do Cinque Terre.

[Mayer]

I figured I'd bump this thread instead of making a new one.

I'm leaving for Europe in a week. I'll be gone for a little over a month. As someone who is very interested in the history of the World Wars, I want to make sure I don't miss something.

I plan on seeing (in no particular order) Normandy, Dieppe, Vimy Ridge, Hitlers Eagles Nest, Berlin etc. Does anyone have any other recommendations?

I'd hate to miss a "must see".

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Mayer

I figured I'd bump this thread instead of making a new one.

I'm leaving for Europe in a week. I'll be gone for a little over a month. As someone who is very interested in the history of the World Wars, I want to make sure I don't miss something.

I plan on seeing (in no particular order) Normandy, Dieppe, Vimy Ridge, Hitlers Eagles Nest, Berlin etc. Does anyone have any other recommendations?

I'd hate to miss a "must see".

Last time in France we saw a very interesting war museum near Verdun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Verdun

http://www.ourstory.info/2/d/Bler/other/museums.html

UNDERGROUND CITADEL
Reconstruction-tour, unique in Europe, presenting the daily life of the French soldier in 15 scenes: trench warfare and the selection of the Unknown Soldier. Tour by miniature train

VERDUN BATTLEFIELDS
Open-air museum of 1916 near Verdun, from Avocourt to Les Eparges. Remains of fortifications, land heavily disturbed by shell-fire, craters, etc. Twelve signposted walks. Multilingual signs