Opinions on cars?

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by Flames in 07

Honda by miles. Even if they have similar sticker prices the Saturn will cost more the day you sell the vehicle off. Do some homework on how each car deppreciates, that is one of the most important costs of a car, and almost nobody factors that in.

Yeah I'm taking that into account. If I thought the Saturn had the same resale value as the civic I would have bought it already.

I'm trying to be realistic about it. Figuring that a civic that is about 6 yrs old with 100,000-140,000 will be worth around 10,000.

I imagine the Saturn will be worth about 3000 - 4000 less (just based on auto trader listings for 2002-2003 saturns vs 2002-2003 civics).
One problem with this comparison is that the I'm using the saturn ION which is not a very well rated car. At least from what I've read. The Astra gets good ratings, and the 2 door is also fully loaded with pretty much everything besides heated seats. Seriously there are only 3 or 4 options the 2 door doesn't come standard with.

Of course that depends on km driven as well and whether the astra really catches on etc. I have to put 2000 down on the honda right now to get payments close to the saturn (about 305). Plus I save the interest that I have to pay with the honda.

Still need another drive in each car, though it seems to be pretty even at first glance which is why I'm having trouble deciding.

Thanks everyone getting some very good input here, its greatly appreciated!! Keep it coming.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by DementedReality

actually:

550 x 48 months = 26,400
minus resale of 13,000 = 12,400

vs

12k + accumlated interest.

so on that front its identicle EXCEPT:

I was going by the numbers you made up, and even then the financing option was cheaper.
If we are talking real numbers, a four year old Jetta wouldn't even be valued at 13000. 2004 jettas average around 18K and they are almost 5 years old.

If you base on that more realistic valuation, finance costs would be $8400 total and you would have 18K resale in hand after 4 years.
Lease value would not even be close.

Anyway, I don't see much point in arguing with you about it, so I'll leave it at that. I have nothing against leases, and am actually looking at leasing myself, but saying leases are cheaper then financing is like saying the earth is flat.
I'm glad you're happy with your lease, but I hope no one in this thread is mislead and leases for the wrong reasons.

[DementedReality]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I was going by the numbers you made up, and even then the financing option was cheaper.
If we are talking real numbers, a four year old Jetta wouldn't even be valued at 13000. 2004 jettas average around 18K and they are almost 5 years old.

If you base on that more realistic valuation, finance costs would be $8400 total and you would have 18K resale in hand after 4 years.
Lease value would not even be close.

Anyway, I don't see much point in arguing with you about it, so I'll leave it at that. I have nothing against leases, and am actually looking at leasing myself, but saying leases are cheaper then financing is like saying the earth is flat.
I'm glad you're happy with your lease, but I hope no one in this thread is mislead and leases for the wrong reasons.

ok fair enough ... i will restate that then...

leasing makes more sense to me as I prefer to not tie up my cash in a hunk of metal.

its not always cheaper, that was too broad a statement on my part.

[OzSome]

Originally Posted by AFireInside

Hey everyone,

I posted about a motorcycle last week, but my car died on me, and I've decided to forget the motorcycle for now and look for a new vehicle.

I've driven a bunch of vehicles and I'm trying to narrow it down. I've decided on the Saturn astra 2 door, or the 2 door honda civic coupe.

Now here are the details. Payments end up being very close. With the saturn I have to put less money down to get a low payment as they give tons of rebates etc. So payments are the same but I put more down on the honda (not much but about $1000 more). Astra comes loaded with pretty much everything, plus $600 graduate rebate, and a $500 gas card. Honda comes with just a/c and a few other minor things and a $500 dollar graduate rebate..

Anyone have any opinions on either of these cars?? I should point out that the Astra isn't a typical saturn. Its actually an Opel Astra which is one of the best selling cars in Europe. The 2-door comes with sport suspension etc.

Any ideas? I honestly like both cars, but everyone keeps telling me the civic will have a higher resale value...

It is good to hear the Astra is not a typical Saturn because I will tell you flat out DO NOT BUY SATURN!! I bought a 2006 Saturn ION3 brand new and it gave me headache most of the time. I hate the rattling sound and I had problem with it after less than a year. They have to replace the ignition coil already because the car just wouldn't start when it gets to -1. It's just like the anti-theft thing kicks in. When you start the car, you don't hear the starter clicking or anything. I had to blow up at Saturn one morning because they keep telling me they don't know what is wrong with it. I gave them my key and left my car at the service place at Saturn and told them keep of overnight and find the damn problem. The next day I got a call saying they replaced the iginition coil and it's ready to be picked up.

[Bill Bumface]

Screw depreciation, cars aren't investments, they are toys. Get whatever one you liked better. If depreciation mattered you should be buying a 1990 corolla.

Leasing vs. buying completely depends on the rates. I know a very rich guy who needed a truck for his hobby ranch. He could have bought it for cash probably with what he was carrying in his wallet that day. The lease rate was something like 0.9% at the time, and the purchase rate was a little higher. So he leased it, grew his money a whole bunch in the meantime, and bought it out when he was done. Even if he was making a meager 5% on his investments he saved a lot of money over buying it straight up or financing it.

I leased my first couple cars for this reason, plus they were cars where I knew there was a good chance of brutal depreciation, and leases also protect you from this, the biggest advantage of leasing IMO. If the residual is $10,000 and the car is worth $13,000 at the end of your lease, great, buy it out, sell it, pocket $3000. If the car is worth $7000, sweet, give it back at the end of the lease and the dealer eats $3000.

My last car I decided I would buy one a couple years old and get a car I could never afford new. The finance division of the manufacturer just started offering 1.9% financing which was a really good deal, and in the past my model had always been an exception for the financing deals and was more like 7 or 8%, so it made no sense to lease when the rate would have been much higher, so I financed it over the longest term they offered for 0 down, as I can easily make more than 1.9% off my money while it's still in my grubby hands.

In conclusion:

ASTRA!!

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

Screw depreciation, cars aren't investments, they are toys. Get whatever one you liked better. If depreciation mattered you should be buying a 1990 corolla.

Leasing vs. buying completely depends on the rates. I know a very rich guy who needed a truck for his hobby ranch. He could have bought it for cash probably with what he was carrying in his wallet that day. The lease rate was something like 0.9% at the time, and the purchase rate was a little higher. So he leased it, grew his money a whole bunch in the meantime, and bought it out when he was done. Even if he was making a meager 5% on his investments he saved a lot of money over buying it straight up or financing it.

I leased my first couple cars for this reason, plus they were cars where I knew there was a good chance of brutal depreciation, and leases also protect you from this, the biggest advantage of leasing IMO. If the residual is $10,000 and the car is worth $13,000 at the end of your lease, great, buy it out, sell it, pocket $3000. If the car is worth $7000, sweet, give it back at the end of the lease and the dealer eats $3000.

My last car I decided I would buy one a couple years old and get a car I could never afford new. The finance division of the manufacturer just started offering 1.9% financing which was a really good deal, and in the past my model had always been an exception for the financing deals and was more like 7 or 8%, so it made no sense to lease when the rate would have been much higher, so I financed it over the longest term they offered for 0 down, as I can easily make more than 1.9% off my money while it's still in my grubby hands.

In conclusion:

ASTRA!!

haha, at this point I am heavily leaning towards the saturn as its much more car for the buck. BUT I will be driving each one again this week.

While I'm at it, since I've gotten into a higher price range, I may also test out a kia magentis or spectra5, and or a hyundai elantra. Initially I started out looking for a cheaper car, but found I did not fit very well in the small cheaper cars (I'm 6'3). I know little to nothing about kia's but the magentis isnt a bad looking car.

Any opinions on KIA's? Hyundai's? I do know they have a better warranty.. 5 years as opposed to 3. Powertrain warranty is the same though.

[automaton 3]

Looks like GM and Chrysler are getting out of the leasing game:

http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=680397

IMO leasing vs. buying should be taken case by case...as hulkrogan pointed out above.

My current truck I leased because the lease rate was very attractive at 0.9%

When it is time for a buyout, you buy it out if it has been a good vehicle and the buyout is roughly equivalent or less than the current market value.

If the buyout exceeds the current market value, give it back and thank your lucky stars you leased.

My current leased truck (like most trucks) has plummeted in resale value over the last year or so, to the point that the buyout will exceed current market price by $5000+. I do like the truck, but I'll for sure give this one back, and look into buying one just like it and be $5K to the good.

[Bill Bumface]

^ I saw a brand new Silverado selling for $28,000 in Kelowna. Ridiculous. You'll be laughing when you turn in your lease and buy something else after.

[DementedReality]

Originally Posted by automaton 3

Looks like GM and Chrysler are getting out of the leasing game:

http://www.financialpost.com/story.html?id=680397

the link doesnt work, but if leasing was such a bad thing for the customer, GM and Chrysler wouldnt be getting out. They must be gettin out because its costing them their shirts!

Originally Posted by automaton 3

When it is time for a buyout, you buy it out if it has been a good vehicle and the buyout is roughly equivalent or less than the current market value.

If the buyout exceeds the current market value, give it back and thank your lucky stars you leased.

exactly, its like a 4 year test drive. also if its a lemon, you dont own it. if it was in a bad accident, but rebuilt, you dont own it. remember you have to declare that accident when you sell it, most certainly bringing the value down.

Originally Posted by automaton 3

My current leased truck (like most trucks) has plummeted in resale value over the last year or so, to the point that the buyout will exceed current market price by $5000+. I do like the truck, but I'll for sure give this one back, and look into buying one just like it and be $5K to the good.

another great reason to lease a vehicle. almost all the risk is taken out of the equation and you preserve your cash flow.

i agree there will be cases that could be made for buying, but from my experiance leasing is almost always the better choice (for me).

[AFireInside]

Hey thanks for all the posts everyone.

Yesterday I picked up my new ASTRA!

[3 Justin 3]

Originally Posted by AFireInside

Hey thanks for all the posts everyone.

Yesterday I picked up my new ASTRA!

Colour?

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by 3 Justin 3

Colour?

black

[FFR]

I picked up my new Astra on Wednesday night. I love it! Handling is fantastic!