New Patriots spy allegations: Pats employee filmed Rams before Superbowl XXXVI.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by troutman

Careful what you wish for witch-hunters.

You are going to find out that every team does this. Even the precious Chiefs.

I agree stealing signals is a widespread practice that has been going on for ages. George Allen used to be paranoid of construction workers and ground maintenance crews, thinking it was spies in disguise. If all the Patriots are guilty of is stealing signals? Why the biggest fine and penalty in NFL history? Why all the cloak and dagger stuff (destroying video tapes, the fast cover up)by the league? I don't care which team it was. I'm just really curious about what the NFL knows. If it is no big deal? Why were they so quick to cover it up?

I did bold the quote where Goodell said they had already looked into the allegations and found nothing credible. I'm not out on a witch hunt against the Patriots. I'm just a huge NFL fan starved for football right now. This is the biggest story until the Scouting Combine starts on the 23rd.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by burn_baby_burn

I agree stealing signals is a widespread practice that has been going on for ages. George Allen used to be paranoid of construction workers and ground maintenance crews, thinking it was spies in disguise. If all the Patriots are guilty of is stealing signals? Why the biggest fine and penalty in NFL history? Why all the cloak and dagger stuff (destroying video tapes, the fast cover up)by the league? I don't care which team it was. I'm just really curious about what the NFL knows. If it is no big deal? Why were they so quick to cover it up?

I did bold the quote where Goodell said they had already looked into the allegations and found nothing credible. I'm not out on a witch hunt against the Patriots. I'm just a huge NFL fan starved for football right now. This is the biggest story until the Scouting Combine starts on the 23rd.

Good post.

I have even heard of signal stealing monkey business in the CFL.

[burn_baby_burn]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3242944

NEW YORK -- NFL commissioner Roger Goodell and Sen. Arlen Specter are to meet Wednesday to discuss the Spygate case involving the New England Patriots.

Obviously Specter is using the Spygate scandal as an opportunity for some political grandstanding. I would imagine that Mr. Specter will push the NFL to interview former Patriots Video Assistant Matt Walsh. Other than that not sure how far the Senator wants to push the issue.

[burn_baby_burn]

Doesn't sound like much was accomplished in Goodell's meeting with Senator Arlen Specter yesterday.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3244687

A league official clarified to ESPN's Chris Mortensen that the NFL's current proposal to Patriots video assistant Matt Walsh includes a legal guarantee that he will not be sued by the league or the Patriots for any information or material he would provide to the NFL.
As Goodell said, the proposal stipulates that Walsh must be truthful and return anything he took improperly.
Walsh has had no response, according to Goodell.
Walsh told The Associated Press last week during the Pro Bowl in Hawaii that he couldn't talk about allegations that he taped a walkthrough practice by the St. Louis Rams before the 2002 Super Bowl. New England, a two-touchdown underdog, won that game 20-17.
Specter said he, too, wanted to talk to Walsh and perhaps offer a different deal.
Goodell also said he reserves the right to reopen the investigation if more information is uncovered.

[burn_baby_burn]

Specter does not appear to be satisfied with Goodell's explanation of the league's handling of the Spygate investigation.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3246788

Among the issues that continue to trouble Specter are:


• Goodell's imposition of a penalty -- the loss of a first-round draft pick, a $500,000 fine to coach Bill Belichick and a $250,000 to the team -- before the Patriots had turned over evidence, including notes dating to 2002 and six tapes from the 2006 season and 2007 preseason, requested by the league. The Patriots were caught videotaping defensive signals from the sidelines in their Sept. 9 season opener against the New York Jets. The commissioner imposed his penalty on Sept. 13, four days before New England provided the tapes and notes.

"Did they know the scope of the wrongdoing before the penalty was imposed?" asked Specter, a former Philadelphia district attorney. "The answer is no."

I must have missed this before. Didn't realize the penalty had been handed out before the taps were handed over to the league.

• Specter said it was unsettling to learn that the tapes, as well as notes, turned over by the Patriots in September had been destroyed in Foxboro rather than in the league's New York offices. Aiello said the documents and tapes were destroyed after they were reviewed by NFL officials Jeffrey Pash and Ray Anderson, and that the call to destroy the material came from Goodell, saying "There's no further use for it, so he said get rid of it."

A question I have about tapes. Don't most NFL team video departments(or athletic video tape department) keep everything on computer hard drives anyways? They can customize DVDs for players and coaches to watch game film on their laptops.

• Specter is particularly concerned about how the taping might have affected New England's games involving teams from his home state in the 2004 playoffs.


In a preseason opener in August of that year at Gillette Stadium in Foxboro, the Patriots and the Philadelphia Eagles played in what proved to be a preview of the 2005 Super Bowl, won by the Patriots 24-21. And in an Oct. 31 regular-season game in Pittsburgh, the Steelers beat the Patriots 34-20. Those two teams later met in the AFC title game, which New England won, 41-27.

Later Thursday, the Steelers released a statement that read: "We consider the tapes of our coaching staff during our games against the New England Patriots to be a non-issue. In our opinion, they had no impact on the results of those games. The Steelers fully support the manner in which Commissioner Goodell handled the situation and the discipline that he levied against those who violated league rules. We are confident that the Commissioner has taken appropriate action in his investigation of this matter, and will do so again if new information arises which requires further investigation and or discipline."

• Specter believes the NFL hasn't gone far enough in its offer of legal protection to former Patriots video assistant Matt Walsh, who has told ESPN.com that he has potentially embarrassing information about the team's taping practices.

Thats news to me I thought Walsh had been silent since the story broke before the Super Bowl.

• Specter said he was concerned to learn from Walsh's attorney that an NFL security representative, Dick Farley, had been investigating Walsh. Specter said: "I confronted them on that, and Goodell says, 'Yeah, he [Farley] works for us. Yeah, he is a security guy, but we didn't know he was investigating him.' "

[fredr123]

According to the Wall Street Journal Law Blog:

Lawyers for a former St. Louis Ram, Willie Gary, and others filed a complaint today against the New England Patriots and the Patriots’ coach, Bill Belichick... The suit, a putative class action filed in federal court in Louisiana, seeks more than $100 million (that’s not a typo) for alleged “fraudulent videotaping” of the Rams walk-through practice prior to the 2002 Super Bowl. In addition to Gary, the putative plaintiffs are ticket purchasers and the 72,922 attendees of the Super Bowl.

A copy of the complaint is available from the WSJLB.

The suit was filed by four plaintiffs and on behalf of those similarly situation: a former Rams player/employee who was on the roster for Super Bowl XXXVI, two fans who purchased tickets to Super Bowl XXXVI and attended the game, and a Rams season ticket holder.

Interestingly, the complaint alleges at paragraph 84 that it's a material condition to the purchase of the tickets that the participants in the game will play honestly and according to the agreed rules and conditions of the game. If that is indeed the case, then you can foresee a flood of similar complaints from anyone who may have attended an MLB game in the past decade or so.

And there are allegations of breaches under the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organization (RICO) Act.

[Azure]

Does the US Senate not have anything better to do?

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by Azure

Does the US Senate not have anything better to do?

While I agree with you in this particular instance, fred's article has nothing to do with the Senate.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by rubecube

While I agree with you in this particular instance, fred's article has nothing to do with the Senate.

Well Gary should shutup.

Poor loser.

My point still stands though....the US Senate should find a better way to waste their time.

[habernac]

didn't see this posted. Vehement denial from Belichick:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3251081

[burn_baby_burn]

The allegations are all speculation anyway. Specter is just grandstanding for the exposure. Until Walsh or some other credible witness actually testifies, it should be assumed that the video taping allegations of the Rams walk through practice prior to the Super Bowl are simply rumors.

[Azure]

The Pats should counter-sue.

[burn_baby_burn]

Sounds like the NFL might actually bend and offer Matt Walsh full legal protection.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3255287

NFL commissioner Roger Goodell hopes the NFL is close to an agreement that will allow former New England Patriots employee Matt Walsh to tell the league about the tapes he is said to have made of the St. Louis Rams' walk-through before the 2002 Super Bowl.
"The lawyers are still talking and we're anxious to speak to him. We're anxious to get an agreement to get him to come forth," Goodell told the Associated Press on Wednesday before the start of the NFL combine.
"We hope to be able to talk to him shortly."

NFL lawyers have been meeting with Michael Levy, Walsh's Washington-based lawyer, who is seeking further protection for his client if he tells what he knows.
Levy said last week that the NFL's offer of protection "is highly conditional and still leaves Mr. Walsh vulnerable. I have asked the NFL to provide Mr. Walsh with the necessary legal protections so that he can come forward with the truth without fear of retaliation and litigation."

Personally I'm kind of skeptical that this guy will actually have any relevant new evidence. Could just be a case of a disgruntled former employee who was waiting to embarrass his former employer.

[habernac]

Specter sounds like a total clown. Of course people will be directing you to go through their legal teams.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3259486

[fredr123]

http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports...25chnotes.html

Allegations have surfaced that the Broncos were taping Chargers practices years ago. It only says that security was beefed up, and the team was aware of spies, from as early as 2003 so Elway's legacy is safe... for now.

[corporatejay]

I think i've been saying this since the get-go.

EVERYONE DOES THIS!!! I'm sure it even happens in High School

[CrispyGriz]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

I think i've been saying this since the get-go.

EVERYONE DOES THIS!!! I'm sure it even happens in High School

I know for a fact it does. Someone from St. Francis stole a play book from the wise wood practice field when i was in High school.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

I think i've been saying this since the get-go.

EVERYONE DOES THIS!!! I'm sure it even happens in High School

I wouldn't say everyone does it. The Patriots and Bill Belichek have denied taping any teams practices or walk through practices.

Personally I think Specter is just looking for exposure. Its obviously working because I'm sure most of us had never heard of the guy before. The NFL and Roger Godell have stated numerous times that they have investigated everything and feel that the case is closed, unless new evidence is brought forward. Dan Rooney stated that he felt that the video taping by the Patriots of the Patriots vs Steelers regular season game, had no impact on the playoff game in 2004. Members of the NFL Competition Committee made it clear to the media (or the NFL Network) that the Commissioner and the League did a very thorough job of investigating.

To play devils advocate to all that. It is in the best interest of the NFL, all 32 NFL teams, and the NFLPA that the issue goes away. True or not (I'm not saying the allegations are true because I really don't know one way or the other) the league does not want Specter to challenge the NFL's Legal Exemption. Not that I think it will go that far, but it is the single biggest reason for the financial success of the NFL and all its teams including the players.

[fredr123]

Phil Spector is a total attention whore. Just look at that hairdo. I'm not sure what interest he has in these NFL dealings anyway.

You gotta wonder though, if stealing signals and whatnot is as widespread as many say, how Mangini, the Jets and others who complained about such practices are fairing in relations with other organizations in the NFL. If everyone's doing it, you just deal with it, man. No complaining to the media. No offering to come forward with juicy revelations for the right price. Just deal with it internally and STFU.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by fredr123

You gotta wonder though, if stealing signals and whatnot is as widespread as many say, how Mangini, the Jets and others who complained about such practices are fairing in relations with other organizations in the NFL. If everyone's doing it, you just deal with it, man. No complaining to the media. No offering to come forward with juicy revelations for the right price. Just deal with it internally and STFU.

I don't think the Jets did complain to the media, did they? If they did I missed it. Of course the media will jump all over a story like this. None the less the current issue at hand is not about the stealing of signals anyways. Belichek admitted to Godell that he had been video taping opposing teams defensive signals since he started coaching the Patriots. He thought he was operating within the rules. Godell disagreed and gave the biggest penalty in NFL history. Case Closed.

The revelations or rumors, broke by the Boston Herald mind you, are actually about sneaking in and video taping closed practices. Which is against league rules. Right now that is simply a rumor and should be treated as such.